MAFIA 43 - GAME THREAD

[flash2015]

It depends. If nobody else claims conservative then it's probably better to lynch in the other pile since we will have five guaranteed town here. Let's wait to hear everyone's claim before deciding which pile has more scum in it.

Just confirming - in your plan is dup conservative or non-conservative? I ask because Squiggs threw in some confusion here.

I don't understand the question. What do I think they should claim? Why do you want me to give advice to the Mafia?

No, I am not asking you to give advice for Mafia. I am asking you to clarify your plan. If DUP is included in conservatives then we have (which is what I thought was the plan):

11 conservatives
10 non-conservatives

If we don't we have 10 conservatives and 11 non-conservatives (which is what Squiggs said).

If everyone claims, clarifying this is important for knowing whether someone lied or not.

[xorxes]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

I like this attorney guy.

[Vaporwave]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

so I should not question people's remarks? are you actually assuming there is no mafia wanting to paint townies as scum?

[rdrivera2005]

all the people that I'm adressing are ignoring me
No seriously I want fox and vecnas thoughts on flash

Well, my read on Flash (if you are interested) is he is acting weirdly. Not because he didn't vote bb (he can be tired of the same joke), but because he has jumped fast on real votes. Other games he was hedgy and didn't push votes this way. Considering he was never scum (as far as I remember) can't say it's scum meta, but something to keep an eye.

[Attorney]

Attorney: I have not claimed anything yet.

Have we actually confirmed that your list of conservatives claims is oversubscribed?

kk
it isn't conf over subscribed but p close
so basically there are 6 town conservatives
6 people have claimed conservative
so it is extremely likely there are liars
and if there is another person who is conservative but unclaimed then there is conf at least 1 w in there

[rdrivera2005]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

I like this attorney guy.

Why? I find this logic bullshit. I have seen town act this exactly same way when accused so many times and get myslinched with bad arguments like this: "you want to defend yourself you must be scum".

[xorxes]

Just confirming - in your plan is dup conservative or non-conservative? I ask because Squiggs threw in some confusion here.

I don't understand the question. What do I think they should claim? Why do you want me to give advice to the Mafia?

No, I am not asking you to give advice for Mafia. I am asking you to clarify your plan. If DUP is included in conservatives then we have (which is what I thought was the plan):

11 conservatives
10 non-conservatives

If we don't we have 10 conservatives and 11 non-conservatives (which is what Squiggs said).

If everyone claims, clarifying this is important for knowing whether someone lied or not.

DUP is just like any other Mafia, except if they are party-scanned they are outed no matter what they have claimed.

[Attorney]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

so I should not question people's remarks? are you actually assuming there is no mafia wanting to paint townies as scum?

i am not
is that a slip
hmmmm

[xorxes]

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

I like this attorney guy.

Why? I find this logic bullshit. I have seen town act this exactly same way when accused so many times and get myslinched with bad arguments like this: "you want to defend yourself you must be scum".

I like him because he's being talkative. He will eventually slip if he's scum.

[Vaporwave]

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

so I should not question people's remarks? are you actually assuming there is no mafia wanting to paint townies as scum?

i am not
is that a slip
hmmmm

there's nothing more scummier than you wanting to hammer so quickly into D1

[flash2015]

I don't understand the question. What do I think they should claim? Why do you want me to give advice to the Mafia?

No, I am not asking you to give advice for Mafia. I am asking you to clarify your plan. If DUP is included in conservatives then we have (which is what I thought was the plan):

11 conservatives
10 non-conservatives

If we don't we have 10 conservatives and 11 non-conservatives (which is what Squiggs said).

If everyone claims, clarifying this is important for knowing whether someone lied or not.

DUP is just like any other Mafia, except if they are party-scanned they are outed no matter what they have claimed.

True, but depending on which variant we go with, it may influence which pile the party cop looks in to find the DUP.

In the unlikely event no-one lies about party affiliation - If we go with what I thought, the party cop looks in the conservative pile for the DUP. If we go with what Squiggs says, we look in the non-conservative pile.

[Foxcastle]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

[Attorney]

this for example is scummy
this is the classic mafia defense, power negotiation
usually, when someone says a wolf is scummy then the wolf just strongly says, prove it.
or
explain.
I've seen this countless times while playing mafia in wolves and sk alike.

I like this attorney guy.

Why? I find this logic bullshit. I have seen town act this exactly same way when accused so many times and get myslinched with bad arguments like this: "you want to defend yourself you must be scum".

Everyone wants to defend themself.
But the way vapors defense is playing out, like that one, two-liner defense just doesn't come from town
it just clear-as-day doesn't

[Percy Williams]

I found a minor flaw in my plan: If every town (except for the Party Cop) is required to tell the truth, then at the end of the day scum will know if the PC has lied or not, and so they will know in which side of the house they have to look for them.

Fortunately there's an easy fix: Only conservative townies (other than the PC) are required to be truthful. Most non-conservatives should also be truthful (so as not to add noise into the scumpool) but one or two should probably lie and say they're conservatives, as that helps protect the valuable PC. This way scum don't know where to look for the PC, because they don't know if they lied or not.

Non-conservatives claiming conservative doesn't affect the reliability of the PC's scans. They scan in the non-conservative pool and if they get conservative (or DUP) it's a guilty and if they get anything else it's a clear.

This is a terrible idea. It gives the Mafia an excuse to lie, and undermines the entire exercise. This would only work IF we are certainly lynching from the non-conservative group, AND no mafia lies using the excuse Xorxes gives them.

[Attorney]

so I should not question people's remarks? are you actually assuming there is no mafia wanting to paint townies as scum?

i am not
is that a slip
hmmmm

there's nothing more scummier than you wanting to hammer so quickly into D1

I didn't want to hammer.

[Vaporwave]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

My 1st vote on Xorxes was not real
I did specify it was done IN JEST

I switched to Durga because I disliked her 'yikes' reply to one of my post, there's nothing more to that.

There was no pressure vote, you're pulling stuff out of your butt.

I was being honest in wanting to hear people's thought on Xorxes and not just give in to his command.

A scum would simly NOT POST anything than make himself suspicious by openly doubting a plan that favors town.

You have no clue why I hesistated, I have my own reasons.

[xorxes]

No, I am not asking you to give advice for Mafia. I am asking you to clarify your plan. If DUP is included in conservatives then we have (which is what I thought was the plan):

11 conservatives
10 non-conservatives

If we don't we have 10 conservatives and 11 non-conservatives (which is what Squiggs said).

If everyone claims, clarifying this is important for knowing whether someone lied or not.

DUP is just like any other Mafia, except if they are party-scanned they are outed no matter what they have claimed.

True, but depending on which variant we go with, it may influence which pile the party cop looks in to find the DUP.

In the unlikely event no-one lies about party affiliation - If we go with what I thought, the party cop looks in the conservative pile for the DUP. If we go with what Squiggs says, we look in the non-conservative pile.

So you want us to tell DUP what the Party Cop will do so they know what their best claim is? I'm still not sure what you're asking.

[Vaporwave]

do y'all think we should do the end hammer soon or no
imo the game is moving slow and we need a flip sometime soon

then what is this post, Attorney?

[Attorney]

explain what's scummy

quote a post and say why

Your first vote on Xorxes was trying to draw a connection between his alignment in a previous game, which has no bearing on this one. And then you did it again.

Your switch to Durga was weird and unjustified, like you noticed you weren't getting traction on Xorxes and wanted to move your vote so it wouldn't draw attention. You tried to make it look like you were pressure voting, but were unconvincing, in no small part because it looks opportunistic rather than pressure.

You initially liked Xorxes' plan, but then pushed back against it because you wanted consensus and then because you thought it was happening too fast and then because Xorxes is just some rando making demands. To me, that looks like scum being afraid that Xorxes plan will work and so trying to both avoid claiming and tank the plan at the same time.

You are grasping at straws rather than making any real analysis.

After clicking on all of foxcastles links, this further solidifies my scumread on vapor.
I hadn't looked at the full game yet but this feels like vapor is scum.
I'm gonna look at percy meta, I'm thinking he might be wolf.
##VOTE Vaporwave

[Vaporwave]

Also me commenting on Xorxes and making a comparison on how he behaved in that game and now is using an example, a past experience. A thing that ALL of you do to each other, how is that scummy?