Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

[damian]

I'm starting to feel a Bozo lynch. Unwillingness to provide information. Unwillingness to scum hunt. It all looks like scum to me. Especially if Vecna is right about Bozo's meta.
##Vote Bozo

[ND]

@damian:. To answer your question, I don't know. I think it would be really situational though. Maybe their opinion on a hypothetical statement or something. Probably wouldn't get everyone to answer either. Tangible thoughts based on a hypothetical statement I think would be more valuable than 'hey guys color plz' it's a crude paraphrase, but you get my drift.

[Foxcastle]

@Foxcastle. If you could know the alignment of one other player this game would do you think would be the most useful player's alignment to know?

Probably Xorxes, Ghug, or Vecna. They have always been hard for me to read, but beyond scanning for scum, they're also good at gamesolving, so helpful to know either way. And possibly add Tom to that list.

[Fluminator]

Someone want to explain the Squig wagon to me?
He’s looked pretty town to me thus far.

I’m not really buying the low effort vote argument. Considering the pressure vote for bozo got him to engage. (Possibly suspicious, given that Bozo doesn’t have the desire/time to look at anyone else.)

I can’t help but disagree with your assessment of Ezio. This is exactly what he looked like in the game I played with him as town. I’ve never actually seen his scum play. So I’m hesitant to read too far into the meta, but seems NAI to me.

Had a chance to a bit of rereading this morning. I’m starting to see what other people are talking about when it comes to Squigs. The inquisitiveness feels forced, and there are votes, like the one for bozo that don’t match up.

##vote Squigs

Damian, can you tell me how his bozo vote didn't line up when earlier you were specifically okay with that vote?

[bozotheclown]

@Bozo. Why?


@Vecna. Since Bozo didn't answer you have have his question if you could ask three players a question and they had to answer honestly. Who would you want to ask, and what would you ask?

@Rdriveria. If you could give a gun to someone this phase (and only this phase). Would you give it out? If so who would you give it to?

@Xorxes. If someone handed you a gun this phase, and you had to use it immediately or it vanished. Would you shoot? If so who?

@ND. If you could choose a question that everyone in the game had to answer, that wasn't about alignment. What would it be?

@Foxcastle. If you could know the alignment of one other player this game would do you think would be the most useful player's alignment to know?

It is too general a question to be useful.

[damian]

I feel that Squig's play has been primarily question driven. He described it as trying to build up a baseline for people so he'd have a better grasp when he tried to push harder questions. Voting someone immediately for throwing down the no-lynch doesn't seem in line with that philosophy. I'd expect him to have tried the interrogative route first and then switched to a pressure vote if that failed.

In contrast I think that throwing down the idea of a no-lynch into a game where we have no idea about the capabilities of the scum team is exceptionally dangerous, and all round poor play. I have no issue voting against poor town play. I think its usually scum indicative.

[bozotheclown]

I've heard engineers are really great people.
What's your opinion on the formation of the squiggs wagon? Do you like the company you're with on it?

I do not see any reason to scum read them, if that is what you mean. It looks like ghug was the first vote on Squigs, I am OK with that. I think it was Balki who recently pointed out that voting with ghug day 1 is a good bet, because if he is twon he has as good as chance as anyone of being correct, but if he is scum he will usually bus day 1.

[rdrivera2005]

@Bozo. Why?


@Vecna. Since Bozo didn't answer you have have his question if you could ask three players a question and they had to answer honestly. Who would you want to ask, and what would you ask?

@Rdriveria. If you could give a gun to someone this phase (and only this phase). Would you give it out? If so who would you give it to?

@Xorxes. If someone handed you a gun this phase, and you had to use it immediately or it vanished. Would you shoot? If so who?

@ND. If you could choose a question that everyone in the game had to answer, that wasn't about alignment. What would it be?

@Foxcastle. If you could know the alignment of one other player this game would do you think would be the most useful player's alignment to know?

Ok, I will play your game.

I would probably give the gun as it could get us some info. Considering we don't have any clears I will give the gun to someone I don't have a read yet, but that I consider a good player, like Xorxes or Tom, as other then they possibly hitting scum I can also get info from the shooter.

[bozotheclown]

I feel that Squig's play has been primarily question driven. He described it as trying to build up a baseline for people so he'd have a better grasp when he tried to push harder questions. Voting someone immediately for throwing down the no-lynch doesn't seem in line with that philosophy. I'd expect him to have tried the interrogative route first and then switched to a pressure vote if that failed.

In contrast I think that throwing down the idea of a no-lynch into a game where we have no idea about the capabilities of the scum team is exceptionally dangerous, and all round poor play. I have no issue voting against poor town play. I think its usually scum indicative.

There is no way a no lynch would be "exceptionally dangerous", whether you agree with it or not.

[Foxcastle]

Foxcastle Fun Fact: I will on mobile at EOD at an office Christmas party. I may not be able to give more than basic answers, and don't expect to be able to do any last minute vote switching.

[damian]

We have no idea what scum can do. For all we know they could have the ability to make multiple kills. Which would dramatically reduce our margin for error.

Also. You don't think there is any reason to scum read Squig but you're comfortable voting them anyways because it lets you sheep ghug. You also won't give us any scum reads of your own.

[Tom Bombadil]

I think Damian is probably town

[Durga]

VOTE COUNT
Squigs44 (4) ghug, Tom Bombadil, bozotheclown, ND
damian (2) xorxes, Ezio
bozotheclown (2) Squigs44, damian
Ezio (2) rdrivera2005, Foxcastle
Tom Bombadil (1) Fluminator
Foxcastle (1) Balki Bartokomous
rdrivera2005 (1) Vecna

There is time.

[ghug]

I'm not going to be around much the rest of the day.

What does flum think?

[bozotheclown]

We have no idea what scum can do. For all we know they could have the ability to make multiple kills. Which would dramatically reduce our margin for error.

Also. You don't think there is any reason to scum read Squig but you're comfortable voting them anyways because it lets you sheep ghug. You also won't give us any scum reads of your own.

I did not say I don't scum read Squigs, I was answering a specific question from Fluminator about how the Squigs wagon formed.

Here are some scum reads for you:

Squigs: Placed an easy "pressure" vote for low activity and no lynch suggestion. Falling back on me being scum in M40 as an argument.

damian: Misrepresenting my comments about ghug, trying to get a counter wagon to Squigs going after voting for Squigs.

Are you going to scum read me now for scum reading my entire wagon?

[damian]

Yeah I misread what you said. I thought you were talking about Squig rather than company with you on the Squig wagon.

Ultimately though, having the entirely of your scum reads be OMGUS is pretty lame. But I was already scum reading you for playing a reactive game and being closed off with information. So its not like it really effects my read on you. So why even worry about that?

[ghug]

Is OMGUS scummy? Why or why not?

[Squigs44]

Squigs: Placed an easy "pressure" vote for low activity and no lynch suggestion. Falling back on me being scum in M40 as an argument.

This is a misrepresentation of my push on you. It's not your low activity I find scummy, it's your lack of engagement this game. You are posting without interacting. You have made multiple posts saying I'm not going to post about that. A certain Ron Swanson quote comes to mind:
"When given the option of doing something or nothing, I generally choose to do nothing, unless it is to help someone else do nothing. I would work all night if it meant nothing got done."

I also find it interesting that I am the one making the easy vote, when your only two scum reads are the top two scumread people in the game.

[damian]

I'm inclined to thing OMGUS is NAI.
When people feel attacked they tend to think badly of the people they feel are attacking them. I think that's true regardless of what role someone has.

Its a psychological trap though. So its not good play.

[Vecna]

I disagree with Vecna’s analysis above. He is suggesting that rdrivera should be voting to protect a townread wagon at an early stage when the townread is in no real danger. And Vecna suggests that rdrivera’s failure to vote Damian is so strange that it is scum indicative.

I also feel like the way Vecna phrases the last sentence is somewhat scum-indicative for Vecna: “And youre calling me bad for scumreading you.” The statement assumes AI without explaining it and the statement focuses on Vecna’s own alignment.

Yeah, this was also the sort of reaction I was expecting to receive from (town) Rdrivera, since I honestly dont think ive done -anything- worth townreading so far this game. Instead, he somehow thinks he can read me already (one of two people), and that my mediocre attack of him is just me being bad and unreasonable town.

The real reason for being suspicious of the Rdrivera slot is that there so far have been very few genuine responses from him. This instance just further makes me think that it is quite likely he is a baddy.

I townread read you because of style. You posted a bunch of messages reacting to posts and this is what I remember you doing as town in our last games together.

Which is also by far the easiest playstyle to fake as scum.