WebMafia Olympics - Game #2 - Star Trek TNG: The Republic of Q [GAME THREAD]

[FlaviusAetius]

geez, describing it like that, who would be suspicious


yea. His recent reads pivot is clearly just him manufacturing a worldview that conveniently lets him scumread the people who are auto-voting him tomorrow and townread the people who might wrongly bail him out. His position didn’t emerge from an organic reassessment of the game, just him “scheming” (literally his word not mine lol) about who his allies are. I suspect he’s giving you and only you a pass because he knows you’re going to die tonight

Dont you think maybe just maybe the perfect strategy in this game perhaps the only way for mafia to win is to become locktown and early ? Then focus all of your attention on those who were initially viewed as scummy?

Rethinking the game is a necessity in a setup like this, I say we go for 2/3 of Damo, Will & I (worcej's reads) then we pick one more person for our third kill

The key point Flav and one that I make often when teaching people mafia and how to detect scum is that it is very hard, if not impossible for good mafia players to be locktown given that playing mafia well requires one to balance two diametrically opposing goals, advancing the scum interest vis a vis achieving the required magic number of miskills and looking town long enough to get there. Simply being lock town as mafia is a surefire way to defeat.

When evaluating players try to find where behavior seemed to advance scum interests in ways that were worth appearing less town. I also feel you're making this suggestion in part to setup another goofy manipulation of the end of round gamestate just like Damo did.

I dont disagree with you but I dont think there has actually been a lot of analysis this game about who is "locktown". Actually there's been close to nothing remember how I said D2 is basically D1 1.0? Yea that hasnt changed , the focus is still quite shallow on who is actually scum, not good!

[FlaviusAetius]

Also I support endvoting and Im not sure why that conversation basically stopped when worcej died

[FlaviusAetius]

What if…. Worcej was killed because it very obviously then frames Damo? Worc was livid with what happened at EOD and the last minute vote that resulted in only one kill. It almost seems too neat that Worc would be the one to die. Like bait.

ANDDD thats the issue! But also the solution we can do it ALL! We can vote for who worcej thought was scum and we can vote for who worcej thought was town . Mafia killed worcej for a reason either because he has the scum on his sights or he doesnt . Shouldn't matter for us because we are killing three people and that can encompass all possibilities !

If this is your point (a point I made earlier today) then how do more NKs add more/better evidence to the pot in way that was superior to taking 2 DKs yesterday? Your whole argument centered around the idea that NKs benefited us with superior knowledge and therefore we want more of them to happen before we start making double+ DKs and now you're arguing that the NK has could have logic of A and not A with no way of clearly assigning probabilities to them. Make it make sense.

Im not saying what damo did yesterday was good or bad, Im saying it basically brought us to neutral which actually isnt such a bad thing as all the doomsayers are saying.

It made it so we have a 2nd shot at getting D1 right(remember how Worcej said you gotta hav ea good D1? I agree ) The more information we have to asses it the better! Im not saying we should go infinite lets get all the NKs we can get, Im saying this one time maybe having a D1 one with an NK already on done isnt the end of the world .

IN FACT
I think we can use this situation to our benefit by using worcej's reads and scattershotting our kills using them

[FlaviusAetius]

i’m like… simultaneously cooling on flav being mafia and getting closer to damo/will team.

and then also feeling like if we get to F3 with one of me/glitterbomb + chaqa + tfb that it’s basically auto-win.

YES! Damo & Will should die today, we MIGHT have an opportunity to pull off the Damo kill and wait for D3 since he is a lock kill anyways
@damo you actually responded to worcej saying you would be a willing D2 sacrifice do you still have that opinion ? Cause it sounds like no

[Jamiet99uk]

Vote Count 2.2

Damo (3) - TheFlyingBoat, President Eden, Chaqa
FlaviusAetius (2) - President Eden, TheFlyingBoat
Chaqa (2) - FlaviusAetius, Damo666
TheFlyingBoat (1) - Damo666
JustaGuyNamedWill (1) - TheFlyingBoat

At present DAMO will be taken away.

23 hours and 49 minutes remain in Day Two.

[GlitterBomb]

Alright, I might be going down a rabbit hole here…but here I go!

I wrote out some notes on paper and broke down votes based on who voted for who on D1 and who has voted for who so far now with D2. I was hoping to see some consistencies or maybe alignments or anything that stood out.

To me, there wasn’t much info on Day 1. So in theory, mafia could have more than likely spread out their votes and avoided the need to vote for each other.

Eden and TFB voted the same. Though insanely early, Worcej voted for Eden, but Chaqa didn’t stay true to the promise that anyone who voted Wden would get his vote. If that was so important, wouldn’t he still make sure to vote for Worcej even if the promise was made after the vote?

I think Damo is a distraction. I think intentions made sense in his head and based on what some are saying, it didn’t do a ton of harm to us, though it maybe gave us less information with fewer kills, as long as we don’t flub up this time.

It makes sense to me (as was previously mentioned) that there’s likely a yapper and a non-yapper. I’m thinking Chaqa/TFB or Chaqa/Flav. However I don’t want to place my votes just yet because I’m uber paranoid that we are gonna be faced with a repeat of what happened EOD1. TFB has placed votes for the most obvious three. Will has yet to vote and Damo seems to be aligned with at least one of my suspected pairings.

I could also be totally off and watch it be like Eden/Chaqa and the whole accidental vote, inability to unvote and stance of voting for anyone who votes for Eden was just a distraction. That would be brilliant.

I’m of the stance that while three kills could potentially get us two mafia, it could also knock us out. I really want to focus on trying to find the right one or two, so will at least vote for 2. So I’m still holding out for a bit till I see how more of this unfolds and to see how we can be closer to ensuring not getting screwed over again.

BrainBomb is laughing at me for my PAGES of notes on a notepad…. So I’ll call it good at that for now! =)

[damo666]

TFB Chaqa me

Me will and one of TFB/Chaqa is prob OK too

…how do you figure that that F3 makes any sense lol

the whole premise is that you just need one obvtown in F3 to win. who is your obvtown in those two scenarios?

Sorry my mistake. Didn't realise F3. Was thinking about DK3 lol.

[damo666]

i’m like… simultaneously cooling on flav being mafia and getting closer to damo/will team.

and then also feeling like if we get to F3 with one of me/glitterbomb + chaqa + tfb that it’s basically auto-win.

YES! Damo & Will should die today, we MIGHT have an opportunity to pull off the Damo kill and wait for D3 since he is a lock kill anyways
@damo you actually responded to worcej saying you would be a willing D2 sacrifice do you still have that opinion ? Cause it sounds like no

I'd gladly be in a 3 way kill with TFB and Chaqa

[damo666]

Alright, I might be going down a rabbit hole here…but here I go!

I wrote out some notes on paper and broke down votes based on who voted for who on D1 and who has voted for who so far now with D2. I was hoping to see some consistencies or maybe alignments or anything that stood out.

To me, there wasn’t much info on Day 1. So in theory, mafia could have more than likely spread out their votes and avoided the need to vote for each other.

Eden and TFB voted the same. Though insanely early, Worcej voted for Eden, but Chaqa didn’t stay true to the promise that anyone who voted Wden would get his vote. If that was so important, wouldn’t he still make sure to vote for Worcej even if the promise was made after the vote?

I think Damo is a distraction. I think intentions made sense in his head and based on what some are saying, it didn’t do a ton of harm to us, though it maybe gave us less information with fewer kills, as long as we don’t flub up this time.

It makes sense to me (as was previously mentioned) that there’s likely a yapper and a non-yapper. I’m thinking Chaqa/TFB or Chaqa/Flav. However I don’t want to place my votes just yet because I’m uber paranoid that we are gonna be faced with a repeat of what happened EOD1. TFB has placed votes for the most obvious three. Will has yet to vote and Damo seems to be aligned with at least one of my suspected pairings.

I could also be totally off and watch it be like Eden/Chaqa and the whole accidental vote, inability to unvote and stance of voting for anyone who votes for Eden was just a distraction. That would be brilliant.

I’m of the stance that while three kills could potentially get us two mafia, it could also knock us out. I really want to focus on trying to find the right one or two, so will at least vote for 2. So I’m still holding out for a bit till I see how more of this unfolds and to see how we can be closer to ensuring not getting screwed over again.

BrainBomb is laughing at me for my PAGES of notes on a notepad…. So I’ll call it good at that for now! =)

Excellent post

[JustAGuyNamedWill]

I would happily vote chaqa here

[Chaqa]

@Glitter why would I have voted for worcej? He was my other strong town read.

[Chaqa]

Not sure how the emoji got in there but it fits the post so no big

[GlitterBomb]

@Glitter why would I have voted for worcej? He was my other strong town read.

But if that was your stance/policy then why wouldn’t it be consistent? Giving an exception for preference of who is most town to you seems off to me.

[Chaqa]

Alright, I might be going down a rabbit hole here…but here I go!

I wrote out some notes on paper and broke down votes based on who voted for who on D1 and who has voted for who so far now with D2. I was hoping to see some consistencies or maybe alignments or anything that stood out.

To me, there wasn’t much info on Day 1. So in theory, mafia could have more than likely spread out their votes and avoided the need to vote for each other.

Eden and TFB voted the same. Though insanely early, Worcej voted for Eden, but Chaqa didn’t stay true to the promise that anyone who voted Wden would get his vote. If that was so important, wouldn’t he still make sure to vote for Worcej even if the promise was made after the vote?

I think Damo is a distraction. I think intentions made sense in his head and based on what some are saying, it didn’t do a ton of harm to us, though it maybe gave us less information with fewer kills, as long as we don’t flub up this time.

It makes sense to me (as was previously mentioned) that there’s likely a yapper and a non-yapper. I’m thinking Chaqa/TFB or Chaqa/Flav. However I don’t want to place my votes just yet because I’m uber paranoid that we are gonna be faced with a repeat of what happened EOD1. TFB has placed votes for the most obvious three. Will has yet to vote and Damo seems to be aligned with at least one of my suspected pairings.

I could also be totally off and watch it be like Eden/Chaqa and the whole accidental vote, inability to unvote and stance of voting for anyone who votes for Eden was just a distraction. That would be brilliant.

I’m of the stance that while three kills could potentially get us two mafia, it could also knock us out. I really want to focus on trying to find the right one or two, so will at least vote for 2. So I’m still holding out for a bit till I see how more of this unfolds and to see how we can be closer to ensuring not getting screwed over again.

BrainBomb is laughing at me for my PAGES of notes on a notepad…. So I’ll call it good at that for now! =)

The issue is that two kills can also knock us out.

The more kills we get the better chance we get the mafia. And some of us (including departed worcej) feel pretty strongly about damo.

[Chaqa]

@Glitter why would I have voted for worcej? He was my other strong town read.

But if that was your stance/policy then why wouldn’t it be consistent? Giving an exception for preference of who is most town to you seems off to me.

I’m not sure that I’m seeing the inconsistency. I clearly did not apply it retroactively as I didn’t vote for worcej or myself, and there is literally no benefit to voting for worcej when I believe him to be town.

You almost sound like you’d rather haven me to blindly obey some sort of tautological gimmick instead of voting for who I suspect could be mafia?

[JustAGuyNamedWill]

‘Why are we killing damo?’
‘Oh hes obv scum after EOD 1’
‘Ok lets kill damo only then’
‘No im not confident’

I am more than happy to kill people outside me damo flav if we must do a 3 person kill

[Chaqa]

‘Why are we killing damo?’
‘Oh hes obv scum after EOD 1’
‘Ok lets kill damo only then’
‘No im not confident’

I am more than happy to kill people outside me damo flav if we must do a 3 person kill

Holy Patrick Star straw man Batman

[TheFlyingBoat]

i’m like… simultaneously cooling on flav being mafia and getting closer to damo/will team.

and then also feeling like if we get to F3 with one of me/glitterbomb + chaqa + tfb that it’s basically auto-win.

YES! Damo & Will should die today, we MIGHT have an opportunity to pull off the Damo kill and wait for D3 since he is a lock kill anyways
@damo you actually responded to worcej saying you would be a willing D2 sacrifice do you still have that opinion ? Cause it sounds like no

I'd gladly be in a 3 way kill with TFB and Chaqa

Not shit you would. That would almost certainly set up a F3 of GBomb, Flav, and Will. The three weakest/least experienced players and two of the scummiest players. Could you be anymore obvscum?

[FlaviusAetius]

Alright I just listened to Chopin's Death march because thats what is happening rn. ##vote damo we need to stop playing around and figure out when this endvote is HAPPENING

[President Eden]

Alright, I might be going down a rabbit hole here…but here I go!

I wrote out some notes on paper and broke down votes based on who voted for who on D1 and who has voted for who so far now with D2. I was hoping to see some consistencies or maybe alignments or anything that stood out.

To me, there wasn’t much info on Day 1. So in theory, mafia could have more than likely spread out their votes and avoided the need to vote for each other.

Eden and TFB voted the same. Though insanely early, Worcej voted for Eden, but Chaqa didn’t stay true to the promise that anyone who voted Wden would get his vote. If that was so important, wouldn’t he still make sure to vote for Worcej even if the promise was made after the vote?

I think Damo is a distraction. I think intentions made sense in his head and based on what some are saying, it didn’t do a ton of harm to us, though it maybe gave us less information with fewer kills, as long as we don’t flub up this time.

It makes sense to me (as was previously mentioned) that there’s likely a yapper and a non-yapper. I’m thinking Chaqa/TFB or Chaqa/Flav. However I don’t want to place my votes just yet because I’m uber paranoid that we are gonna be faced with a repeat of what happened EOD1. TFB has placed votes for the most obvious three. Will has yet to vote and Damo seems to be aligned with at least one of my suspected pairings.

I could also be totally off and watch it be like Eden/Chaqa and the whole accidental vote, inability to unvote and stance of voting for anyone who votes for Eden was just a distraction. That would be brilliant.

I’m of the stance that while three kills could potentially get us two mafia, it could also knock us out. I really want to focus on trying to find the right one or two, so will at least vote for 2. So I’m still holding out for a bit till I see how more of this unfolds and to see how we can be closer to ensuring not getting screwed over again.

BrainBomb is laughing at me for my PAGES of notes on a notepad…. So I’ll call it good at that for now! =)

I disagree with some parts of your post, but it’s obvious you’re working hard to solve it. I didn’t need further convincing, but this post is lock town. So don’t take my disagreements as attacks, just some thoughts from a different perspective to consider.

Thoughts:

1. Chaqa.
The most suspect part of Chaqa’s play to me was the initial vote on me, but I think the rest of his play has been pretty townie. I don’t think it’s a problem that he said he would vote anyone who votes me, but then didn’t vote people he independently believed to be town. The ultimate goal is to vote out mafia and protect your town teammates where you can. It would be MORE suspicious if he rigidly stuck to his promise and voted for more people he claimed to townread (after voting me and then townreading me the rest of the game lol).

2. TFB.
I don’t think it’s weird that he got zero votes D1. He quickly established himself as town, consistently contributed all day, and then made the objectively correct decision to push for two kills (which was thwarted by damo making an overt mafia power play). I don’t think that’s changed D2. I get why people are thinking about him more, since we can’t miss today and you never want to leave a stone unturned, but it should only take a quick peek under that stone to figure out TFB isn’t the move today.

3. damo.
I wouldn’t characterize damo’s play as not doing a ton of harm to us. Arranging a triple kill is going to be very difficult, maybe not even possible. He’s directly responsible for one less piece of info for our game-deciding choice today, and he made sure to keep all our top suspects alive, which is reducing our ability to indulge in lower-% considerations like Chaqa/TFB. I downplayed the severity a bit when it happened because (1) to me, it made damo lockscum, and (2) I don’t want my teammates demoralized and catastrophizing today when we all need to be at our sharpest and clearest. But let’s not mince words, damo fucked us, bad.

4. Yapper/nonyapper.
Who are you identifying as yappers and nonyappers here? I know where a couple of us stand, but I’m not totally sure where everyone is in your split.