M 90: Shootout at the Pretty Good Corral

[brainbomb]

Well Im still unclear on what makes someone a lurker as you listed multiple ppl at the time with ten or more posts. You omitted a guy with 1 post at the time and behaved shrewdly about it.

[brainbomb]

This phase is like im Holden Caufield

[sweetandcool]

This phase is like im Holden Caufield

Have you not been reading my posts this phase?

Also I think you should know my general process by now. Feels unfair to get scumread just because I haven't been blopping cases out galore.

[brainbomb]

Anyway, I keep picturing all these little kids playing some game in this big field of rye and all. Thousands of little kids, and nobody's around - nobody big, I mean - except me. And I'm standing on the edge of some crazy cliff. What I have to do, I have to catch everybody if they start to go over the cliff - I mean if they're running and they don't look where they're going I have to come out from somewhere and catch them. That's all I do all day. I'd just be the catcher in the rye and all. I know it's crazy, but that's the only thing I'd really like to be.

[Balki Bartokomous]

16. Rdrivera2005 reaction to nearly dying seemed legit and hes maybe town

@brainbomb, will you please post me to what you have in mind here from rdrivera?

[brainbomb]

This phase is like im Holden Caufield

Have you not been reading my posts this phase?

Also I think you should know my general process by now. Feels unfair to get scumread just because I haven't been blopping cases out galore.

Id expect you to be more determined than hurt by criticism to be honest.

[brainbomb]

16. Rdrivera2005 reaction to nearly dying seemed legit and hes maybe town

@brainbomb, will you please post me to what you have in mind here from rdrivera?

Well, this game will be fast at least.

You should probably have killed me, as I will keep being a wagon just because it's easy to say I didn't post enough and I won't post more then I did D1.

This screams town to me. And I believe it

[FlaviusAetius]

dont forget people;

killing scum d1 this game is really important. it instantly robs scum of one of their kills.

This movement around Food is making me feel good were about to deprive em.

This could have been a reminder to the mafia not to bus any more. Also, the only movement of votes pertaining to foodcoats at that time was BunnyGo changing his vote from foodcoats to DiplomacyandWarfare, but this did not seem to make Vecna suspect BunnyGo was trying to protect foodcoats, based on this:

BB, D&W, Food, HB, Bozo

My current guess is that group contains all 4 scum

Also, the five of us listed were voting for 5 different players at the time of that post, also not consistent with the idea that there was a mafia effort to prevent a foodcoats DK.

These two ideas are >inconsistent<
you say that Vecna is trying to tell mafia dont bus, then you say that all those players are on different people, so then clearly their NOT bussing?

[FlaviusAetius]

Foodcoats makes good sharp observations as town that make sense and that I can identify an investigative and inquiring mindset.

He has done nothing like that all game. He's been fluff-posting and being nice to people, and even his game-related posts are not strong at all so far.

As chaqa said, as soon as it became potentially dangerous to scumread Sweet (if youre a scum with allignment information) he suddenly backed off. Nothing changed there with that additional claim from a town pov.

But most importantly; its not about what he's said. Its about what he hasnt said. Anything that rings like towny observation. Foods often quite quick and clear in that regard.

The more I think about it, the more this doesnt make sense.

Chaqa had the same scumreads.

Chaqa loved the reasoning I provided.

Chaqa was being a wagon-bro.

Yet when prompted he kept stating he did not townread me (even before the food flip).

That is so weird.

Its so natural to townread the people that observe the gamestate in a similar way as you do.

That seems manufacutered then, he realized he was getting too >buddy buddy< with you and backed off, >what< was his reasonings for scum reading you? Or was this Chaqa's naked list response to brain's because then it basically doesnt >matter<

[brainbomb]

Were not lost yet but keep up the pressure, form sound ideas, and fight for them. Dont just get railroaded!

[sweetandcool]

This phase is like im Holden Caufield

Have you not been reading my posts this phase?

Also I think you should know my general process by now. Feels unfair to get scumread just because I haven't been blopping cases out galore.

Id expect you to be more determined than hurt by criticism to be honest.

Oh, no I'm actually a lot more sensitive than you would think. Legitimately upset by how poorly D1 went. I couldn't have done much worse, and on top of getting Dip wrong in the worst way possible, Ham trusted my judgement.

[FlaviusAetius]

Heres all the points where you seem to miss a ton of nuance (the difference with your last few games where you just quitely observed the gamestate for a long time is very different this game).

Bunnygo being frustrated with Sweet: Very easy to come from any alignment. The sweet play is aggrevating. The thing about assuming it to come from town in that one post? Might actually have a minor point there, but even that is not that odd since im pretty sure a lot of people are towning sweet for his crap. He would also do it as scum obviously, because it would be a wonderfull cover, especially after last game he realized that if he is just ultra scummy all game he is more likely to live.

All the stuff surrounding Flavius: He is playing a near identical style to last game. How are you suddenly trying to claim that everyone that thinks he is town is "pocketing" him? How is that a fair assesment of whether someone is scummy? And regarding brainbombs case; how come youre not wondering about that logic? He is using the argument that because flavius was trying to get recruited, he would also still be playing in his scum meta long after the recruit occured. Brainbomb claims that anyone that does not buy that argument (that someone plays a full game in his scummeta because he wants to be recruited) must be scum defending him.

Youre literally playing like brainbomb where you try to connect all the dots before you've seen a single piece of confirmed information.

This is not how you have been playing the last few games. This is not how I prefer you to play if you are actually town, because its just gonna lead to rediculous collusions that dont help anything. Im worried

Except we only have 2 phases of content so far and youre implying you remember flavius tonal shift after n4 when the recruitment cutoff occurred. That seems to be a stretch defense for you to push. Flavius didnt even ask if it was okay for him to be scumsided and admitted to having been doing it til n3

FALSE the >only< thing that I was doing that was somewhat scumsided was to be backing Kak's picks all the way through and >relying< on them AT FIRST I thought yo this is >so good< Kak is smart but he was probs >wrong< so I help scum and they pick me

BUT then I didnt get picked and I convinced myself that >Kak's< picks were actually TRUE. Thats what happened to >me< in M89 and I still THINK the assigned roles would have been a >smart< idea since there was DAY CHAT...
Only I ended up KILLING the wagon that I wanted because I ended up being EASYPICKINGS, just like you are doing >right now< because

Apparently capitalizing words is the >biggest< crime int he entire history of the world, it makes NO sense

[sweetandcool]

Were not lost yet but keep up the pressure, form sound ideas, and fight for them. Dont just get railroaded!

Just for you I'm going to suppose that Vecna and Flav are scum and see where that gets me.

[Chaqa]

I’m relatively certain Vecna and I have caught bozo being super scummy

[FlaviusAetius]

There are other players who townread flavius who im not scumreading; foodcoats also held that stance. Bunny has pushed that stance and I think what bozo is saying about people pocketing also is a credible thought.

But it makes alot more sense for flav to be mafia here running obstruction. I dont actually believe he is like m89 at all. He seems much more like his m45 mafia meta.

m45 was YEARS ago I dont even >remember< playing in that game Im a >completely< different person now as >everyone< does as the years go by I >bet if I went to your FIRST mafia game you would be >so different< do you know WHY? Because >you< are now the >same you< as you were 10 years ago! It makes >NO SENSE< what you are doing right now

[FlaviusAetius]

Talking about even just skills alone

Town vecna doesnt produce a list of 5 players and claim all four scum are in it only to have his entire list or most of his list die and flip town.

Hes so much better than that at catching mafia.

BB, D&W, Food, HB, Bozo

My current guess is that group contains all 4 scum

This is not town vecna
Kill him

I remember someone saying this >last< game Vecna is smart but he doesnt get it right in the >beginning< he gets it wrong a bunch, adjusts and then >gets it DEAD ON< Vecna is >smart< but NO ONE is so smart that they can get >all< the scum D1 its >unrealistic< expectations you have for him and IDK why

[FlaviusAetius]

Heres all the points where you seem to miss a ton of nuance (the difference with your last few games where you just quitely observed the gamestate for a long time is very different this game).

Bunnygo being frustrated with Sweet: Very easy to come from any alignment. The sweet play is aggrevating. The thing about assuming it to come from town in that one post? Might actually have a minor point there, but even that is not that odd since im pretty sure a lot of people are towning sweet for his crap. He would also do it as scum obviously, because it would be a wonderfull cover, especially after last game he realized that if he is just ultra scummy all game he is more likely to live.

All the stuff surrounding Flavius: He is playing a near identical style to last game. How are you suddenly trying to claim that everyone that thinks he is town is "pocketing" him? How is that a fair assesment of whether someone is scummy? And regarding brainbombs case; how come youre not wondering about that logic? He is using the argument that because flavius was trying to get recruited, he would also still be playing in his scum meta long after the recruit occured. Brainbomb claims that anyone that does not buy that argument (that someone plays a full game in his scummeta because he wants to be recruited) must be scum defending him.

Youre literally playing like brainbomb where you try to connect all the dots before you've seen a single piece of confirmed information.

This is not how you have been playing the last few games. This is not how I prefer you to play if you are actually town, because its just gonna lead to rediculous collusions that dont help anything. Im worried

Except we only have 2 phases of content so far and youre implying you remember flavius tonal shift after n4 when the recruitment cutoff occurred. That seems to be a stretch defense for you to push. Flavius didnt even ask if it was okay for him to be scumsided and admitted to having been doing it til n3

The recruitment had already occured N2. Which youre well aware of since you GM'd that game? Everyone in the game was aware of it, so no, I dont believe he was trying to play exactly like his scumgame that entire game just for an attempt at being recruited. The fact youre trying to make this exact argument sounds really weird to me.

The bevaviour continued exactly the same during D3, resulting in Flavius being misskilled because of it.

If you feel he's trying to fake that behaviour this game (as RHK is implying) id find your argument a lot more believeable. As it currently stands, flav is one of the last people id want to kill.

@brainbomb the >only< reason Im not capitalizing words right now is because >several< people have told me its annoying and Im not >aiming< to be annoying so thats why Im using >< these so I can >still< show my emphasis without making me not want to read what I was >saying<
People took me out in M89 because they >saw< easy pickings AND it was a >flashwagon< too so I wasnt even able to properly >defend< myself

[Chaqa]

I’m less quick to call brain scum outright. He plays a bit fast and loose with facts and hypotheticals so he could just be lost in a tunnel.

If I had to guess, most of the people actively discussing the game are town and the mafia are on the periphery (either as lurkers like Rivera or KotP or as medium-activity people like Bozo or Balki or Eden)

[FlaviusAetius]

Because If I dont illustrate that I am also town people will wonder in some idiotic fashion if im scum and im townslipping bozo. People are this stupid. Like levels beyond stupid and the fact you asked illustrates this nicely.

We waste so many hours trying to see some perceptual slip or some wrong phrasing.

People need to just stop smoking meth during the games and jumping at every little micro detail and just fucking take it all in

townslipping and scumslipping is REAL, people make >mistakes< there is ZERO reason >not< to capitalize on those mistakes

[FlaviusAetius]

I’m less quick to call brain scum outright. He plays a bit fast and loose with facts and hypotheticals so he could just be lost in a tunnel.

If I had to guess, most of the people actively discussing the game are town and the mafia are on the periphery (either as lurkers like Rivera or KotP or as medium-activity people like Bozo or Balki or Eden)

Im down to take out a lurker RN, Im looking at >Bozo< he >pushed< the Dip wagon and convinced Ham WRONGLY that he should shoot him >he's gotta go<