M 90: Shootout at the Pretty Good Corral

[President Eden]

what would be the funniest day 1 vote?

Objectively Bona.

what would be the funniest day 1 vote?

Apparently Bona.

Followed by sweetandcool, I suppose.

I already did that!!!

[FlaviusAetius]

Flavius on the defense of lurkers

Town
http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?user=FlaviusAetius&word=Lurker&g=89

http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?user=FlaviusAetius&word=Lurker&g=50


Scum
http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?user=FlaviusAetius&word=Lurker&g=46

Flavius was very animated about lurkers being bad pushes as mafia
He also was animated about sparing lurkers in m89 where he told me post game he wanted to scumside to get recruited

Just a thought

WRONG. I even mentioned in the discord that we gotta go for lurkers this time around and EARLY. Going after lurkers D1 though? Now THAT is nonsense D1 is where you learn information, not by going after someone who wont even respond.
Going after lurkers is GOOD, but doing it probably on the most important day ever is a cop out

Going after lurkers in a blitz at days end on day 1 is not a bad thing. After day 1 people are much more entrenched, less patient and less willing to take the time to actually murder a lurker. Day 1 is the easiest time to recover from a mistake. Especially with guns in play

So you agree killing a lurker would be a mistake D1 and you WANT to engage in that? Makes NO sense man, I get your point about why killing lurkers D1 is easier but that HAS to be outweighed by not knowing who the REAL lurkers even are...

[FlaviusAetius]

Hi! I definitely did not lose track of the start date for this game! Bunny is being way more active than usual according to the bot and so I will

##VOTE BUNNYGO

I didnt take Bunny as a lurker last game, surely not a super talker but definetly not a lurker nothing out of the orindary there I think you should read the game more before making an accusations

I was not in M89, but BunnyGo ended with more posts than anyone else in that game.

That was ONLY because in that game there was a concerted effort to get rid of the yappers like myself which is part of the reason I want to go after the lurkers in THIS game

[FlaviusAetius]

Vecna as town in m86

I think scum is in [chaqa, jamiet, damo, HB] - sweet is still hard to read for me

As for the HB stuff; none of the things he has done is completely lock-scum.

But it is scummy, and he has done little to no redeeming posting. Not a single post id mark as even slightly towny.

Busy, or just uninterested scum? I dno

M83 vecna as town on HB

This post is actually very important I feel.

The second sentence.

HB says that him explaining himself to sweet is becoming the noise that lets the mafia coast - aka he really feels that he's being a distraction by talking to sweet.

I dont think HB ever says this as scum.

"oh yeah, me talking to my scum teammate is causing a distraction that lets the scum fly under the radar".

You just cannot make that shit up as scum.

Strong townlean on HB just for that stuff.

Just hoping I was indeed wrong on my gutfeelings on HB. Ive townread him falsely in previous games with similar bad reasoning, but I havent had any indications of him being a fake fucker this game like last game.

M81 Town Vecna on HB

do like this post from HB.

takes have some meat to em.

On further review HB is always one of Vecnas earliest reads as town. This appears to stem from a game where scum Hamilton fooled him.

M75

Like, if HB was indeed scum here, and I was scum with him, I would not be trying whatsoever to change your mind, and would just gladly eat that rope because there is no hope anyway.

The only reason im giving a slight fuck is because I dont want my prioritizing other things to cause town to loose this game by being too easy a target.

Ive discovered that town vecna does try to solve Hamilton consistently and has identified him accurately multiple times.


M69

Personally I usually prefer to get a read on HB/jamiet slots. Not that im trying to dissuage you, just letting you know im probably only voting there if its a runaway wagon to steal the item

Conclusion: Vecna does this as town every time he comes across Hamilton. I think this fits with his statement of wating to wagon Hamilton. Thus I think Vecna has meta on his side; and is in his towngame here.

You know this tells us nothing right? There is no SCUM Vecna here to compare too

[Chaqa]

Town:
brainbomb
BunnyGo
damo666
FlaviusAetius
Hamilton Brian
Jamiet99uk

Null
Balki Bartokomous
bozotheclown
DemonRHK
DiplomacyandWarfare
kingofthepirates
lfischl
rdrivera2005
sweetandcool
Vecna
worcej

Scumpool
foodcoats
President Eden

[FlaviusAetius]

##vote king

no idea why

We cooked you last game for doing this I cook you again STOP. Vote for someone with a REASON to do it

[FlaviusAetius]

Vecna also usually reads foodcoats correctly, catching him as scum in m53. Food is another player vecna talks about as town every game.

M48 vecna accurately townreads foodcoats day 1
M66 vecna accurately townreads foodcoats day 1
M67 scum vecna doesnt mention food day 1 later says:

he's one of those players where im usually one of the few people townreading him.

M86 accurately townreads foodcoats day 1
M87 scum vecna doesnt mention foodcoats - day 2 says

also im quite sure foodcoats this game is like a boeing

something something nuts, bolts, loose screws

M88 Scum Vecna scumreads foodcoats day 1

It feels like its very smooth, and not as messy as I like to think I remember foodcoats being.

M89 town vecna accurately reads foodcoats day 1

think this is the first game ever im liking foodcoats on d1.

maybe im just forgetting. I like foodcoats.

This seems to fit well within vecna desired early reads. He thinks he doesnt do it but he certainly has a penchant for accuracy.


All this research combined with my hamilton reasearch still give me a few tingly doubts mostly because I find food and hamilton town here. But vecna when he townreads food is very spot on. When he scumreads food its more in vecnas scum game to avoid any read at all than it is to come out swinging for food

And what is Vecna doing THIS game?

[FlaviusAetius]

I just looked it up he doesnt like foodcoat, I dont like foodcoat either but I want to hear his reasons he cant just say foodcoats is sus and drop off the earth

[FlaviusAetius]

The reason for scumreading someone for more active than usual is a interesting take. Dip got it right last game on balki when no one else was buying it. I have bunny as town; but ill be curious how this goes.

This is just such a bad policy to hold though dont we want to ENCOURAGE people to talk more? Suspecting someone for talking MORE is a big NO. Instead look at what they say, and make a judgement off of that.

Im open to the idea of bunny being scum. Its a poor starting point but dip seems to have thought it held some legitimacy. I dont see how this is currently a problem.

Im not saying DONT do it Im saying that CANT be your only argument against someone "this person is having a POSITIVE change in development of their playstyle...therefore MAFIA!!!"

[FlaviusAetius]

I think I either want to vote Flav now or flip my foodcoats read and try vecna out as my hero here. If it fails and food isnt scum I would not immediately just assume vecna is mafia either. As he probably would assume that im setting him up using his expertise as a weapon.

But I am compelled by the research that vecna is often pretty good at reading food correctly when he does so right away

I went back and Vecna is BARELY reading food here he didnt even put a case againt him unlike me, what do you say about MY reasoning?

[FlaviusAetius]

you claimed twice what did you expect?

Reactions more in line with Eden's. I forgot I was playing with a group of trigger happy Cowboys who have no time for reasoning and logic.

Idk at least from my POV it just doesn't make any sense. town have 2 PRs currently, as the lawmen's shots aren't available yet, I just don't understand how it's beneficial for desperado to claim D1. IF you are the desperado, it's more than likely you miss anyways, why would you not wait until you are more sure on someone.

I think you misread the setup the desperado does NOT reveal themselves when they shoot someone. If the desperado THINKS sweet is mafia and since they KNOW sweet is NOT desperado he's a good person to shoot...he should do it sooner rather than later to not make EOD CHAOS

[FlaviusAetius]

##vote food

[sweetandcool]

Reactions more in line with Eden's. I forgot I was playing with a group of trigger happy Cowboys who have no time for reasoning and logic.

Idk at least from my POV it just doesn't make any sense. town have 2 PRs currently, as the lawmen's shots aren't available yet, I just don't understand how it's beneficial for desperado to claim D1. IF you are the desperado, it's more than likely you miss anyways, why would you not wait until you are more sure on someone.

I think you misread the setup the desperado does NOT reveal themselves when they shoot someone. If the desperado THINKS sweet is mafia and since they KNOW sweet is NOT desperado he's a good person to shoot...he should do it sooner rather than later to not make EOD CHAOS

Desperado dies if they hit Town.

I am prepared to shoot, hopefully hit Mafia, shoot again and hopefully hit Mafia, and so on and then eventually die.

[dargorygel]

##GM NOTE AND VOTE AND STUFF

Nathaniel "Texas Jack" Reed (March 23, 1862 – January 7, 1950) was a 19th-century American outlaw responsible for many stagecoach, bank, and train robberies throughout the American Southwest during the 1880s and '90s. He acted on his own and also led a bandit gang, operating particularly in the Rocky Mountains and Indian Territory.

Reed is claimed to have been the last survivor of the "47 most notorious outlaws" of Indian Territory. f Tulsa preaching against the dangers of following a "life of crime".[2][1] His memoirs were published in the 1930s, and are considered valuable collectors' items (one copy was reportedly sold on the internet for $1,500 in 2007). He claimed to have ridden with the Dalton gang, Bill Doolin, Henry Starr and other outlaws and bandits of the old west. He may have also helped Cherokee Bill, a fellow outlaw from the Indian Territory, in his escape from Fort Smith during the 1880s.

As with many others of the era, Reed's colorful stories of his almost 10-year career as an outlaw were probably exaggerated by later writers. He claimed to have ridden briefly with the Daltons, and participated in their dual bank robberies in Coffeyville in 1892, as well as in the infamous 1893 gunfight at Ingalls. However, there is no corroborating evidence that he was involved in either of those events.

Tally-Ho

Jamiet99uk (3) worcej, Balki, Vecna
sweetandcool (3) Dip, foodcoats, Chaqa
foodcoats (3) damo, Bunny, Flavius
FlaviusAetius (2) Demon, Eden
BunnyGo (1) kotp
Hamilton Brian (1) Ham
lfischl (1 )sweet
bozotheclown (1) Jamie
Damo666 (1) rdr

No Kill- bozo

Brain and lfischl have not voted.

(IF the day ended at this moment, brain and lfischl would die for not voting… bozo would die for ending on a NK. And Flavius would die from being the person who moved and ‘caused’ the 3-way tie.)

Around 19 1/3 hours left in D1.

[BunnyGo]

##GM NOTE AND VOTE AND STUFF

Nathaniel "Texas Jack" Reed (March 23, 1862 – January 7, 1950) was a 19th-century American outlaw responsible for many stagecoach, bank, and train robberies throughout the American Southwest during the 1880s and '90s. He acted on his own and also led a bandit gang, operating particularly in the Rocky Mountains and Indian Territory.
Reed is claimed to have been the last survivor of the "47 most notorious outlaws" of Indian Territory. f Tulsa preaching against the dangers of following a "life of crime".[2][1] His memoirs were published in the 1930s, and are considered valuable collectors' items (one copy was reportedly sold on the internet for $1,500 in 2007). He claimed to have ridden with the Dalton gang, Bill Doolin, Henry Starr and other outlaws and bandits of the old west. He may have also helped Cherokee Bill, a fellow outlaw from the Indian Territory, in his escape from Fort Smith during the 1880s.
As with many others of the era, Reed's colorful stories of his almost 10-year career as an outlaw were probably exaggerated by later writers. He claimed to have ridden briefly with the Daltons, and participated in their dual bank robberies in Coffeyville in 1892, as well as in the infamous 1893 gunfight at Ingalls. However, there is no corroborating evidence that he was involved in either of those events.

Tally-Ho

Jamiet99uk (3) worcej, Balki, Vecna
sweetandcool (3) Dip, foodcoats, Chaqa
foodcoats (3) damo, Bunny, Flavius
FlaviusAetius (2) Demon, Eden
BunnyGo (1) kotp
Hamilton Brian (1) Ham
lfischl (1 )sweet
bozotheclown (1) Jamie
Damo666 (1) rdr

No Kill- bozo

Brain and lfischl have not voted.

(IF the day ended at this moment, brain and lfischl would die for not voting… bozo would die for ending on a NK. And Flavius would die from being the person who moved and ‘caused’ the 3-way tie.)

Around 19 1/3 hours left in D1.

##call GM:

If hypothetically Flavius moved off food and voted for me (Bunny!) then would Chaqa die because he was the one who caused the Jamie-Sweet tie?

[FlaviusAetius]

I am caught up and have to go do some work.

Reviewing the game so far, I have to vote for sweet. Sweet's claim is not beneficial, in my opinion, from any town role perspective. I see brain believes that it is a possible tactic to draw scum attention onto a VT, and I understand this. But I don't think that town trying to confuse mafia is a good play for town, because mafia have information, and town does not. Fake claims lead to misunderstanding and division for town. For example, mafia can profit from sweet's fakeclaim by simply ignoring him, enabling a suspicion-spiral later in the game. Sweet's play undermines the town more than it enables our PRs.

##VOTE sweetandcool

SO here's the issue with this number one if someone is claiming you should wait for that to be proven falsely instead of just immediately voting for them, we can discover sweet's fakeness this night so there's zero reason to actually vote him D1.
ALSO
you said sweet would be doing this regardless if you thought it was a bad idea then why didnt you say it then when he first said he was going to do it cause it was optimal town play sounds like YOU are switching up...WHY, NOW?

I don’t think I understand what you are asking. I was meta-punishing sweet to some degree, and he was making sorting difficult for town and so I wanted to remove him.

Sweet’s Desp claim has changed the nature of the information we have, so I have unvoted.

And NOW you are back!!! WHY

[Chaqa]

I get caught up and no one is around

[BunnyGo]

I get caught up and no one is around

hi

[sweetandcool]

I get caught up and no one is around

Howdy pardner!

Who should I shoot?

[dargorygel]

##GM NOTE AND VOTE AND STUFF

Nathaniel "Texas Jack" Reed (March 23, 1862 – January 7, 1950) was a 19th-century American outlaw responsible for many stagecoach, bank, and train robberies throughout the American Southwest during the 1880s and '90s. He acted on his own and also led a bandit gang, operating particularly in the Rocky Mountains and Indian Territory.
Reed is claimed to have been the last survivor of the "47 most notorious outlaws" of Indian Territory. f Tulsa preaching against the dangers of following a "life of crime".[2][1] His memoirs were published in the 1930s, and are considered valuable collectors' items (one copy was reportedly sold on the internet for $1,500 in 2007). He claimed to have ridden with the Dalton gang, Bill Doolin, Henry Starr and other outlaws and bandits of the old west. He may have also helped Cherokee Bill, a fellow outlaw from the Indian Territory, in his escape from Fort Smith during the 1880s.
As with many others of the era, Reed's colorful stories of his almost 10-year career as an outlaw were probably exaggerated by later writers. He claimed to have ridden briefly with the Daltons, and participated in their dual bank robberies in Coffeyville in 1892, as well as in the infamous 1893 gunfight at Ingalls. However, there is no corroborating evidence that he was involved in either of those events.

Tally-Ho

Jamiet99uk (3) worcej, Balki, Vecna
sweetandcool (3) Dip, foodcoats, Chaqa
foodcoats (3) damo, Bunny, Flavius
FlaviusAetius (2) Demon, Eden
BunnyGo (1) kotp
Hamilton Brian (1) Ham
lfischl (1 )sweet
bozotheclown (1) Jamie
Damo666 (1) rdr

No Kill- bozo

Brain and lfischl have not voted.

(IF the day ended at this moment, brain and lfischl would die for not voting… bozo would die for ending on a NK. And Flavius would die from being the person who moved and ‘caused’ the 3-way tie.)

Around 19 1/3 hours left in D1.

##call GM:

If hypothetically Flavius moved off food and voted for me (Bunny!) then would Chaqa die because he was the one who caused the Jamie-Sweet tie?

No... Flavius' move would have then CAUSED the new 2-way draw that would result. Others might have played a part, as in every tie... but I will adjudge the most RECENT move to cause the tie. (Yes, I know this is a different way of dealing with ties. We DO it in after EoD discussions. This is trying to place a standard on THIS game. Yell at me one and all when we are done. I thought it an interesting modification for reasons i will explain after the game.)