M89: Baldurs Gate Mafia Game Thread

[sweetandcool]

And was in 5 hours of straight meetings before this. So I really have no idea what’s up with sweet

It was established last phase that Dip is Town. I respect your abilities to solve that. There's only one explanation for you being so off base.

[Squigs44]

Oh I missed Fox moving off lfsichl... interesting

[ghug]

Well, first off, I think you took mysterious to mean quiet, which is not the case. I'm always loud. Kak is right that I work harder to be townread when I'm scum, but it's more that I say shit when I'm town that's not designed to look good.

Beyond that, though this isn't logically coherent.

For one, I never said I wanted to solve the game with Vecna. For two, you're acknowledging yourself that I said something that you and Kak both found scummy, which runs against the idea that I'm playing to be townread. For three, the entire basis of his own argument is that I'm openly insisting I'm town, which isn't something that regularly garners townreads.

It feels like you're just trying to jump on a shitty argument that you can wash your hands of by blaming Kak when you're wrong. I do not get the sense that you're applying serious consideration here.

What on earth are you talking about?
"I say stuff not designed to look good" when you are TOWN!?! That defeats the whole purpose of being a townie and is anti-town at best, you are just confusing everyone and inviting townies to suspect you and then be suspected for suspecting you over totally reasonable stuff. No what Kak meant was that you tried to stay NAI as a townie...not that you ACTIVELY tried to do stuff that was anti-town.

You and Vecna were being buddy buddy about solving the game, and I put a stop to that real quick by saying no you guys should try to solve the game independently, that would tell us a lot more than some random team up.

You saying this scummy thing is exactly the contradiction I put forward that you did
"So either your a big solver and thats unlike your town meta
Or you are a solver, and you all of a sudden dont want to solve until day 4"

Either way doesn't look good. His entire basis for town is threefolded, one you fit well into the team, and two you are going against your meta when you are a townie, and three(one that Im putting together) you are acting like a big solver, but then all of a sudden dont want to solve the game, that you havent answered for. I dont like that no one else here is paying attention to what Kak is saying but to the @Dip voters;

Ghug and Flum tell us a lot more about Kak's team than Dip does.

Ok I'm back to thinking Flavius is town, and also back to thinking our relationship is going to be exhausting.

1. "I say stuff not designed to look good." not "I say stuff designed to not look good." there's an important difference.
2. I was not being buddy buddy with Vecna. I noted that we agreed and sweet ran with it, which is weird but I'm struggling to find scum motivation.
3. Your contradiction contradicts itself.
4. Has anyone agreed with Kak's meta read yet?

@Flavius

[brainbomb]

Scratch wanders around the forest, alone, wondering about life

Owlbear: grr hooooot

Scratch: awooooooooooooooo


DiplomacyandWarfare (5) DemonRHK* worcej Foxcastle BunnyGo Jamiet99uk
ghug (3) FlaviusAetius Dousing Ezio
FlaviusAetius (3) Bonatogether aarodactyl DiplomacyandWarfare
Ezio (2) yoyoyozo foodcoats
damo666 (2) lfischl TheMadMonarch
BunnyGo (2) JustAGuyNamedWill sweetandcool
lfischl (2) Col7by Vecna
Jamiet99uk (2) Fluminator ghug
Bonatogether (2) Squigs44 Balki Bartokomous

Diplomacy and Warfare is scheduled to die
2.5 hours remain

[ghug]

He's a wagon because he's voting for someone that I don't think he should be scumreading. 2/3 people on his wagon are me and the person he voted.
Flavius voted him for "pressure" early d2. Never verified whatever crap he wanted to investigate in Kak's history.
(I do think it's more likely Flav is scum too after looking into this. His play reeks to my nose).

IIRC Ghug usually wanted to consolidate d1, or if not move himself he would get others to sheep him onto his read. I didn't feel that happened as much this game. To see him do a similar thing this phase with him dumping his vote onto Dousing? Very sus.
I think today should be Ghug vs Flav.

Do you have recollections of me behaving differently around EoD as scum?

I think so? I feel like you did more anchoring but less pushing. I'm struggling to recall any specific example of this, and the IRL excuse is valid.
It's been a year since my last game though, and then a few years before that? Tough to find. Other people are probably more up on the Ghug meta than I am.

I lead the shit out of wagons as scum.

[BunnyGo]

The stubbornness is a good look here for Balki, but I hate the vote.

You hate it because you think Flavor Flav is Town? Don't you think he's mayyyyybe scum?

He's tied for top townread with D&W.

Ok. Sell me on some scum reads.

[Squigs44]

I really dont want to ignore Bona but the Jamie wagon feels more likely to mean something ##vote Jamie

[Squigs44]

Bona can you do something obvtown or obvscum and save us some time

[aarodactyl]

And was in 5 hours of straight meetings before this. So I really have no idea what’s up with sweet

It was established last phase that Dip is Town. I respect your abilities to solve that. There's only one explanation for you being so off base.

Can you link what you’re talking about? It feels weird that you’re so confident considering kak didn’t think so and 5 other players are currently on them.

[BunnyGo]

And was in 5 hours of straight meetings before this. So I really have no idea what’s up with sweet

It was established last phase that Dip is Town. I respect your abilities to solve that. There's only one explanation for you being so off base.

Demon made a compelling case this phase.

And the explanation is I’m very lost.

One of the few people I’ve wondered about every phase is you.

[Squigs44]

That D&W wagon is perhaps the grossest wagon I've seen so far this game

[sweetandcool]

Shoot, I just realized the Dip wagon is starting to run away. I can't believe Town is going to run into the ground one of our last obvious townies.

##VOTE Jamiet

This is acceptable.

[BunnyGo]

Shoot, I just realized the Dip wagon is starting to run away. I can't believe Town is going to run into the ground one of our last obvious townies.

##VOTE Jamiet

This is acceptable.

##vote sweet.

[sweetandcool]

I find it strange you presumably read my conclusion Dip is Town and yet you seem to haven't even bothered to consider it. You acknowledge that Dip could be "bad Town", but seem convinced we should kill "bad Town" rather than Mafia.

yes, I consider the skill as town too for my votes. If I'm unsure of their alignment, that might become the deciding factor.

In d&w's case, I see it as a win win, either we get mafia, or get vote out a bad town. Not much lost there. And I think the chance he is mafia is rather high.

If I don't vote for anyone that 'could be town', then most of the time I would have to vote no-kill. And that is just not good enough, if we played that way, mafia would just nk off all town, and we would gain much less information. So yes, I'm very ok with a candidate that could be town but plays badly and has decent chances to be mafia.

Decent chances being 51%? I expect better of you than to willfully tunnel.

1. Dip is very different this game (and he has always been scum*)
2. Dip is clearly trying to solve.
3. Dip is solving poorly.
4. Dip was like a dog with a bone over the Kak-tadpole thing.

And so on.

Nobody is going to take Dip seriously, so he is not "dangerous" to Town. He just has no idea how to solve.

I know you are annoyed with him, but seriously you are better than putting the blinders on just because you want a particular player out of the game.

This is part of it. It's wild people are following Kak's read when he literally had the blinders on and even acknowledged he was partly voting out of anger.

[Squigs44]

Shoot, I just realized the Dip wagon is starting to run away. I can't believe Town is going to run into the ground one of our last obvious townies.

##VOTE Jamiet

This is acceptable.

Conversely I really like the Jamie wagon

[ghug]

Alright, I'm caught up. The top three wagons are literally the people I least want dead, so that is a problem.

Beyond those three, I don't particularly want to kill:
Ezio
Balki
RHK
Squiggles
Sweetiepie
Kind of yoyo but it's half a love thing

One thing that keeps sticking out to me is that there are a lot of people I feel inclined to scumread on activity/involvement meta. Bona, Just, Jamie to an extent. This is also part of the reason I'm a wagon. The level of content here is a bit absurd, so I want to caution people from using those reads as a crutch; this game is the most likely to have weird activity patterns.

People I would especially like to kill:
Dousing
Jamie
Flum
lfischl

[Balki Bartokomous]

Just read Dousing ISO. Eek.

##vote Dousing

I hadn't really focused on Dousing until this point, but in the back of my mind I had him sorted as Town.

Reading his ISO, a few things stand out:

(1) He has this take on Fluminator and the tadpole early on and then much of his day is about that thing. Just feels like he may be using Flum/tadpole as a crutch for engagement rather than showing much curiosity or interest in the rest of the game. Then says without trying to be ironic: "I feel like we’re spending 90% of our energy talking about the tadpole. Is there a chance we’re that the tadpole is a bit of a red herring?"

(2) Keeps telling us that he has been reading lots of pages but keeps his focus very narrow on a handful of subjects.

(3) Makes a long post about the various reasons mafia might have killed Kak without really saying anything at all.

(4) Concludes "Foxcastle cooked and made the best argument I've seen this game so far" while not townreading Foxcastle, which seems like just the right note to play as a Wolf, whether partnered with Fox or not, as it further discredits me while taking no committed position on any alignment.

I think this is a good flip.

[sweetandcool]

Just read N1 where I, ghug, and I think even Bunny provide compelling evidence for why Dip is Town.

This is a pathetic showing.

[FlaviusAetius]

I have NO recollection of this; what on earth are you talking about? Why would I be OFFENDED that you are thinking Im a townie? This doesnt make any sense and I dont know why you keep making it, show me where it happened or I dont believe you

Seriously why is anyone voting for this guy?

Yeah. It’s getting to the point where the frustration feels so over the top that, while I hope it’s fake, it’s probably not. I’m going to catch up and then try to reread a bit if I have time. I should be around for eod so I’m not feeling a rush to change my vote yet.

I dont understand why people keep saying its over the top, its not. People have been changing the color of their text and talking in all caps. I just capitalize SOME words to provide emphasis not because Im trying to yell at people

[ghug]

Point of order: what are Dousing's pronouns? They're in my head as not a he but I feel I may have that wrong.