M89: Baldurs Gate Mafia Game Thread

[DemonRHK]

Good
jamie
kak
bunbun

Bad
flum
dip
idk maybe colby

Ugly
damo
will
your mom

#SwingTheSubs, get the dubs
Balki
yoyo

[DemonRHK]

Forgot Eh-Eh-Ro was playing, that's now my third ugly.

...actually fifth. Yo momma so fat she counts as two scumreads.

[ghug]

Given that day 1 was TvT I suspect most scum sat back and let town kill town while they were off lead wagons. I therefore suggest that tomorrow we concentrate on that group of 11 although I townread Kak so that reduces it to 10. Hopefully it gets furthe reduced overnight.

PS Best wishes to our 2 subbed outs.

Some of those not on the lead wagons were AFK, and the lead wagons at the time were much less clear, so I dont think the group of 11 is actually the group of 11.
aarodactyl & will were both early voters of me but then didnt get back for when things changed. Same with lfishcl for Flum. I read Colby as town I liked his analysis and his reponses to my questioning of him. I also read Kak as a town, and HB is dead so he isnt apart of the group of 11 either.

So... that leaves king ofpirates who was AFK this entire time basically so he doesnt count either and not sure what to think of Balki yet, so put him to the side I suppose..

LEAVING;
TheMadMonarch(who??), ghug & Bona

I don't think afk is a reason to rule out so 10 - Kak&Col7by (temp noob pass) = 8.

I will be voting* from the survivors of {Will aaro demon Balki TMM ghug Bona lfischl}.

* Assuming I'm not NK'd (highly unlikely the way I'm being scumread by a few) or otherwise vig'd/despatched (quite possible)

I shall ponder the order of the 8

Why not Ezio?

[Balki Bartokomous]

Wait you just caught me townslipping for not even knowing mafia can convert a PR. Thank you
Sweet!
and Cool

This reads like a lie. Why would you assume that town PR's are exempt from a tadpole?

##vote Fluminator

Also the possibility that a tadpole sent to a town PR could fail brings up a weird alternate universe where the mafia could've used the tadpole to figure out if a person was a town PR or not (ie: the mafia would know a person was a town PR if the tadpole failed)

This might be a Townslip actually. Town can reject the tadpole and this post assumed it can't. Do people who have played with Dousing before know if he'd fake a townslip like?

I think this is an odd post from Fluminator, FYI. I might elaborate on that later.

[Col7by]

Good
jamie
kak
bunbun

Bad
flum
dip
idk maybe colby

Ugly
damo
will
your mom

#SwingTheSubs, get the dubs
Balki
yoyo

I agree with your ugly, don’t think ive come off as bad but too each their own maybe vibes

[Balki Bartokomous]

Bona and flum have some kind of prior relationship.

Would you explain why this matters to the discussion please?

Bona said something playful to flum about how they should lock in and find scum. Flavius has decided it means it means something that bona picked flum to say that to. I have a very good source that tells me that bona and flum have played mafia a bunch together and may or may not have spend long periods of time in the same discord server and it’s probably NAI for bona to say that.

Thanks.

[DemonRHK]

Good
jamie
kak
bunbun

Bad
flum
dip
idk maybe colby

Ugly
damo
will
your mom

#SwingTheSubs, get the dubs
Balki
yoyo

I agree with your ugly, don’t think ive come off as bad but too each their own maybe vibes

You don't actually. And I've never seen ya play and you were pretty smooth.

Smooth makes ya sus when I don't know ya. 'Specially with a daychat.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Or is it a scum slip because all townies should know it's optional to be recruited. Hmmm

Tbh, I have no clue what your point is. BOTH mafia and town know that the tadpole could be rejected. Classic WIFOM; you’re reading far too deep into the “why does person X know this information that is clearly defined in the setup for everyone to see??????”-type thinking

Youre getting schooled flum. I like this guy.

I agree with Vecna and Dousing. Though I'm not really experiencing an impact on my Flum feelings.

[Kakarroto]

I find it strange you presumably read my conclusion Dip is Town and yet you seem to haven't even bothered to consider it. You acknowledge that Dip could be "bad Town", but seem convinced we should kill "bad Town" rather than Mafia.

yes, I consider the skill as town too for my votes. If I'm unsure of their alignment, that might become the deciding factor.

In d&w's case, I see it as a win win, either we get mafia, or get vote out a bad town. Not much lost there. And I think the chance he is mafia is rather high.

If I don't vote for anyone that 'could be town', then most of the time I would have to vote no-kill. And that is just not good enough, if we played that way, mafia would just nk off all town, and we would gain much less information. So yes, I'm very ok with a candidate that could be town but plays badly and has decent chances to be mafia.

Decent chances being 51%? I expect better of you than to willfully tunnel.

1. Dip is very different this game (and he has always been scum*)
2. Dip is clearly trying to solve.
3. Dip is solving poorly.
4. Dip was like a dog with a bone over the Kak-tadpole thing.

And so on.

Nobody is going to take Dip seriously, so he is not "dangerous" to Town. He just has no idea how to solve.

I know you are annoyed with him, but seriously you are better than putting the blinders on just because you want a particular player out of the game.

I disagree with point 1. D&W shows similar behaviour towards me like in the game we were both mafia with the misrepresentation. I know I'm not mafia, so alright, it could just be a personal thing. I still find it sus and bad. But everyone else than me should be very worried that we BOTH are mafia together here

maybe he is not dangerous in itself, but he leaving such things in the thread, repeating them can still influence the impression from others. There is a reason why commercials and ads are so repetitive, and slogans come to everyone's mind, even when they are bad. The more you hear/read/experience the same thing, the more your brain gets synchronized with that. It forms and grows inside and can get so big, that at one point, you truly believe a wrong thing even when you knew before it's wrong. This is very dangerous.

I try not to get blinded, and I think my EoN post will explain it better. But I give you, that I probably made a mistake at EoD when voting for d&w instead of flum at the time. I could've put him into the pole position yesterday, and I was too distracted. We could've had a very different discussion now, maybe, but that is a topic for the god thread, I guess

[Kakarroto]

You are blinded by hate, young Padawan.

I wouldn't say blinded. Angry, at least for a time I was. But look at how he represents my words, and how he ignores to look back at the evidence. If not with malicious intent, it is gross neglect. Or do you completely agree with his description of my actions?

ISO him. He has plenty of other moments, not related to you, where he has bad takes. You could say it's Mafia motivated, but really it is plainly symptomatic of what I have been trying to say.

Bruder Kakob, Bruder Kakob.
Schläfst du noch? Schläfst du noch?
Hörst du nicht die Glocken? Hörst du nicht die Glocken?
Ding dong dong, ding dong dong.

funnily enough, I had a quick nap because I felt a bit dizzy.

maybe I should fully iso him, but then again, iso-ing considered harmful

[Kakarroto]

Mr. level headed people, sir, what do you think about bunny so far? I would like for you to give your opinion about yoyozo, too, though I can understand that it might take a bit since he just subbed in. And may I be so cheeky and ask for your evaluation of damo?

Oh, well I guess my recent tinfoiling on Bunny that I was preparing probably answers that. Basically gut says Bunny is scum, VCA says Bunny isn't looking good, nit I can't pin down anything that makes me want to commit to a Bunny vote.

Not sure analysis on yoyo is gonna be helpful yet, let's give some time for them to post and catch up.

I gave a case on damo early, but he's either scum who doesn't care or town who doesn't care and either way I can't wrap my head around his intentions or motivations. Either way, damo will probably flip at some point, and an earlier flip could be better for vca. I'd hate to vote damo only for information, but even as town I'm not sure leaving him alive long term is going to be very helpful. Hopefully we find a better flip tomorrow that is more likely scum and gives us more info, but it's hard for me to see a world where damo makes it to the end game, so take that as you will.

Oi rude!

but is he wrong though?


(spoiler, I think you can be helpful in the later stages when you are town)

[Kakarroto]

HB is dead but he is not forgotten. D1 town logic is always problematic because we don't have enough data to do more than tinfoil, but as I have become an adherent of the Temple of the Frog God, let's see what HB's guts told him. We know at the least that his gut checks were presented sincerely and authentically.

Here is a moment where HB's spidey senses go off:

What's with the quick Jamie wagon right out of the gate? That's absurd.

Vecna, Sweet, Squigs...giving you three the hairy eyeball.

HB makes larger reads lists, but I don't consider these as valuable because once you start trying to slot lots of people at the same time, you risk falling into the trap of needing to categorize all the players and hence make dubious inferences. Let's ignore those.

Here is another place where HB makes statements that are, to me, "non-sensical," but in retrospect, they show that HB got "good vibes" off king/Balki and bad vibes off Dip&War:

Yeah. That's a bad reads list. Strong town on king? Town on Chaqa (he's been absent for a good reason, which should be a null)? Scum on me, you, and food?

To be fair, King's reversal of their vote and the rationale...innocently town (as I currently read things). Your END vote...just pulling that card out of your pocket seems disingenuous and not town helpful.

HB essentially directly declares Will is scum in the below, but again, like the more extensive reads list, this may be too "logical" for a D1 read and hence have minimal value.

This is good

I think you're buddying.

Towards the end, HB essentially tunnels D&W. He starts to pick apart D&W more and more, but I think this is based on his initial gut-checked scum read which he decides is worth following, and thus wants to prove with more logical arguments as he goes.

There seems to be the most earnest value in HB's scumreads of D&W, Vecna, Squigs, and sweet... though those latter three he never comes back to in any significant way, so his "truest" scumread in the end was D&W.

why are you excluding brians quote where he thinks I might try to gain towncred by defending him?

[DemonRHK]

scan flum frfr

[Kakarroto]

@Jamie

I want to inquire your opinion towards this post previously made in this game:

m89 - kotp vote change.png


here is the link to it:




I would appreciate if you give your thoughts with some amount of detail here

When I saw it, I assumed I would then see him unvoting, shortly after.

I have done the same in the past when the rules were like this. Like, self-voting and then immediately unvoting, and thus meeting the rule without any impact.

However, I notice that he has not done that. He has kept his vote on himself. That is odd behaviour.

Why are the quotes all f’ed up

this one time, I deleted the quote text itself and put the quote as a picture before

[Kakarroto]

Fuck this shit im not reading 30 more pages

I would've liked your input to some of the situations

[Kakarroto]

Balki? What

should've read on

[Kakarroto]

GM NOTE

A question was raised about how Circle of the Moon would work with there being a God Thread.

So players are aware, this game features an unspoiled environment upon death, regardless of whether there was a circle of the moon or knowledge role in play. This is mostly to spawn unique dialogue which I feel is often tainted by people spectating with an answer sheet.

Oy, what? So there is a possibility that players are kept out of getting the game info after their death without any game relevant reason for it?

I feel troubled by that

[Kakarroto]

This feels TMIish.

? what do you mean here with too much information? I have never seen brian obvtowning or at least can't remember that, I usually have a hard time reading him. This game I think I had one of the best reads of him so far, and that was late when he was under pressure. Pretty ironical, looking back at this post now, I have to say, since before that I had a feeling of him just existing and not tending in any special direction. I did stay away from him though since I know he's often misvoted and just let him be, and look at other stuff.

the whole thing people voting for him felt like a nothing burger, I kinda feel the same about damo, though if I had to make a choice of either, I would've voted for damo instead of brian here. It's not much, and probably nothing, but he ever so slightly gave a small mafia vibe off. But there were much better options, like Flum or lfischl, to push them to get info, or remove. Still sad that we didn't went for D&W here, which I felt was the superior vote, for reasons pointed out already.

But back to my question, what exactly do you mean here with me having too much information? I don't understand your thoughts there at all.

I mean, you summed it up right there. Normally you find him hard to read. Here you were very confident he was town. There's a way you'd know he's town.

and I also have often strokes of genius where I see a single action and come to the correct conclusion that they are town. I feel you are very stretching here

[Balki Bartokomous]

That full-time mafia chat is going to be a PITA.

I wonder if a way around it is to consolidate in like 3, 4, 5 key blocs...who do you resonate as town with, then vote around that, making sure to avoid the tie.

But then the "vote once"" but you can also Unvote and still be in compliance is CAF.

Town

[Kakarroto]

I do think Dip is looking good. (find the full post following the link above)

what exactly do you mean with him looking good? Please give examples, go into detail, and point out your thoughts and reason behind this.

For the record, I heavily disagree with your assessment here. I think nearly nothing about him is good. Not his logic, not his behaviour regarding evidence, and I'm pretty sure now he isn't on the 'good side'. So please, make me understand you, try to show me the errors of my ways.

I quoted several things in the moment. I see a bloodthirstiness to solve that is reaching conclusions I disagree with in a way that feels earnest and more concerned with finding the answer than consequences to reputation. That's town behavior.

I think you are either wrong or on a team with him