Mafia 88: Murder at the Meadery - GAME THREAD

[Jamiet99uk]

RIP Damo! I appreciate the defense of me.

I was shocked about the flip of LoW and I feel like I walked in to that vote blindly and not following my gut.

My memory could be incorrect but I feel like Jamie was one of the first ones to lock into LoW being mafia. It was early but he seemed adamant about it, and never really let up.

The wagons were T v T. So considering that, where were the mafia team hiding out?

Will (Confirmed Mafia) on D1: sweet, bona, rivera/Dip, king, worcej, bunny, ghug (Confirmed Town)
Damo (CT): spart, balki, hamilton

Day Two, with the tie:
LoW (CT): jamie, king, sweet, spart, hamilton
bozo: rivera/dip, ghug (CT), bunny, damo (CT), worcej

So we know that worcej wasn't trying to save a mafia teammate by voting for bozo when the tie happened.

And then D3.

I think I am just trying to plot some points here, and I don't know what the D3 votes are.

This was quite a long post that said surprisingly little.

[Jamiet99uk]

##vote sweet

you literally suggested you could be cop. It's not like I pointed out a crumb or a subtle soft. I assume you are not really claiming but you might as well sell it by providing scans.

You may be the miller…or I may not have scanned you

Or you’re scum…

But I’ll make my scans clear at EOD

I am not sure if this is a real claim or not.

[Jamiet99uk]

Dargorygel has changed my name

Very good. What do you think of the game state?

The ham wagon is terrible. Vecna seems to know exactly what is going on, but rarely posts, which is a scumlean to me. Balki is actively engaging and being very levelheaded compared to the rest of this nonsense. Sweet continues to play very well. Bunny has been posting a lot but doesn't seem to be doing much, and requires further analysis.

Strong town:
Ham
Sweet

Weak town:
Jamiet
Balki

Weak scum:
Bozo
LordofWords
Vecna

Null:
Everyone else

Interesting to see a "strong town" read on the person that was currently voting you.

I do not agree that sweet was "playing very well" up to this point in the phase.

[Jamiet99uk]

Luckily we can still refer back to D1 and D2 with the bot. I am very lousy with using the search feature in the forum.

However, I'd like to get a closer reread of worcej.

Waiting to see if Hamilton did do a re-read of Worcester.

[Jamiet99uk]

It might reveal who the cop is, though. This sort of thing was also attempted in M87 and fizzled out pretty quickly.

Okay, let's chase this out. Pretend (for the sake of argument) that you are the clerk and I am not the clerk. You would list off three scans you made. Presumably you tell the truth (or else what's the point of this?).

Meanwhile, I make up two fake scans (since I was roleblocked last night). If I slip up and list a Mafia player as "town", then they will instantly know I am faking this, which then basically rules me out as clerk.

So Bunny's plan does offer some protection to the clerk, but it is not bulletproof.

Useful discussion (and I still support Bunny's plan, I think).

[Jamiet99uk]

Oooh. Should we all post “if I’m the cop my scans are…” in the last 10 minutes of day?

I like the idea, but why wait until EOD?

Uh, because the game-state evolves during the phase, Bozo.

Weird question to even ask.

[sweetandcool]

Lastly,

I did have one epiphany during night, one wondrous nugget.

This game was notable in that rdr pocketed me. I don't think that has ever happened and is a bit suspicious.

On top of that, before I got sidetracked by thinking the team was Vecna, LoW, Bozo, rdr was also listed as a top candidate.

Now I literally forgot why that was the case, but now that I have access to the bot I will review him because:

When Dip took over for rdr, he quickly assessed the situation and "correctly" decided to vote LoW. I think for a new player joining, psychologically speaking, it would have been very likely to place the traditional vote against the fake claimer Ham, rather than parse the arguments against it.

Particularly, if Dip was filling a scum slot, then regardless of Ham's alignment of course he would support the LoW wagon.

I think he must be scum. I will review his slot and see what fruit it bears.

PS, while I think the Ham wagon is a mistake, I will recognize that since Town allowed Ham to survive one more day despite wanting him gone, it's only fair for me to "return the favour", so to speak.

##VOTE Ham

This post is very interesting.

Sweet provides a reason, which on the face of it could be a valid reason, for suspecting D&W.

Sweet then proceeds to explain that he thinks voting for Hamilton is a mistake, but then votes for Hamilton anyway. This is a strange take. If you're a VT, your vote is your main weapon. Casting a vote you believe to be wrong is not pro-town behaviour.

First, it is not EoD, so casting my vote anywhere is reasonable.
Secondly, I was practicing humility. If I am incorrect with my reads, tunneling into them does not help town. Consequently, it makes sense to sometimes vote people you personally think are more likely Town than scum because Town as a whole believes their guilt.

That is, sometimes sheeping Town is a good decision.

[Jamiet99uk]

In addition to my rejection of this plan as a matter of principle, I can't help but think there is something desperately wrong with it.

I wonder why it's not standard practice to follow this plan in all other vanilla games? Or is it standard practice and I am ignorant?

Is Bunny just suggesting Clerk claim?

I violently want to Scum and Town Bunny over all of this.

It is very common practice on some other sites where Mafia is played.

[Jamiet99uk]

Lastly, I was eating some wondrous chicken nuggets.

This game was notable in that rdr pocketed me. I don't think that has ever happened and is a bit suspicious.

On top of that, before I got sidetracked by thinking the team was Vecna, LoW, Bozo, rdr was also listed as a top candidate.

Now I literally forgot why that was the case, but now that I have access to the bot I will review him because:

When Dip took over for rdr, he quickly assessed the situation and "correctly" decided to vote LoW. I think for a new player joining, psychologically speaking, it would have been very likely to place the traditional vote against the fake claimer Ham, rather than parse the arguments against it.

Particularly, if Dip was filling a scum slot, then regardless of Ham's alignment of course he would support the LoW wagon.

I think he must be scum. I will review his slot and see what fruit it bears.

PS, while I think the Ham wagon is a mistake, I will recognize that since Town allowed Ham to survive one more day despite wanting him gone, it's only fair for me to "return the favour", so to speak.

##VOTE Ham

This post is very interesting.

Sweet provides a reason, which on the face of it could be a valid reason, for suspecting D&W.

Sweet then proceeds to explain that he thinks voting for Hamilton is a mistake, but then votes for Hamilton anyway. This is a strange take. If you're a VT, your vote is your main weapon. Casting a vote you believe to be wrong is not pro-town behaviour.

First, it is not EoD, so casting my vote anywhere is reasonable.
Secondly, I was practicing humility. If I am incorrect with my reads, tunneling into them does not help town. Consequently, it makes sense to sometimes vote people you personally think are more likely Town than scum because Town as a whole believes their guilt.

That is, sometimes sheeping Town is a good decision.

How do you know the alignment(s) of the people advocating a Hamilton vote today?

Is this a scumslip?

[Jamiet99uk]

In addition to my rejection of this plan as a matter of principle, I can't help but think there is something desperately wrong with it.

I wonder why it's not standard practice to follow this plan in all other vanilla games? Or is it standard practice and I am ignorant?

Is Bunny just suggesting Clerk claim?

I violently want to Scum and Town Bunny over all of this.

It has been done before, with mixed success. The idea is to know the cop's scans if they are NKed without them having to claim.

Oh okay, then we should definitely not do the plan.

I have already figured out who the true cop is and noticed their scan crumbs. I'd rather not force them to be "obvious".

Interesting.

[sweetandcool]

This post is very interesting.

Sweet provides a reason, which on the face of it could be a valid reason, for suspecting D&W.

Sweet then proceeds to explain that he thinks voting for Hamilton is a mistake, but then votes for Hamilton anyway. This is a strange take. If you're a VT, your vote is your main weapon. Casting a vote you believe to be wrong is not pro-town behaviour.

First, it is not EoD, so casting my vote anywhere is reasonable.
Secondly, I was practicing humility. If I am incorrect with my reads, tunneling into them does not help town. Consequently, it makes sense to sometimes vote people you personally think are more likely Town than scum because Town as a whole believes their guilt.

That is, sometimes sheeping Town is a good decision.

How do you know the alignment(s) of the people advocating a Hamilton vote today?

Is this a scumslip?

Argh, you caught me.

[Jamiet99uk]

##VOTE Balki

##vote Balki
##end

Noting again the sudden middle-of-day flashwagon on Balki.

[Jamiet99uk]

How are we looking more Town?

Ham is widely scumread (although maybe Bunny's argument will change that), Dip is looking super scummy, and I don't know why I would look better for pushing so hard to flip LoW.

If the mafia thought damo could be the cop, it was probably because of Hamilton, I don't think DandW would risk pretending to think LoW was still in the game, and you are being more inconsistent than you probably would be as mafia.

This.

And I’d rather ##vote king ##end

At this point BunnyGo had not given a reason for this vote.

Still catching up though...

[Jamiet99uk]

Very good. What do you think of the game state?

The ham wagon is terrible. Vecna seems to know exactly what is going on, but rarely posts, which is a scumlean to me. Balki is actively engaging and being very levelheaded compared to the rest of this nonsense. Sweet continues to play very well. Bunny has been posting a lot but doesn't seem to be doing much, and requires further analysis.

The ham wagon doesn’t feel terrible if what I have read is true…

Lol at Worcej feeling the need to say this while he was endvoting Hamilton.

[Jamiet99uk]

##VOTE kingofthepirates

Bozo and Bunny in lock-step voting KOTP with no explanation.

(Still re-reading)

[Chaqa]

M88 Day 4 Vote Count 4
sweetandcool (3): DiplomacyandWarfare, Vecna, Bonatogether
bozotheclown (2): Balki Bartokomous, Jamiet99uk
DiplomacyandWarfare (2): sweetandcool [END], Spartaculous
Balki Bartokomous (1): BunnyGo
Hamilton Brian (1): worcej [END]
kingofthepirates (1): bozotheclown
worcej (1): Hamilton Brian

Need to vote: kingofthepirates

Currently SWEETANDCOOL is set to be killed.

Just over 4 hours remain.

[Jamiet99uk]

Okay HERE is BunnyGo's case...

This.

And I’d rather ##vote king ##end

Could you and Bozo make an actual case, are are you both purely relying on PoE?

You were less loud about it. damo was in their face about him thinking Hamilton was town and that he didn't want people voting him.

read bozo's posts.

I'll add:

first vote was a hedge

In case sweet returns, this will change, but for now:

##vote sweet

unvote was wishy washy

right, caught back up, seems sweet is back, some weird things have been said about the contents of Jamie's hard drive (and search history...?), but no other major developments.

##UNVOTE

regarding what some have said about my posts being fluff, I don't really know tells still (one game is not a large enough sample size guys...), so I'm kinda just going off of vibes and random annoyances (for instance, sweet's refusal to elaborate was annoying, if mildly humorous). Please, enlighten me on what exactly I ought to be looking for, and why we're hammering the new comers?

It’s starting to get weird in here. Should we just hammer one of the new guys?

actual vote on Just was hedgy.

Most of Day 1 ISO looked like anchor posts. And had more strange interactions with Balki than just what bozo already posted:

Hi friends. I'm here. I don't have anything interesting to say other than that.

thoughts on sweet's vote on you? especially after the random number

(go look at page 4 for that interaction in full--including food making king nervous)

Like this shortly after:

whats the logic behind voting food then?

? I am not voting food…?
My logic for voting sweet is that the behavior very random, and non participation and the lack of explanation is plain annoying. If something else comes up, I’m perfectly happy changing my vote.

voted Will out of NOWHERE. He's a possible busser. There was enough time left and enough other wagons. He even shaded the Bona wagon with 6 minutes to go right AFTER ghug moved from Bona to damo putting Just in the lead. Looked like he was trying to talk people onto damo.

Then look at day 2. Hedgy vote on Sparta. Unvoted for some unknown reason.

Voted LoW for disappearing....then disappeared.

Buddied me when I pushed him on it...then disappeared again.

I'm good here ##end

Well, at least this is a reason, and sorry for apparently failing to notice it twice, Bunny.

I am not sold on this case, I must say, however. But I acknowledge its existence.

[sweetandcool]

It's entirely possible the entire Mafia team is voting me right now.

[Jamiet99uk]

Okay, we're just going to ignore me in all of that apparently.

I don't think Pirate is Mafia because I don't think Pirate would bus like that.

I think Pirate voting me at the beginning of D1 was authentic and NAI.

Interesting take, but noteworthy that Sweet quickly responded.

[Jamiet99uk]

It's entirely possible the entire Mafia team is voting me right now.

Bona is town, at least.