Mafia 85: Return from Lockdown

[Nephthys]

Oh that. Well it felt like not as many as usual were in the game. And, a bit hard to describe, like the posts didn't flow as it normally would, at least with so many participants. It was about an hour and a half between my posts and it was only like page three. It felt a bit like something is missing, something to fire up people, or something people can be controversial about. Maybe something to react to. So I did my endvote to see how peeps react to it.

That reminds me ##unend

still I think voting damo isn't too wrong here, he hasn't posted the whole day, don't like that.

Following on from my previous post, Kak seems intent on getting us as little info as possible...

Do you think that Kakorroto mentioning he considered a No Kill, and removing his end vote, is scum indicative?

Inherently no. But combined with wanting to kill lukers I don't like. His reads list is also verbose to the point of being mostly filler, I've found I tend to do this more as scum

##vote Kak

[BobMcBob]

I like what I've seen from foodcoats so far. I'm not getting the kind of fun!kak vibes I hope for with him in the game. Jamie-brain argument reads like a classic case of Jamie-brain blowing each other up. Makes me think they're probably not both mafia.

[sweetandcool]

Following on from my previous post, Kak seems intent on getting us as little info as possible...

Do you think that Kakorroto mentioning he considered a No Kill, and removing his end vote, is scum indicative?

Inherently no. But combined with wanting to kill lukers I don't like. His reads list is also verbose to the point of being mostly filler, I've found I tend to do this more as scum

##vote Kak

That's what YOU do as scum. Is that what Kak does as scum? That is the important question.

[BobMcBob]

im leaning jamie scum for some of his other weird insistent stances that this game has no VTs for example. where is pretty obvious that on day 1; no one is actually arguing there are vts; rather everyone is effectively equal and a vt in having a lack of knowledge about role. He seems to just keep wanting to focus on that no one is vanilla rather than seeing the game as “were all just the same today and we have no reason to think otherwise until more days pass”

That seems like a very Jamie thing to do to me. He often takes things at face value, so it makes sense he's going to take issue with you saying someone would "know they're vt".

[BobMcBob]

Chaqa is just so antitown that it becomes town...right??

No, that's just chaqa.

[BobMcBob]

Is Jamie being more combative than usual or something?

no its part of his game as both alignments is that if he doesnt make you waste tons of time arguing nuances with him or pedantry - then he will get accused of being too off this game. so he does it as scum to look like his town game and he does it as town because he gets caught up in dead end topics and thinks he needs to just keep fighting with people

How soon do they do this?

Early enough to lead multiple D1 miskills because a town said something Jamie takes to be lying and is unwilling to give up on.

[BobMcBob]

@Kak

I just thought of a joke during my morning walk:

What do you call an Austrian dog?

I'm trying to think, but nothing special comes to mind. Neither in german or english, nothing related to snow or mountains or a city name (bare 'Wien' maybe, but I fail to get a good pun myself). I hope it's nothing connected to WW2. Maybe I'm overthinking it.

So what do you call 'einen guten Jungen' or 'ein gutes Mädchen'?

A Wienerdog.

I suppose in Austrian the answer would be Wienerhund, but then the joke doesn't quite make sense.

Wow, bunny really didn't like your joke.

[Nephthys]

Do you think that Kakorroto mentioning he considered a No Kill, and removing his end vote, is scum indicative?

Inherently no. But combined with wanting to kill lukers I don't like. His reads list is also verbose to the point of being mostly filler, I've found I tend to do this more as scum

##vote Kak

That's what YOU do as scum. Is that what Kak does as scum? That is the important question.

Everyone does to some degree, its psychology

[BobMcBob]

A Wienerdog.

I suppose in Austrian the answer would be Wienerhund, but then the joke doesn't quite make sense.

I can't say I laughed too much about that, but the joke kinda makes sense, though there are a lot of people who wouldn't equalize Wien with Austria, at least here.

Also, what you call Wiener, we call it here Frankfurter (because a person from Frankfurt [who did so in Vienna] invented it and called it in homage of his birth city), though most other german speaking regions call it indeed Wiener (since it comes from Vienna and stuff, though they don't honour the inventors wish). At the end, it's just a hot dog.

We do have something called 'Wiener' here, but it's a kind of (sliced) sausage. If you are in a supermarket and go to the meat area ordering 'Wiener' there, you'll get that (well they would ask you how much 'deka' [from dekagram] of it you would want, so don't get confused there).

There is another use of 'Wiener', regarding the Schnitzel, so if you go into a viennese restaurant and order a 'Wiener', you'll get that, because no restaurant here would think it's a hot dog.

But yeah, if you are in Frankfurt, Berlin or Munich, ordering a Wiener would yield you (a pair of) hot dog sausages. Well not 100% sure on Munich, but pretty certain.

Anyway, no dog meat would be used, that is guaranteed. There are some places where you can get horsemeat though, which might not be something for americans.

In America we call it a hot dog, sometimes a Frank, wiener too though I think people trying to sound perverted like to refer to them that way.

And we very commonly call Daschunds, Wienerdogs because they look like wiggly walking hot dogs (wieners).

Now the joke was that (I assume) Wiener means citizen of Wien (Vienna) just like Frankfurter and Berliner.

Of course, Vienna is not Austria, but conveniently it is the capital so staging the joke the way I did makes sense to me.

The most amusing thing to me, is after all this I'm realizing that the word "Wiener" is very likely to come straight from the Germanic languages, and as an American I have taken that for granted my whole life.

Consequently, my joke is hardly a joke because I'm making a pun off a word that means exactly the same as what my pun meant. Which wouldn't be very funny to an Austrian.

This is the most in-depth conversation about an unfunny joke I've ever seen.

[sweetandcool]

I'm trying to think, but nothing special comes to mind. Neither in german or english, nothing related to snow or mountains or a city name (bare 'Wien' maybe, but I fail to get a good pun myself). I hope it's nothing connected to WW2. Maybe I'm overthinking it.

So what do you call 'einen guten Jungen' or 'ein gutes Mädchen'?

A Wienerdog.

I suppose in Austrian the answer would be Wienerhund, but then the joke doesn't quite make sense.

Wow, bunny really didn't like your joke.

I was thinking the same thing:D

[sweetandcool]

I can't say I laughed too much about that, but the joke kinda makes sense, though there are a lot of people who wouldn't equalize Wien with Austria, at least here.

Also, what you call Wiener, we call it here Frankfurter (because a person from Frankfurt [who did so in Vienna] invented it and called it in homage of his birth city), though most other german speaking regions call it indeed Wiener (since it comes from Vienna and stuff, though they don't honour the inventors wish). At the end, it's just a hot dog.

We do have something called 'Wiener' here, but it's a kind of (sliced) sausage. If you are in a supermarket and go to the meat area ordering 'Wiener' there, you'll get that (well they would ask you how much 'deka' [from dekagram] of it you would want, so don't get confused there).

There is another use of 'Wiener', regarding the Schnitzel, so if you go into a viennese restaurant and order a 'Wiener', you'll get that, because no restaurant here would think it's a hot dog.

But yeah, if you are in Frankfurt, Berlin or Munich, ordering a Wiener would yield you (a pair of) hot dog sausages. Well not 100% sure on Munich, but pretty certain.

Anyway, no dog meat would be used, that is guaranteed. There are some places where you can get horsemeat though, which might not be something for americans.

In America we call it a hot dog, sometimes a Frank, wiener too though I think people trying to sound perverted like to refer to them that way.

And we very commonly call Daschunds, Wienerdogs because they look like wiggly walking hot dogs (wieners).

Now the joke was that (I assume) Wiener means citizen of Wien (Vienna) just like Frankfurter and Berliner.

Of course, Vienna is not Austria, but conveniently it is the capital so staging the joke the way I did makes sense to me.

The most amusing thing to me, is after all this I'm realizing that the word "Wiener" is very likely to come straight from the Germanic languages, and as an American I have taken that for granted my whole life.

Consequently, my joke is hardly a joke because I'm making a pun off a word that means exactly the same as what my pun meant. Which wouldn't be very funny to an Austrian.

This is the most in-depth conversation about an unfunny joke I've ever seen.

Perhaps the joke wasn't funny.

But it did lead to the realization that the nickname for Dachshunds is the height of comedy.

[BobMcBob]

But for real, next day we should each vote the person next in line on the player list and then ask Monarch what the vote count is so we can figure out who the lobbyist targeted and thus we can determine that the person targeted is not the Lobbyist. It isn’t much information, but it should help us out a teensy bit.

How do you all feel about this?

I like this more than bozo's plan.

[BobMcBob]

Following on from my previous post, Kak seems intent on getting us as little info as possible...

Do you think that Kakorroto mentioning he considered a No Kill, and removing his end vote, is scum indicative?

Inherently no. But combined with wanting to kill lukers I don't like. His reads list is also verbose to the point of being mostly filler, I've found I tend to do this more as scum

##vote Kak

I do a similar reads list pretty much every game, no matter what alignment I'm playing.

[Frogsterking]

no its part of his game as both alignments is that if he doesnt make you waste tons of time arguing nuances with him or pedantry - then he will get accused of being too off this game. so he does it as scum to look like his town game and he does it as town because he gets caught up in dead end topics and thinks he needs to just keep fighting with people

How soon do they do this?

Early enough to lead multiple D1 miskills because a town said something Jamie takes to be lying and is unwilling to give up on.

I meant as scum

[Frogsterking]

I like what I've seen from foodcoats so far. I'm not getting the kind of fun!kak vibes I hope for with him in the game. Jamie-brain argument reads like a classic case of Jamie-brain blowing each other up. Makes me think they're probably not both mafia.

Can you elaborate on both parts of this?

[Frogsterking]

Ugh foodoats wrote a great reply and now I have to move on from my scum!foodoats idea.

I'm not sure if I said this yet: Foodoats you can go please go ahead and post a full reads list with explanations sometime over the next few hours.

I have three town leans at the moment: brainbomb, Nephthys, and heartthrob.

I town lean brainbomb because of the battle with Jamie over his lfischl scumread (which is too long to quote). I think it is more likely that brainbomb is town who feels strongly about their read and that they have worked hard to contribute to town, and is angry that his reads are being questioned and his perceived value to town being undermined, than that brain is scum who is vigorously defending a scumread that has been questioned; there is simply so little value for scum to lean heavily into a single scum read so early in the game when there is a base 75% chance for town to miskill.

I townlean Nephthys and heartthrob less than brainbomb, for what I'd say is a pretty marginal clue: the interaction over Nephthys's mechanical framework.

Pointing out that this list appears to only include town roles. Also, I'd argue that there isn't really a distinction between "targets target" and "specific person" since I think in both cases you just get a name back. My list is a little different from yours in at least one place but I'll hold off from posting it if people are gonna frown at a mechanics discussion this early

I very much dislike this.
1. If you read my previous post, I asked for clarification on the targets target
2. Why would I include mafia? This is for us to work out our own roles?
3. I dislike how conflict averse you are

I've pondered this quite a bit. It is obviously possible for scum to use a mechanical idea to appear to be contributing to the team without making meaningful reads. But I think the key element in this interaction is the debate over the missing mafia roles. I think it is just marginally more likely that a scum player would include the scum roles if they had made this list, as they might have a blindspot as to how that is less relevant to town. So Nephthys excluding these roles makes it look like his head is in a townie space.

I think heartthrob is more likely town from this interaction because of the "gotcha" over the missing mafia roles. I don't see someone in a mafia headspace saying "gotcha, you forgot there's scum in the game!" It seems more like heartthrob is looking for threads to pull on to see if Nephthys might be scum.

[BobMcBob]

I like what I've seen from foodcoats so far. I'm not getting the kind of fun!kak vibes I hope for with him in the game. Jamie-brain argument reads like a classic case of Jamie-brain blowing each other up. Makes me think they're probably not both mafia.

Can you elaborate on both parts of this?

It's really not much deeper than what I've said there. Foodcoats has seemed thoughtful in his contributions so far. Kak often feels more fun than he does here (which is not the same as more towny, just an observation I had). The argument seemed relatively normal as far as overblown arguments between jamie and brain go, and I didn't get the vibe that it was scum-scum distancing.

[brainbomb]

Ive read everything frog has done and I think frog is mafia. the reason is the total lack of scumreads and the ease of townreads without much depth behind them

##Vote frog

[sweetandcool]

Ive read everything frog has done and I think frog is mafia. the reason is the total lack of scumreads and the ease of townreads without much depth behind them

##Vote frog

Stop reading my mind. Not sure if he is scum yet. Kind of reminds me of Xcution from M80. What do you think?

[bozotheclown]

But for real, next day we should each vote the person next in line on the player list and then ask Monarch what the vote count is so we can figure out who the lobbyist targeted and thus we can determine that the person targeted is not the Lobbyist. It isn’t much information, but it should help us out a teensy bit.

How do you all feel about this?

The role PM for the lobbyist says the extra vote does not show up until EOD.