MAFIA 83: HALLOWE'EN IN THE TOYSHOP - GAME THREAD

[damo666]

And Spirit you have all night to talk so fucking talk.

I am, I have been giving my side and will continue if people have questions.

Who you gonna NK?

[ND]

I can't believe what I am reading.

We shouldn't 'nail' Spirit for coming in, casting doubt on all clears and then voting to eliminate a town clear.

God help us.

[ND]

And Spirit you have all night to talk so fucking talk.

I am, I have been giving my side and will continue if people have questions.

Who you gonna NK?

I hope they kill me so I can get away from all of you dumbasses finally.

[damo666]

I can't believe what I am reading.

We shouldn't 'nail' Spirit for coming in, casting doubt on all clears and then voting to eliminate a town clear.

God help us.

I'm with you ND. The irony is Kak is probably scum on his own! (Or Will, now that would be funny).

[damo666]

I am, I have been giving my side and will continue if people have questions.

Who you gonna NK?

I hope they kill me so I can get away from all of you dumbasses finally.

They won't. Either me, Macca or HamB. Probably me.

[SpiritoftheRadio]

I hope they kill me so I can get away from all of you dumbasses finally.

I also pray for sweet release

Who you gonna NK?

Myself

[ND]

I can't believe what I am reading.

We shouldn't 'nail' Spirit for coming in, casting doubt on all clears and then voting to eliminate a town clear.

God help us.

I'm with you ND. The irony is Kak is probably scum on his own! (Or Will, now that would be funny).

Kak and Will are viable scum candidates. Spirit takes the cake though.

Will being scum would be funny actually lol.

[TheMadMonarch]

I mean Worcej was claiming a TOWN ONLY item and no one was countering him. So, yeah saving him was something I was willing to do even if it meant a tie. He told me not too so I didn't do it.

Thing is, there are 2 of those, so a cc wouldn't have meant anything.

NO! he claimed Shiels of which there is but one. Only Armour and Nurse are duplicated (potentially, at least one is).

Oh. I misread. Apologies.

Down to kill spirit now.

[ND]

btw @Macca

This is why you need to be online at EOD. You are a town clear and we just lost another town clear because you didn't move your vote and your wagon got saddled by Spirit -who is scum.

Okay I'm done with this conversation.

Say whatever you want @Spirit

But, unless it is out of this world then I have decided who I'm voting and that's that.

[ND]

I'm sorry I'm just mad. Anyway, I'm going to go make some dinner. Talk about this more later.

[SpiritoftheRadio]

Thing is, there are 2 of those, so a cc wouldn't have meant anything.

NO! he claimed Shiels of which there is but one. Only Armour and Nurse are duplicated (potentially, at least one is).

Oh. I misread. Apologies.

Down to kill spirit now.

I mean, it doesn't matter if there were one or two electroshields, it doesnt diminish the fact that a scum worcej would have needed a play to survive and thats why I thought it was likely he was scum. I dont think scum worcej would have done the math and neither did I at the time, but there were at that point 9 unclaimed items by my count and 3 potential people other than worcej who could have them (me, rdr, kak, and will, -1 because one of us has a card if you believe kak and the other claims people have made are true). That is a 6/9=66% chance of claiming an item no one has and getting away with it, better than he had that day without a claim tbh, and thats potentially booned if mafia knows town had the axe that killed ghug and knows another item themselves if one of their claims is fake already. This assumes you believe all the claims made up until worcej claimed of course.

I am happy with my decision. And would do so again knowing what I did then/will do so in future games in similar situations.

[JustAGuyNamedWill]

I can't believe what I am reading.

We shouldn't 'nail' Spirit for coming in, casting doubt on all clears and then voting to eliminate a town clear.

God help us.

I'm with you ND. The irony is Kak is probably scum on his own! (Or Will, now that would be funny).

Kak and Will are viable scum candidates. Spirit takes the cake though.

Will being scum would be funny actually lol.

I’ve never been known to be a comedian

[TheMadMonarch]

I'm with you ND. The irony is Kak is probably scum on his own! (Or Will, now that would be funny).

Kak and Will are viable scum candidates. Spirit takes the cake though.

Will being scum would be funny actually lol.

I’ve never been known to be a comedian

will is town

[ND]

NO! he claimed Shiels of which there is but one. Only Armour and Nurse are duplicated (potentially, at least one is).

Oh. I misread. Apologies.

Down to kill spirit now.

I mean, it doesn't matter if there were one or two electroshields, it doesnt diminish the fact that a scum worcej would have needed a play to survive and thats why I thought it was likely he was scum. I dont think scum worcej would have done the math and neither did I at the time, but there were at that point 9 unclaimed items by my count and 3 potential people other than worcej who could have them (me, rdr, kak, and will, -1 because one of us has a card if you believe kak and the other claims people have made are true). That is a 6/9=66% chance of claiming an item no one has and getting away with it, better than he had that day without a claim tbh, and thats potentially booned if mafia knows town had the axe that killed ghug and knows another item themselves if one of their claims is fake already. This assumes you believe all the claims made up until worcej claimed of course.

I am happy with my decision. And would do so again knowing what I did then/will do so in future games in similar situations.

Well, glad to know that you are happy with killing a town clear @Spirit and btw your decision sucked and is scum indicative.

[SpiritoftheRadio]

Well, glad to know that you are happy with killing a town clear @Spirit and btw your decision sucked and is scum indicative.

You also killed town ND. Yours had an item that wasnt town exclusive, but I had very good reasons to think mafia would lie to claim a town exclusive item which I have laid out very clearly. But you choose not to respond to my arguments, instead, you just keep saying im scum and ignoring them. I could have done this to you a day or two ago when you got sad and stormed off, but I have the common sense to realize town can miskill because they know nothing. I think my decision was the right one and can back it up with strategy and math. I will do this again regardless of alignment because it is a good move, and I believe that. You should actually try to understand if you are town, but honestly I'm on the side of you being scum, you arent even trying to figure the game out anymore. You're just looking to gloat because you either know nothing and think you have it solved when you dont or you're just thrilled everyone let you slide by after shooting vecna in the face and has forgotten about it.

[ND]

Well, glad to know that you are happy with killing a town clear @Spirit and btw your decision sucked and is scum indicative.

You also killed town ND. Yours had an item that wasnt town exclusive, but I had very good reasons to think mafia would lie to claim a town exclusive item which I have laid out very clearly. But you choose not to respond to my arguments, instead, you just keep saying im scum and ignoring them. I could have done this to you a day or two ago when you got sad and stormed off, but I have the common sense to realize town can miskill because they know nothing. I think my decision was the right one and can back it up with strategy and math. I will do this again regardless of alignment because it is a good move, and I believe that. You should actually try to understand if you are town, but honestly I'm on the side of you being scum, you arent even trying to figure the game out anymore. You're just looking to gloat because you either know nothing and think you have it solved when you dont or you're just thrilled everyone let you slide by after shooting vecna in the face and has forgotten about it.

What argument? Are you serious? What do you think warrants a response? You just killed a town clear??

My scum suspects from N2 were obviously incorrect. Not only did I waste my item on it. I’m still salty that I also wasted around 4 hours of my life writing 15 pages in google docs about why I was going to shoot Vecna if he was alive D3. So, we all make mistakes. If that is your point then I agree that mistakes can be made. However, you can’t tell me that my logic from N2 is faulty. A town player claiming to have a gun is a huge threat to the mafia and the fact that Vecna was still alive D3 was highly suspect at the time. However, the smart play would have been and should have been to shoot Brain regardless. I went for the gamble and I turned up snake eyes.

That is not the same as what you did. The difference was I knew, for a fact, that Vecna was lying about having the item. I reasoned there were two possibilities for his lie. The first, was that he was trying to bait the kill. The second, was that he was trying to draw out the thief so the thief could be killed and the threat I posed to the mafia team could be eliminated. I guess he was trying to bait the kill and the mafia team didn’t buy it. In the end, he died for me being wrong but his play was solid.

You simply voted to kill a player claiming a town specific item who was not countered. Thus, you voted to kill a town clear and succeeded. Now, instead of having four town clears in Worcej, Damo, Macca, Hamilton we have three. At this point in the game, the scum need to eliminate as many town clears as humanly possible. You just did their bidding if you are town. And if you are town there is nothing you can say which will justify your vote. It was the wrong thing to do. If you are town then you should have voted yourself over letting a town clear die. That’s what I would have done. I was even willing to tie the game so that this travesty didn’t happen.

At the end of the day I’m not a town clear and if my presence ever becomes detrimental to solving this game then I am more than willing to self vote and die. If my death can help further the town in winning then I’m at peace with it. You had that chance today, but instead you choose to kill a town clear over self sacrifice. If you are town and have something earth shattering to say then say it and stop complaining. Make your case, but trying to justify this vote is simply stupid if you are town because you aren’t changing my mind on it.

However, if you are scum then what you did is a fairly good move if you have a teammate. Because you are essentially dead Spirit. You bought yourself one day. Maybe two. You were able to get rid of a town clear and that is the name of the game for your team. I am sure you feel accomplished in doing that. And I am sure you will widdle it down further tonight by taking another clear out. But, we all know the game you are playing here. I’m not a moron though and your gimmicks aren’t going to fool me. What you did oozes scum and I’ll point it out for as long as I am alive. I don’t see how you spin your way out of it.

[JustAGuyNamedWill]

Looks like we found ND a new tunnel

[damo666]

NO! he claimed Shiels of which there is but one. Only Armour and Nurse are duplicated (potentially, at least one is).

Oh. I misread. Apologies.

Down to kill spirit now.

I mean, it doesn't matter if there were one or two electroshields, it doesnt diminish the fact that a scum worcej would have needed a play to survive and thats why I thought it was likely he was scum. I dont think scum worcej would have done the math and neither did I at the time, but there were at that point 9 unclaimed items by my count and 3 potential people other than worcej who could have them (me, rdr, kak, and will, -1 because one of us has a card if you believe kak and the other claims people have made are true). That is a 6/9=66% chance of claiming an item no one has and getting away with it, better than he had that day without a claim tbh, and thats potentially booned if mafia knows town had the axe that killed ghug and knows another item themselves if one of their claims is fake already. This assumes you believe all the claims made up until worcej claimed of course.

I am happy with my decision. And would do so again knowing what I did then/will do so in future games in similar situations.

Assuming your 2/3 is correct (CBA) then there was a 2/3 chance he guessed a dead item IF HE WAS SCUM

as opposed to a 100% chance IF HE WAS TOWN.

If you are town I think you are backfitting false logic on your error because you had falsely presupposed worcej was scum.

Or you're scum.

[damo666]

The NK is probably me or Macca or HamB (anybody else would be doing us a POE favour and might have armour so extremely doubtful scum kill outside these three). If the second nurse is out there (7/8 chance I think) you have a 1 in 3 chance of a save. Guess wisely.

Chance of no NK therefore 7/24.

You'll be unsurpised to hear this is wrong. Nurse chance is 4/9 so chance of NK about 85%.

Anyway, much more interesting post to follow.

[damo666]

You'll probably think I shouldn't post this at night but as I am likely NK I must.

I have a theory about darg's NK. Maybe Kak is scum and darg sent the card. If Kak is scum I think the cardholder would be NKd. In particular if Kak is scum the Macca NK makes no sense as a likely save target unless the cardholder WAS ALREADY DEAD.

Conversely, if the card holder is still alive then I think this more or less clears Kak.

Therefore I propose that at start of D5 the cardholder should reveal thus giving us two more [almost] clears thus reducing the POE to 4 and likely town victory. By my reckoning the possible cardholders are: Spirit, Will, rdr, deaddarg, deadbozo or not in play and Kak is lying (negligible I'd have thought).

This is my idea of likely scum order in the event of possible claimants:-

Claimant Scum Order
None Kak Spirit Will rdr Demon ND
Spirit Demon Will rdr ND
Will Spirit Demon rdr ND
rdr Spirit Demon Will ND

I think it reasonable to give the cardholder 24 hours to claim. If 24 hours into D5 there is no claim I think you can start voting Kak.