M80 Game Thread

[Haze with a Z]

Haze, what do you think so far?

1. You are mad at me
2. X probably isn't being as aggressive as last game because they haven't been mentioned as much in passing and I havent seen walls by them yet.
3. kak seemed town at first, I can't remember what they have done since whenever I talked to them first which ig would have to be yesterday.
4. brain/boma prob town, also liking edin and wor.
5. I made a list and I'm gonna get hate for this list.

Acceptable list length.

I was expecting you to want to kill me and have already voted for talking about your one post tbh.

[ghug]

1. You are mad at me
2. X probably isn't being as aggressive as last game because they haven't been mentioned as much in passing and I havent seen walls by them yet.
3. kak seemed town at first, I can't remember what they have done since whenever I talked to them first which ig would have to be yesterday.
4. brain/boma prob town, also liking edin and wor.
5. I made a list and I'm gonna get hate for this list.

Acceptable list length.

I was expecting you to want to kill me and have already voted for talking about your one post tbh.

Lol don't worry, I'm just being silly.

[President Eden]

Acceptable list length.

I was expecting you to want to kill me and have already voted for talking about your one post tbh.

Lol don't worry, I'm just being silly.

you guys are heartwarming truly

but Haze didn't name a single suspicion there and you didn't say anything about it

sup with that

[ghug]

I was expecting you to want to kill me and have already voted for talking about your one post tbh.

Lol don't worry, I'm just being silly.

you guys are heartwarming truly

but Haze didn't name a single suspicion there and you didn't say anything about it

sup with that

I'm letting Haze cook.

[bozotheclown]

Yes, because attentive scum will piece it together now because you wouldn't think to drop it.

And this is better…how?

Whatever. I’ll move you to my town core…apologies for misreading you.

I think it was apparent he would be the DK over that post once you started pushing it if he did not claim PR, so I would not rule out a fake claim. However, that will resolve itself eventually.

[bozotheclown]

well, I'm sure you'll figure out my alignment fast enough.

I still would've loved some commentary from Bunny.

Also, do me a favour, if/when fox comes back later, ask him a few questions. The same goes for people who haven't been here yet, that would be great.

I think I'll head into the direction of my hammock, since I'm starting to feel dizzy and aren't reading fast enough to follow the thread anymore (which is good, go on guys, we make good speed!). So I'll wish you a good night and see you later

Why specifically Foxcastle, and if you had questions for him, why not ask him yourself?

Bozo.

Why is this only your second post?

Why was your first post a naked vote?

What was the reason for that vote?

1. I try not to post when I am not caught up on the thread.

2. It wasn't, the context for my vote was in the post I responded to.

3. I thought my reason was obvious, so before I answer this question directly, I would like to make a request for you to read that post again and see if you can figure out my reason.

[bozotheclown]

What if, and hear me out here, we didn't do pointless walls of text.

*gasp*

you say it as if my literary masterpieces are less worth than soaked flotsam ...

At least soaked flotsam can be used to beat some sense into someone...

This seemed to me like something someone would be more likely to say to a mafia teammate. Was this a serious attempt to dissuade Kakarroto from continuing making the kind of posts you were objecting to?

[bozotheclown]

So just to be clear I am not opinioned on your target. You may have valid points. I fail to see how shutting down every single other consideration under the umbrella of they caught scum once, is sensible as a way to consider players alignments. I asked how to read them. data on tells, meta, past posting styles. scum traits.

you gave me nothing and retreated to calling me scum for asking. and youve launched into this crazed appeal to audience machine that seems hell bent on misconstruing my intentions

Again with the BS manipulation. Are you incapable of speaking plainly?

I haven’t told anybody not to vote for any of these people. I explained why I don’t think it’s wise. This is not difficult. I have done no “shutting down” of discussion on them or anyone else, unless you define that to mean that me voicing my opinion = “shutting down,” which is bullshit.

There is no “crazed appeal to audience machine” here. If you don’t want your intentions misconstrued, stop making shit up.

I'm kind of baffled by the current President Eden vs. Brainbomb fight right now. I know President Eden knows better and can understand other people. And while I don't know Brainbomb, I suspect they also are intelligent.

So why are they spending so much energy on misunderstanding each other? Kind of feels town vs. town, but could also be some advanced Royalist vs. Royalist stuff, especially since neither has sent off an emotional vote for the other.

I could be persuaded to vote one of them, and if we get lucky and catch Mafia, that might tell us the other one is as well.

TLDR: I think both are Town, or less likely but possibly Mafia. I don't think they are different alignments.

I don't see a reason to rule out T vs. M.

[sweetandcool]

Again with the BS manipulation. Are you incapable of speaking plainly?

I haven’t told anybody not to vote for any of these people. I explained why I don’t think it’s wise. This is not difficult. I have done no “shutting down” of discussion on them or anyone else, unless you define that to mean that me voicing my opinion = “shutting down,” which is bullshit.

There is no “crazed appeal to audience machine” here. If you don’t want your intentions misconstrued, stop making shit up.

I'm kind of baffled by the current President Eden vs. Brainbomb fight right now. I know President Eden knows better and can understand other people. And while I don't know Brainbomb, I suspect they also are intelligent.

So why are they spending so much energy on misunderstanding each other? Kind of feels town vs. town, but could also be some advanced Royalist vs. Royalist stuff, especially since neither has sent off an emotional vote for the other.

I could be persuaded to vote one of them, and if we get lucky and catch Mafia, that might tell us the other one is as well.

TLDR: I think both are Town, or less likely but possibly Mafia. I don't think they are different alignments.

I don't see a reason to rule out T vs. M.

I don't recall precisely what convinced me at that moment, but later on when their argument came to a head, Brainbomb was just so emotionally raw it could only be coming from Town. And either Eden is town, or just by coincidence they are Mafia. I don't see why Mafia would pick such a silly fight on purpose.

[ghug]

Again with the BS manipulation. Are you incapable of speaking plainly?

I haven’t told anybody not to vote for any of these people. I explained why I don’t think it’s wise. This is not difficult. I have done no “shutting down” of discussion on them or anyone else, unless you define that to mean that me voicing my opinion = “shutting down,” which is bullshit.

There is no “crazed appeal to audience machine” here. If you don’t want your intentions misconstrued, stop making shit up.

I'm kind of baffled by the current President Eden vs. Brainbomb fight right now. I know President Eden knows better and can understand other people. And while I don't know Brainbomb, I suspect they also are intelligent.

So why are they spending so much energy on misunderstanding each other? Kind of feels town vs. town, but could also be some advanced Royalist vs. Royalist stuff, especially since neither has sent off an emotional vote for the other.

I could be persuaded to vote one of them, and if we get lucky and catch Mafia, that might tell us the other one is as well.

TLDR: I think both are Town, or less likely but possibly Mafia. I don't think they are different alignments.

I don't see a reason to rule out T vs. M.

I feel like SvS is the thing I'd rule out.

[bozotheclown]

I'm kind of baffled by the current President Eden vs. Brainbomb fight right now. I know President Eden knows better and can understand other people. And while I don't know Brainbomb, I suspect they also are intelligent.

So why are they spending so much energy on misunderstanding each other? Kind of feels town vs. town, but could also be some advanced Royalist vs. Royalist stuff, especially since neither has sent off an emotional vote for the other.

I could be persuaded to vote one of them, and if we get lucky and catch Mafia, that might tell us the other one is as well.

TLDR: I think both are Town, or less likely but possibly Mafia. I don't think they are different alignments.

I don't see a reason to rule out T vs. M.

I don't recall precisely what convinced me at that moment, but later on when their argument came to a head, Brainbomb was just so emotionally raw it could only be coming from Town. And either Eden is town, or just by coincidence they are Mafia. I don't see why Mafia would pick such a silly fight on purpose.

Mafia need something to do, but I agree the exchange itself does not make either one more likely to be mafia.

[brainbomb]

The infuriating thing is that all the substance of the debate is being glossed over to focus on the argument aspect of it and how the argument is alignment indicative. but the shit Eden was saying was and still is out of character for how he usually plays with effort and energy. I still dont feel a whole lot of good faith analysis has come from him.

[brainbomb]

examples of ridiculous statements galore

like his progresssion on S&C and the whole thing about whether he was role playing as a british person or not

and then claiming that Damo was town because when damo is town he tends to pick a scumread and then unvote. and uses the Jamie example with no context whatsoever to claim it fits that mould.

[brainbomb]

I have a hard time beleiving that all damo has to do to become a townread is push someone and then unvote them. and this is some habitual thing he only does as town

[brainbomb]

those are my key points I take away from the eden vs myself discussion. was some very questionable and uneven - albeit out of character moments by Eden that seem ripe with scum scent

[sweetandcool]

Do you not know how to converse? Why is everything about questions? You've played a single game yet you think there's one way to go about things?

holy shit you could cut the irony with a knife

I mean, I can talk and respond without needing to be asked questions.

I think it's hilarious that you only spoke in questions here. But moving on, I finally got around to reviewing post history and I think I know what's going on.

Post 572: You bring up the issue that you think I'm being too self aware and "nervous".

Post 853: You quote my response, where I explain that I am only nervous about D1 because I don't know how to play it. I guess it didn't satisfy your concern about my self awareness, but it was a good faith effort to address your concerns.

This post confused me because the first sentence seemed to imply to me that you asked me questions that I did not answer. It turns out no questions were asked, and in fact you went on to reiterate the concerns that I thought I had just addressed.

Post 1018: You claim to have been asking me questions that I have not been answering. This further confused me into thinking you had mysterious questions that I did not understand. It turns out this was not the case. You never asked a question.

Post 1023: You quote my response to 1018. I do a better job of addressing your concern about my self-awareness (though I felt like I was essentially repeating myself). It turns out you really don't like questions because you never asked any here. But you again reiterated your views for like the third time, but finally you demand I give you two people I would shoot and two people I would save. Essentially a question, and finally something new to work with.

Post 1127: Fun sidenote here, but Jamiet complains about you railing against him without asking any questions. And other than a page 13 question, which could have easily been missed, you never really asked them anything substantial either. Hilariously in this post you practically ask them nothing of note, yet again. Maybe you're the problem here....

Post 1170: Claims not to give a fuck about my newness, yet makes it a talking point. Okay, in writing this summary so far, I can see how my newness wasn't the focus of your concern, but you were incorporating it as a talking point. And I'm annoyed this still has to be dredged up yet again.

I mean, it seems that you can't accept my explanations as to why I am self-aware. Nothing seems to satisfy you. And you keep coming back to the point that I am new as a justification for your position. Pretty hypocritical, but I suppose in this post it's clear you are finally being emotional as well.

I'm also going to take this opportunity to point out that you are distracting us both from wolf hunting. Has this issue actually been so concerning to you that you think it's the most productive thing you could be doing? It really makes me hope you are Mafia because clearly I'm terrible at blowing people off when they are wasting my time.

Post 1179: Finally, you start laying down the questions, and regain the more productive mindset that was promised by your behavior at the beginning of the game. It took some begging from me, and even Jamiet making the same complete, but we finally got there.

Post 1186: This is too funny because poor Jamiet has to deal with your response which contains no questions. The poor guy just asked you what you wanted to him, and you respond by mocking him. Just ask him a damn question and you'll probably get an answer.

Post 1266: I really don't get this response. Despite you hardly giving me any direct answers, I actually had been addressing all of your concerns over and over. So I'm pretty pleased I managed to interpret what you wanted, and made a good effort to address your concerns. The issue is that you didn't like any of my responses, but somehow you've decided I'm complaining about questions.

Again, I guess the issue here is that your behavior seemed to indicated I wasn't addressing your concerns, and so I concluded you must have some questions for me. I asked you what questions you had and instead of formulating something, you just whined.

It really comes down to me not wanting to make the extra effort of reading your mind, and you not wanting to make the extra effort to spoon-feed me what's on your mind.

I haven't responded to your last post or two, so I guess that is next. But I can see now that, bizarrely, part of the issue in communication between us is that your behavior indicated to me that you had questions for me, and for some reason you hated being asked what those questions were. And in the other direction, you felt like you weren't asking questions, you just wanted a dialogue where I convinced you that I wasn't Mafia, or something along those lines, I'm really still a bit fuzzy on what your goal was since it doesn't seem like you've ever been prepared to listen to anything I've said.

[sweetandcool]

TLDR for everybody that isn't X:

X really hates questions. They'll say things that imply questions that they want addressed, but asking a question is not something they generally like to do, even if you request them to clarify what you want from them.

Interpret any way you like, but so far the energy they've spent on me has been an exercise in futility that definitely makes them look busy while being incredibly unproductive. They may have a point that me being self-aware is weird (actually, I don't really get it, but other people like Foxcastle for example do, so I guess it's a thing), but they really haven't followed up with any substantial content.

I'm scumreading them big time, because they definitely believe that producing content and looking busy is important work for Mafia, and it's something they have been doing masterfully. They are capable of much better, and I think we would have seen that if they were town.

Please, ##VOTE Xcution , and rid us of someone who is much more likely to be Mafia than not.

[sweetandcool]

You don't even wolf read me?? wut

I mean, I don't take notes during games, so you'll have to excuse me if I missed your reason for wanting to protect Kak (you already explained why you'd protect him?).

Okay, how did you feel about Eden throughout that interaction then? You're confident about Brain and protecting him, but now thoughts on Eden?

I don't take notes, I use peterbot.

Here: http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/game_status?g=80

I tend to scumread Eden, but I think it's irrational. I think Brainbomb and Eden are same alignment, and I think Brainbomb is Town.

Since you like questions so much.

1. How do you tend to wolf read Eden despite only playing a single game with them?

2. Why do you think Brain and Eden are the same alignment?

3. How do you progress from saying you tend to wolf read Eden, yet in your very next sentence say that Eden is town?

1. Last game I scumread them from the get go because I felt like they were pocketing me. This read progressed into a definitive read that turned out to be correct. However, in the beginning, I felt really conflicted because the pocketing was subtle and consequently I felt like I was being irrationally sensitive.

This game I've felt similarly. It's just that President Eden has been taking a new tact of doing the opposite of pocketing me, which in itself feels like a pocket. Which sounds crazy.

So I conclude that I tend to scumread President Eden, and when they flip this game, I will find out whether my scumreading is unfair or not. But right now I think a proper scumread of them is unfair. Of course, a dive through their posts might give me more clarity, but I wasted that effort on you instead.

2. I think this will be the third time I've explained, so low effort post incoming: Brainbomb got pretty emotional at the end of their argument that felt absolutely Town. Considering the nature of the argument and its content, I doubt Mafia President Eden would have wanted to pursue it. So either President Eden is unlucky and emotional Mafia (no way), or they are Town.

3. I probably addressed that more or less in (1). If not, maybe you can do some work referencing posts, because I've done plenty and it's time for you to do your homework instead of mooching off of me.

[sweetandcool]

Wow, it has been actually a bit cathartic getting out my first proper wall post. Don't worry everybody, unlike last game I am still pacing myself. I've set a personal limit for one wall post for D1 and I'm going to do my best to stick to it.

[pyxxy]

"What posts of Bona's made you think he was "building to something,""
Not posts, more my mental model of his cadence.

Right, but I assume he did some things early besides that one post you quoted to convince you that he was hitting that cadence. Did he?

hello I'm back

same caveat about this being post-rationalization of my feelings as I go through Bona's ISO to find examples

so i want to vote you

What does stop you voting him? Not saying that you should, just asking why you are not?


Also, how do you like my pirate name?

voting first is inauspicious

kak doesnt seem very town.

its quite look at me im so town; but its mostly flavour talk and randomly deciding people are pirates

someone says this every game

i similarly dislike this

Sure. Care to explain? Why have you decided to just say you dislike my posts yet fail to answer my question or clarify your reasons?

i didn't fail to answer your question - i just hadn't attempted it at that time

to extemporize, i dislike this post specifically because it's Serious and uses big words like Wolf Reading and Pressure and Throwaway, when i only know words less than 7 letters, and it's day 1, so like, who cares man? just figure it out later and have fun now

i feel like someone unused to webdip is likely to enter day 1 on a different gear than most other people here are on, and their reactions to that (and if and how they switch gears to be in sync) is revealing