MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

[Balki Bartokomous]

I get the point that Chaqa is a #chaosmonkey. Can anyone identify another game I should look at where a VT!Chaqa defended himself against a push by claiming a PR?

I can certainly understand a VT claiming a PR to bait a night kill. But trying to deflect attention and avoid a chop using a fake PR claim is something different to me, and I'd like to see an example of town chaqa doing that if you know one.

[Chaqa]

I'm not sure if I've ever done that, but I have as mafia spent a solid four night phases shooting doctor claimants unsuccessfully.

[bozotheclown]

I really wish he'd don't the ballad of bozo...I'd be curious about that. Been tickling at me every since he phoned in the questionnaire and never followed up on it.

I looked at the results, but did not see much to conclude other than damo and/or rdrivera could have been distancing from lfischl, and Chaqa and bo_sox did not respond. I still the results can be useful when/if we DK a second mafia, although the lack of full participation limits its usefulness.

[KoalaAttack]

@koala after a shower I decided I'd be willing to consider Balki *IF* you get an item for it. I don't particularly scum read him, but a doc save is worth a lot to us. A gun might be worth something too.

Not saying I'll definitely follow through, but I'm willing to consider it.

Question for Bunny and others – wait, so you want me to claim my PR role?

Can someone please walk me through the Pros & Cons of claiming PR role vs keeping it ambiguous?

Specifically, Gambler is not the only role with high risk, depending on who said risk falls onto :)

Gambler might get us another day if we prevent a NK. Hopefully either you or Bunny are CWV to get us another mk and virtually certain success.

If you are gambler I suggest you claim and say who you bet on. If you are not gambler simply say "I am not gambler". If Bunny is gambler (which I doubt) and the vote is not going the way he wants he should announce with say 1 hour left.

@Koala, it’s hard for the rest of us to speculate on whether you should give a more specific claim. You need to look at your power and consider how it may play out. Then look at all of the potential Town PR roles and consider how their potential existence impacts scum night actions.

I think that having ambiguity in both your role and Bunny’s role is very valuable. But you are in the best position to know.

I claim non-Doctor.



Well let me troll the Mafia team first and ask a Question second.

There are 4 possible scenarios:

- Scenario 1 is I am a straight arrow new player who has been indeed intentionally dropping hints implying I am a Gambler as Damo has picked up on way back when. Which means that there is a chance for Town to get an item that would hurt Mafia.

- Scenario 2 is I have been subtly baiting and taunting the Mafia team to come kill me for several nights as I'm sure y'all noticed because I am that other high-risk role with PTSD – and as you say it would be really neat to see them try and lose the game as the result.

- Scenario 3 is I am a Tracker / Watcher who simply has not Tracked or Watched the right target because I am a new player and am still hoping to use my supreme powers to help save the Town from the Mafia plague.

- Scenario 4 is I am a Gun Smith. This is the most confusing scenario given the 2 guns and whether I have given them or not so far.



The first 2 are for sure my favorite, it's like a 50/50 gamble to get shot – with both puns intended! But maybe I'm just sharing them first and dropping all these hints to distract from the reality of 3 or 4? Oh my, it's so fun to be evil while Town!



Question for Bunny only: would it be more valuable to keep this ambiguity or would it be more valuable to give you certain knowledge?

[bozotheclown]

Wait...why're you giving rdr credit for that move on day 2?

He moved first. Then FISH panicked and followed. That would be FISH making a panic play, right?

I'm not. I'm giving him credit for days 1 and 3.

I don't understand what you think about rdrivera's votes D1 and D3 are inconsistent with him being mafia.

[bozotheclown]

Voting

Shit...this is cocky "I'm winning" damo....I hate that I can only read you on vibes.

His D1 vote move from fish to pyx makes no sense from a scumBo. That is why I've eliminated him from my enquiries.

We have 1 mk. If we continue to dk from Balki/Bozo/Chaqa we can't lose.

I think I have asked this already, but do you believe bo_sox as mafia would think it would look better to end the day on a one vote wagon that he justified as participation pressure than to do what he did?

[bozotheclown]

@koala after a shower I decided I'd be willing to consider Balki *IF* you get an item for it. I don't particularly scum read him, but a doc save is worth a lot to us. A gun might be worth something too.

Not saying I'll definitely follow through, but I'm willing to consider it.

Question for Bunny and others – wait, so you want me to claim my PR role?

Can someone please walk me through the Pros & Cons of claiming PR role vs keeping it ambiguous?

Specifically, Gambler is not the only role with high risk, depending on who said risk falls onto :)

Given the role possibilities, I do not see a reason to claim your role at this point, unless you think it is important enough for BunnyGo to know that you are willing to let the mafia know.

[rdrivera2005]

Shit...this is cocky "I'm winning" damo....I hate that I can only read you on vibes.

His D1 vote move from fish to pyx makes no sense from a scumBo. That is why I've eliminated him from my enquiries.

We have 1 mk. If we continue to dk from Balki/Bozo/Chaqa we can't lose.

I think I have asked this already, but do you believe bo_sox as mafia would think it would look better to end the day on a one vote wagon that he justified as participation pressure than to do what he did?

I agree that thate vote alone isn't a good reason to townread Bo, but looking his overall play is very similar to M76 where he was town and we fought pretty hard at some point.

I am starting to consider I might be wrong pairing Damo/Chaqa as I can't see a reason for them to buss each other this hard. I need to look if Chaqa and Bozo makes sense.

I need to re-read Balki, but those posts last night didn't seem scum faking, even knowing Balki is a good scum player.

[damo666]

I'm beginning to doubt my reads now tbh. I still think it's Chaqa and Bozo but I'm not as confident.

[damo666]

The only downside in Koala making a gambler/not gambler declaration I can think of is that if he declares gambler maf will kill him before Bunny (fear of CWV). But the upside would be he could tell us his bet and we kill that person and with any luck Koala can save himself anyway. Then repeat.

Am I missing anything? Looks a no-brainer to me.

[BunnyGo]

About to drive through a storm. So not around for several hours.

@koala. Keep your cards close for now. I’d only claim things that give no intel to scum like “I was roleblocked” since the scum team KNOWS you were (for example).

[damo666]

I can’t rule it out. Haven’t investigated that one in particular. Bozo hasn’t really been on my radar screen in this game, but he has fooled me before as a scum player, so I respect his scum game.

Is there something specific about that pair that makes you suspect it?

It's more than I rule out the rest.

I don’t think that your method of ruling out Bo for his Day 1 vote is convincing at all. Scum!Bo would not have placed much value on staying on a 1-vote vanity wagon for lfischl. He would not have expected to get credit for staying there, so the fact that he did not stay there is not town-indicative.

I admit it is weak.

[damo666]

Wait...why're you giving rdr credit for that move on day 2?

He moved first. Then FISH panicked and followed. That would be FISH making a panic play, right?

I'm not. I'm giving him credit for days 1 and 3.

I don't understand what you think about rdrivera's votes D1 and D3 are inconsistent with him being mafia.

I think it unlikely scumrdr would start a new wagon if a scummate was at risk.

[damo666]

Shit...this is cocky "I'm winning" damo....I hate that I can only read you on vibes.

His D1 vote move from fish to pyx makes no sense from a scumBo. That is why I've eliminated him from my enquiries.

We have 1 mk. If we continue to dk from Balki/Bozo/Chaqa we can't lose.

I think I have asked this already, but do you believe bo_sox as mafia would think it would look better to end the day on a one vote wagon that he justified as participation pressure than to do what he did?

Yes.

[damo666]

@koala after a shower I decided I'd be willing to consider Balki *IF* you get an item for it. I don't particularly scum read him, but a doc save is worth a lot to us. A gun might be worth something too.

Not saying I'll definitely follow through, but I'm willing to consider it.

Question for Bunny and others – wait, so you want me to claim my PR role?

Can someone please walk me through the Pros & Cons of claiming PR role vs keeping it ambiguous?

Specifically, Gambler is not the only role with high risk, depending on who said risk falls onto :)

Given the role possibilities, I do not see a reason to claim your role at this point, unless you think it is important enough for BunnyGo to know that you are willing to let the mafia know.

But what about simply gambler or not?

[Balki Bartokomous]

Question for Bunny and others – wait, so you want me to claim my PR role?

Can someone please walk me through the Pros & Cons of claiming PR role vs keeping it ambiguous?

Specifically, Gambler is not the only role with high risk, depending on who said risk falls onto :)

Given the role possibilities, I do not see a reason to claim your role at this point, unless you think it is important enough for BunnyGo to know that you are willing to let the mafia know.

But what about simply gambler or not?

Let's put faith in our PRs and leave it to them at this point. They have more information than we do about what is optimal.

[Chaqa]

Why don't we RCV this bitch.

Candidates: Balki, bozo, bo_sox, Chaqa, damo, rivera

My ballot:
1 - Damo
2 - Balki
3- Bozo
4 - Bo_sox
5 - Rivera

Please submit your Mafia RCV ballot.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Why don't we RCV this bitch.

Candidates: Balki, bozo, bo_sox, Chaqa, damo, rivera

My ballot:
1 - Damo
2 - Balki
3- Bozo
4 - Bo_sox
5 - Rivera

Please submit your Mafia RCV ballot.

How about you spend your time reading the game and telling us what you've learned based on all of the new information that you have from all the flips/clear towns. I think that would be more productive than a bunch of voting that is meaningless because the town clears are going to make the final decisions and so anything any of the VTs says has no consequence.

Sincerely,
Balki

[Chaqa]

Why don't we RCV this bitch.

Candidates: Balki, bozo, bo_sox, Chaqa, damo, rivera

My ballot:
1 - Damo
2 - Balki
3- Bozo
4 - Bo_sox
5 - Rivera

Please submit your Mafia RCV ballot.

How about you spend your time reading the game and telling us what you've learned based on all of the new information that you have from all the flips/clear towns. I think that would be more productive than a bunch of voting that is meaningless because the town clears are going to make the final decisions and so anything any of the VTs says has no consequence.

Sincerely,
Balki

There's no new information to be gleaned. Lfischl was scum as I thought and worcej was doctor as he claimed. The game state is the same and to me it's just a matter of figuring out which order we go through the suspects in.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Why don't we RCV this bitch.

Candidates: Balki, bozo, bo_sox, Chaqa, damo, rivera

My ballot:
1 - Damo
2 - Balki
3- Bozo
4 - Bo_sox
5 - Rivera

Please submit your Mafia RCV ballot.

How about you spend your time reading the game and telling us what you've learned based on all of the new information that you have from all the flips/clear towns. I think that would be more productive than a bunch of voting that is meaningless because the town clears are going to make the final decisions and so anything any of the VTs says has no consequence.

Sincerely,
Balki

There's no new information to be gleaned. Lfischl was scum as I thought and worcej was doctor as he claimed. The game state is the same and to me it's just a matter of figuring out which order we go through the suspects in.

We recently learned:

ghug is town
Yav is town
Bunny is town
Koala is town
worcej is town
Lfischl is scum

You were aware of all that before we learned it?