M1023: Mafarmia [GAME THREAD] [HIDDEN]

[Bonatogether]

It could be valuable and it isn't costing us anything of merit. Bona dismisses the fake pets inserted by scum to mean nothing, but they could very easily be their downfall if they fucked up their claims.

Several people are claiming it shows who we think could be a PR, but I fall in the camp of the fact scum don't give a fuck who the sheep think are a PR - they're going to go with their own information gathering attempts. Let's say we all ended up petting the same person - does that mean they will kill there for sure? Fuck no it doesn't.

call me when we catch any scum with this

fuck yeah it means that everyone thought that this guy was pr lmao

Again - who cares who we think is a PR?

I think Chaqa is a PR - does that move your needle at all?

would you say who you think is a pr in any other game? lmao

[Bonatogether]

And here is why we're different - it's actually this:

the cost is nil
the benefits are medium

Town should want to build upon information to develop potential connections and facts for future flips. Wanting to limit any information gathering is inherently scummy.

what information have we gained

riddle me this

You gain nothing now - the advantage comes as the game progresses, similar to VCA.

i think i'll gain nothing later too

[Bonatogether]

Stating our scan does not tell the mafia anything about who the dog is.

IT LITERALLY TELLS YOU WHO EACH PLAYER THOUGHT WAS PR

i swear to god this is not fucking hard to understand

WHY IS THAT INFORMATION VALUABLE!?!

did you actually like understand the post i made or are you just like a chat bot

[Bonatogether]

it's self-evident why that information is valuable

[Bonatogether]

im mad

Good - so what dog did you pet?

didn't pet any dogs

[Bonatogether]

Apologies for lack of engagement, it's been a pretty busy time for me.

The main discussion point at the moment seems to be the survey. The main advantage I can see is that it will get progressively more uncomfortable for scum. The dog itself has to make it up (not that's a problem of itself and anybody finding the dog has to invent subsequently (again not a problem). The problem is I don't see how we gain and I am worried that there are so many antis, there may be a downside I cannot see for myself. I trust rdr and for that reason I am not going to participate.

I don't think Bozo has done this maliciously and suspect the votes on him are misplaced.

This is a fair take/analysis of the situation. The ones being stubborn about the survey are making any value impossible to get down the road.

Considering, if an objector is town, that a substantial amount of their team has already participated at this point, they should just participate and actually try to cooperate versus being a stick in the mud at this point.

[Bonatogether]

never lied as town

[rdrivera2005]

Because you’re talking about it

Abd why this is good? We are spending most of the day discussing survey mechanics which fits perfectly scum agenda.

You are free to discuss something else. If I flip today and you find out that I am town, who do you think are likely to be the 3 mafia? Or, if you are sure I am mafia, who do you think my teammates are?

In fact you flipping over this survey thing isn't great, we gather few info on interaction and reasons to vote you. If you are scum I expect at least one scum to be bussing you at some point and the other to either defend the survey or stay away from the discussion. Chaqa and Celaph could fit.

[rdrivera2005]

Abd why this is good? We are spending most of the day discussing survey mechanics which fits perfectly scum agenda.

You are free to discuss something else. If I flip today and you find out that I am town, who do you think are likely to be the 3 mafia? Or, if you are sure I am mafia, who do you think my teammates are?

In fact you flipping over this survey thing isn't great, we gather few info on interaction and reasons to vote you. If you are scum I expect at least one scum to be bussing you at some point and the other to either defend the survey or stay away from the discussion. Chaqa and Celaph could fit.

Forgot the option you flip town. In this case I would need to re-read Kak and Bona to see if they voted you oportunisticaly or not. Would also add Bo to my suspect list as his defense of your survey makes more sense as buddying than any other thing.

[rdrivera2005]

Earlier I asked people about ghug and why the mafia would target him. The answers so far were pretty decent (I'd disagree with the ones who would say 'all' or name me specifically who would've targeted him since I'd preferred someone else to ruthlessly remove them from the game but that is just a minor appendix), there is however one reason no one spoke out (well Chaqa did kinda though in reverse logic):

Nobody said ghug was targeted because of his vote. Not even a short mention with 'oh it might be silly but ...', it's like everyone forgot that as an option (besides with an asterisk Chaqa). There were some games where mafia did target someone who voted for them and since most don't know Chaqa's alignment I at least expected that reasoning to come up.

But all I got was 'ghug is a respected member of the community and dangerous for mafia'. I'm not sure what to think about it exactly, but something doesn't add up. I hope it's not because I'm crazy.

Nobody considered this possibility probably because we never saw a NK on N1 decided because of D1 voting.

It happens, as in M73, which you should be aware.

Why I should be aware? I don't think I was Mafia I M73 and I never decided a N1 kill based on D1 vote when I were Mafia and don't remember anyone advocating it.

[rdrivera2005]

If you were online for EOD, why did you never place a meaningful vote?

into the omgus stretch

If you are playing a mafia strategy of aggressively pushing mis-kills each day, I like it. I tried that one time.

I don't think I saw that question. I didn't change my vote because I don't have a strong opinion about both wagons and don't want to risk a tie.

[celaph]

bona - I'm leaning town for bona, though in his mafia game he found day after day people to shove/push for like here bunny. For D1, it looks enough town for me to be fine with it, but if that continues day after day with other people, be very prepared.

I feel like you townread Bona and then only gave reasons to scumread him. Why the townread?

Going to bed soon, current thoughts:

Kak: Probably town. I thought his read and changing thoughts around ghug were quite perceptive and mirrored mine. Also, I feel like his EoN thoughts had a healthy amount of fear that I was copying him.

ayo?

Yeah, I townread Kak yet I am still confused by his reads. I would like to understand them because maybe he has a good reason for townreading you that I've missed and I like when I can townread people.

[Bonatogether]

I feel like you townread Bona and then only gave reasons to scumread him. Why the townread?

Going to bed soon, current thoughts:

Kak: Probably town. I thought his read and changing thoughts around ghug were quite perceptive and mirrored mine. Also, I feel like his EoN thoughts had a healthy amount of fear that I was copying him.

ayo?

Yeah, I townread Kak yet I am still confused by his reads. I would like to understand them because maybe he has a good reason for townreading you that I've missed and I like when I can townread people.

I feel like you townread Kak and then only gave reasons to scumread him. Why the townread?

[rdrivera2005]

Also, I am probably missing EOD as I have a tennis barbecue and beer tonight.

[celaph]

bozo givith cringe reasoning

are not the scum more likely to lie (with literally no blowback possibility) versus singling themselves out by refusing to answer

Why is his reasoning cringe exactly?

I feel like your answer is just the last half of Bona's post.

It seems like Bozo negatively responded to rdr and Kak challenging his survey without critically thinking about why they are doing so. The fact that a majority of the players responded to the survey does not, in itself, make the players who didn't respond suspicious. Bozo has to establish why not responding after a majority already have is scum motivated and Bona is pointing out a clear reason why not responding may not be scum motivated.

[celaph]

It’s weird for me to feel like a bozo survey is actually serving a good purpose, and even weirder that so many want him daykilled for it. I usually hate his surveys but this one isn’t so mindless.

At a bare minimum, I think it's generated a lot of good conversation today which should be the point of a good survey.

[celaph]

##vote Kak
I'm leaning the way of the survey is a good thing in the interest of general info gain even if earlier I wasn't sure exactly how we'd use the info

Do you think Kak is scum pushing against the survey because he's trying to hide something or town pushing against the survey for reasons you diagree with?

[Bonatogether]

bozo givith cringe reasoning

are not the scum more likely to lie (with literally no blowback possibility) versus singling themselves out by refusing to answer

Why is his reasoning cringe exactly?

I feel like your answer is just the last half of Bona's post.

It seems like Bozo negatively responded to rdr and Kak challenging his survey without critically thinking about why they are doing so. The fact that a majority of the players responded to the survey does not, in itself, make the players who didn't respond suspicious. Bozo has to establish why not responding after a majority already have is scum motivated and Bona is pointing out a clear reason why not responding may not be scum motivated.

[celaph]

To Rdr's above point that there survey mechanics are dominating the thread, I want to review the people who aren't coming up particularly often.

Damo: He has been rather inactive as a whole, but when he has been around I feel like he's done a great job condensing down what has happened into reasonable points. My big wish is that he made more content so we'd have more to go off of.
@Damo

• Besides Chaqa, who do you scum/town read?
• What convinced you to vote for Bunny yesterday?

Chaqa: Nothing he did D1 gave me any confidence that he was town. N1 his only notable post was that he townlocked lfischl which he hasn't since explained (small townlean to lfischl for his reaction to this). I think he's done a great job today explaining why Kak is towncore, but I'm otherwise rather meh on him today.
@Chaqa, what are your current views on Damo and Worcej?

lfischl: I really struggle to parse his comments in a way that makes sense to me. At least it feels like he's asking good questions, but the lack of his own opinion is rather scummy.

[Bonatogether]

town celaph would know that's totally on par for the fisch as any alignment