Austria vs Bots

[DougJoe]

I think for now, I am going to stay defensive in the south, and in the North go for both Kiel and Holland. I'm hoping that the empty spaces that will (likely) result in Boh/Sil will give me a chance to get into Munich and then Berlin, but we'll see.

Got Hol and Kie. Germany lost Silesia to Russia, which makes things much harder. Germany will be down to one unit. I build two. Russia builds one, no doubt army Warsaw. I'm thinking two armies, Lon and Edi, with two options for the spring: Either Lon->Bel, Edi->Nwy (maybe getting into livonia eventually?) *or* keeping them on the mainland for the spring, and moving NTH->Den, ENC-NTH, then convoying in the fall, with Den->BAL. I'm not sure yet which idea I like better, although the army moves in Germany are *probably* going to be Kie->Mun S Ruh and Bur, Hol->Kie... but even if I get Munich in the spring I'm not sure I can hold it, not if I take it from Kie.

Still thinking on it, have until Friday

Well done! I think you can hold Munich if you take it from Kiel, and backfill Kiel from Holland. Then you need to find a way into Berlin or Moscow. Getting into Livonia is the right goal. Maybe you can sneak the StP army in, with NWY-->StP following behind. Russia could plug that up next turn with WAR-->LVN though. To force a breakthrough, you may need fleets in Baltic and GoB. Even with his new build, Russia doesn't have quite enough armies to form a stalemate line along the northern coast, not if he moves GAL-->BOH. Should be an interesting ending!

I was worried about Hol->Kie being bounced by Berlin, but it was not. Built the two armies, did the two convoys, got Munich and got into Kiel. Now just positioning in the fall: Kie/Ruh/Bur S Mun, NTH-Den and ENC-NTH

[DougJoe]

I was worried about Hol->Kie being bounced by Berlin, but it was not. Built the two armies, did the two convoys, got Munich and got into Kiel. Now just positioning in the fall: Kie/Ruh/Bur S Mun, NTH-Den and ENC-NTH

...fall turn is done and nothing much changed, other than the Turk stopped trying for Bohemia. I get one more unit, not sure that it matters what it is...

[DougJoe]

...fall turn is done and nothing much changed, other than the Turk stopped trying for Bohemia. I get one more unit, not sure that it matters what it is...

Built an army. 1912 summary: got into Livonia.

1913 plan - defend Livonia with St.P and BAL, move Den-Swe-GoB.

[DougJoe]

...fall turn is done and nothing much changed, other than the Turk stopped trying for Bohemia. I get one more unit, not sure that it matters what it is...

Built an army. 1912 summary: got into Livonia.

1913 plan - defend Livonia with St.P and BAL, move Den-Swe-GoB.

I was going to move Swe-GoB in the fall, and then go for Prussia, but after the spring 1913 moves, thinking of a different idea for the fall:

Mun->Ber S BAL, Kie
Liv->Pru.
Ruh->Mun S Bur

Because I don't believe Russia will move Berlin, the best he could do is use Silesia to try to retake Munich and hope that Turkey gets the coordination correct. I don' t think Tyo/Boh/Sil will get their act together (I think Sil will support Ber) so this gets me Berlin and probably bounces an attack against Munich...

[DougJoe]

...fall turn is done and nothing much changed, other than the Turk stopped trying for Bohemia. I get one more unit, not sure that it matters what it is...

Built an army. 1912 summary: got into Livonia.

1913 plan - defend Livonia with St.P and BAL, move Den-Swe-GoB.

I was going to move Swe-GoB in the fall, and then go for Prussia, but after the spring 1913 moves, thinking of a different idea for the fall:

Mun->Ber S BAL, Kie
Liv->Pru.
Ruh->Mun S Bur

Because I don't believe Russia will move Berlin, the best he could do is use Silesia to try to retake Munich and hope that Turkey gets the coordination correct. I don' t think Tyo/Boh/Sil will get their act together (I think Sil will support Ber) so this gets me Berlin and probably bounces an attack against Munich...

Took the shot and it worked - as expected, R/T couldn't coordinate at Munich and Berlin held again with support from Sil/Pru.

Victory!

[Trigfea63]

Congrats! Nice convoy move into Livonia in 1912.

[DougJoe]

The Autumn 1910 results in T-0128:

https://webdiplomacy.net/map.php?gameID ... Type=large

Things went relatively well. Not perfect, but good. Germany didn't defend Paris. He did take Norway. So I'm +1. Germany is +2. France is dead. Turkey and Italy are each at 7 units and no builds or removals. I'm inclined to build a fleet, to try to gain control of North Sea, or at least keep Germany out. I expect 1911 will be challenging. More on the specific moves in the next update.

Glad that you didn't try for Tunis. Like I said before, I didn't think Italy was going to do anything with ION other that support Tun.

I think you need another fleet as well, and I think you need to seriously consider switching to Germany being your main focus.

Continued thoughts: Germany moving to Norway was an interesting choice, a truly hostile Germany would have hit Edi, so I'm not sure he's really super hostile, but he's gotta go *somewhere*. I think you build a fleet anyway and see what his builds tell you.

[DougJoe]

I just started another game as Turkey (it was random power selection). Either of you want me to do a running commentary here of that game too?

[Trigfea63]

The Autumn 1910 results in T-0128:

https://webdiplomacy.net/map.php?gameID ... Type=large

Things went relatively well. Not perfect, but good. Germany didn't defend Paris. He did take Norway. So I'm +1. Germany is +2. France is dead. Turkey and Italy are each at 7 units and no builds or removals. I'm inclined to build a fleet, to try to gain control of North Sea, or at least keep Germany out. I expect 1911 will be challenging. More on the specific moves in the next update.

Glad that you didn't try for Tunis. Like I said before, I didn't think Italy was going to do anything with ION other that support Tun.

I think you need another fleet as well, and I think you need to seriously consider switching to Germany being your main focus.

Roger on both of those last points. What I'm thinking now is: build the fleet in London (or maybe Edinburgh), then the following orders in the spring:

ENG-->NTH S LON
MOS-->StP
SEV-->MOS

This combination assures me of either StP or the North Sea, and definitely keeps Germany out of both for at least 1 turn. Then in the south:

MAO-->N. Atlantic
N. Africa-->MAO
Other fleets hold/support-hold

I would prefer MAO-->ENG if I knew it would work. But I don't know that. This moveset keeps the fleets moving toward the action with Germany regardless. If ENG opens up, I have the N. Africa fleet in MAO to move to ENG next turn.

Still debating what to do with the armies in France. I'm leaning toward BRE-->GAS or PAR-->GAS, but not sure yet.

I have to be prepared to lose some ground in France, or the East, or possibly both, while repositioning for a protracted fight with Germany.

[Trigfea63]

Continued thoughts: Germany moving to Norway was an interesting choice, a truly hostile Germany would have hit Edi, so I'm not sure he's really super hostile, but he's gotta go *somewhere*. I think you build a fleet anyway and see what his builds tell you.

Agreed. I still haven't directly attacked Germany. His bot brain must be registering that somewhere. It would be awesome if he didn't try to force his way into Paris/Gascony.

[Trigfea63]

I just started another game as Turkey (it was random power selection). Either of you want me to do a running commentary here of that game too?

That would be great! If you don't mind, I'll lob in some thoughts from the peanut gallery from time to time.

[DougJoe]

I just started another game as Turkey (it was random power selection). Either of you want me to do a running commentary here of that game too?

That would be great! If you don't mind, I'll lob in some thoughts from the peanut gallery from time to time.

Ok. Here's the game: https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=435011

So, with Turkey against the bots I really like con-bul, ank-con, smy-ank. Thus does usually cede control of BLA to Russia, but it is very rarely an issue.

So I played that.

France looks like he really wants Belgium, England went north, nothing crazy from Germany or Russia. Austria went super defensive vs Italy and now I have the choice of getting two builds or stopping Austria from getting one (Serbia). The Italian/Austrian conflict is good for me, of course.

[Trigfea63]

I just started another game as Turkey (it was random power selection). Either of you want me to do a running commentary here of that game too?

That would be great! If you don't mind, I'll lob in some thoughts from the peanut gallery from time to time.

Ok. Here's the game: https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=435011

So, with Turkey against the bots I really like con-bul, ank-con, smy-ank. Thus does usually cede control of BLA to Russia, but it is very rarely an issue.

So I played that.

France looks like he really wants Belgium, England went north, nothing crazy from Germany or Russia. Austria went super defensive vs Italy and now I have the choice of getting two builds or stopping Austria from getting one (Serbia). The Italian/Austrian conflict is good for me, of course.

It's a fantastic opening for Turkey. I'll trust you know what you're doing in the Black Sea, and Austria didn't manage to move a single unit from its starting position! I'd be inclined to take the 2 builds. You'll have your chance to crush Austria's dreams soon enough.

[DougJoe]

It's a fantastic opening for Turkey. I'll trust you know what you're doing in the Black Sea, and Austria didn't manage to move a single unit from its starting position! I'd be inclined to take the 2 builds. You'll have your chance to crush Austria's dreams soon enough.

I was leaning that way already and played bul-gre, con-bul (sc), ank-con, all successful.

France took Bel and Spa as expected, England played it cautious and covered London but took Norway with an army, suggesting he wants to attack Russia. Germany also played it safe and covered Munich and let Ruusia into Sweden, suggesting Germany wants to play nice with Russia. Russia moved BLA to Rum, and I'm not sure what I think of that. Italy and Austria still have issues, although Italy did convoy to Tunis instead of taking it with a fleet.

Was thinking about deferring a build in order to get a 3rd fleet before a 3rd army, but have decided to go with F Smy A Ank for now with the goal of getting armies in Alb/Gre/Bul to take Serbia next.

[DougJoe]

I was leaning that way already and played bul-gre, con-bul (sc), ank-con, all successful.

France took Bel and Spa as expected, England played it cautious and covered London but took Norway with an army, suggesting he wants to attack Russia. Germany also played it safe and covered Munich and let Ruusia into Sweden, suggesting Germany wants to play nice with Russia. Russia moved BLA to Rum, and I'm not sure what I think of that. Italy and Austria still have issues, although Italy did convoy to Tunis instead of taking it with a fleet.

Was thinking about deferring a build in order to get a 3rd fleet before a 3rd army, but have decided to go with F Smy A Ank for now with the goal of getting armies in Alb/Gre/Bul to take Serbia next.

Spring 02 results: Moved the armies around and the fleets into AEG and EMS with no issues.

France looks like he's going for (and is going to get) Liverpool. Germany built armies and it looks like he wants to take on France. England moved into NTH but is in trouble, not sure what he thinks he's doing next. Italy appears to be going after Austria. Russia went for Galicia instead of protecting Rum and lost (for now) Rum.

Honestly, already, I think this is shaping up to be R/T vs. F. But we'll see.

For the fall, I'm going to play Bul-Ser S Gre, Con-Bul S AEG, EMS H. I'm guessing Russia will hit Rum one way or another and there's no other unit to defend Serbia. Italy *could* ION->Gre, but I'd be very surprised if that happens.

[DougJoe]

Spring 02 results: Moved the armies around and the fleets into AEG and EMS with no issues.

France looks like he's going for (and is going to get) Liverpool. Germany built armies and it looks like he wants to take on France. England moved into NTH but is in trouble, not sure what he thinks he's doing next. Italy appears to be going after Austria. Russia went for Galicia instead of protecting Rum and lost (for now) Rum.

Honestly, already, I think this is shaping up to be R/T vs. F. But we'll see.

For the fall, I'm going to play Bul-Ser S Gre, Con-Bul S AEG, EMS H. I'm guessing Russia will hit Rum one way or another and there's no other unit to defend Serbia. Italy *could* ION->Gre, but I'd be very surprised if that happens.

Fall 02 results:
Italy did surprise me, and convoyed Tunis to Albania, which I don't see often. He took Trieste because I hit Serbia, which was used to try to protect Trieste. Vienna just blocked Galicia again and Rumania held, which means Russia took it back. Germany got Belgium and France got Lvp, so France is =, Germany +1, and England +1. Italy and Turkey are +1 as well.

The build will be F Smy as I feel that I don't need another army right now. I'd like to see the Italians build an army, but it's probably going to be F Nap...

[DougJoe]

Fall 02 results:
Italy did surprise me, and convoyed Tunis to Albania, which I don't see often. He took Trieste because I hit Serbia, which was used to try to protect Trieste. Vienna just blocked Galicia again and Rumania held, which means Russia took it back. Germany got Belgium and France got Lvp, so France is =, Germany +1, and England +1. Italy and Turkey are +1 as well.

The build will be F Smy as I feel that I don't need another army right now. I'd like to see the Italians build an army, but it's probably going to be F Nap...

I forgot about Portugal, silly me. France did get a build and built F Bre. Germany built another army, England got rid of Norway and now Russia has life to come over the top. Italy did build army Venice, like I was hoping for (because I still have a fleet majority.)

Time to get some shuteye, want to ruminate on the tactics of this one a little bit.

[Trigfea63]

Fall 02 results:
Italy did surprise me, and convoyed Tunis to Albania, which I don't see often. He took Trieste because I hit Serbia, which was used to try to protect Trieste. Vienna just blocked Galicia again and Rumania held, which means Russia took it back. Germany got Belgium and France got Lvp, so France is =, Germany +1, and England +1. Italy and Turkey are +1 as well.

The build will be F Smy as I feel that I don't need another army right now. I'd like to see the Italians build an army, but it's probably going to be F Nap...

I forgot about Portugal, silly me. France did get a build and built F Bre. Germany built another army, England got rid of Norway and now Russia has life to come over the top. Italy did build army Venice, like I was hoping for (because I still have a fleet majority.)

Time to get some shuteye, want to ruminate on the tactics of this one a little bit.

Looking good so far. For Turkey to be up to 6 SCs with Serbia and Greece after 1902 is a strong start. It's a little bit unnerving that Italy convoyed to Albania and is also off to a strong start. Sometimes Russia ends up in the catbird's seat in these positions, where it can choose which of Turkey and Italy it wants to ally with. But that's more of a thing with human players. I'm not sure the bots are that smart. Italy's going to have trouble making further gains, while also holding onto Albania and Ionian Sea.

[Trigfea63]

After using the full 3-day phase a couple of times, I've re-engaged in T-0128. Here is England's position after Autumn 1911:

https://webdiplomacy.net/map.php?gameID ... Type=large

I'm not out of the woods yet with Germany. The 1912 moves have an explosion of possibilities around North Sea, Holland, Belgium, Ruhr, Picardy, and Burgundy. I have a build coming, which will help. OTOH, Germany's in the North Sea again. Turkey is gaining the upper hand against Italy, and they are disentangling. Italy has a removal. Probably Black Sea, but I can hope for TyS.

[Trigfea63]

After using the full 3-day phase a couple of times, I've re-engaged in T-0128. Here is England's position after Autumn 1911:

https://webdiplomacy.net/map.php?gameID ... Type=large

I'm not out of the woods yet with Germany. The 1912 moves have an explosion of possibilities around North Sea, Holland, Belgium, Ruhr, Picardy, and Burgundy. I have a build coming, which will help. OTOH, Germany's in the North Sea again. Turkey is gaining the upper hand against Italy, and they are disentangling. Italy has a removal. Probably Black Sea, but I can hope for TyS.

Another update, post-Autumn 1914 Retreats:

https://webdiplomacy.net/map.php?gameID ... Type=large

Three years have seen me make slow, steady progress against Germany. First, after 1912 my position improved considerably when Germany withdrew from the North Sea. He could have caused substantial trouble if he had forced me to dislodge him, and then forward-retreated to London or Yorkshire. Fortunately, he just pulled back. I occupied the North Sea and I've been in a safe position since. In 1913 I got into position to take a German center in the North and Tunis in the South. And in 1914 I took Denmark and Tunis. I'm back up to 12 centers, I have 2 builds this winter, and Germany has a removal. A human victory may still be in the cards.

In the next phase, I will try to hold my position in the South while gradually taking Germany's centers in the North. Eventually I'll need armies to reach Munich and Berlin. But this year probably 2 more fleets.