MAFIA XXXVIII: INFINITY WAR

[damo666]

Maybe so Bozo but I was right. I fail to understand why vig shot him.

[brainbomb]

What do you mean?

There's two things you could have done here.

a) you're town, and don't know what bussing is.
b) you're mafia, and just blatantly towncleared me.

How stupid are you?

Why do you think its actual stupidity as opposed to scum induced dumbtelling?

[bo_sox48]

There's two things you could have done here.

a) you're town, and don't know what bussing is.
b) you're mafia, and just blatantly towncleared me.

How stupid are you?

Why do you think its actual stupidity as opposed to scum induced dumbtelling?

Why do you think it's scum induced dumbtelling as opposed to actual stupidity?

[brainbomb]

By end of day he basically waffled on his top read to self preserve, and in doing so he showed he just values his own staying power over his reads.

Egads! Of course I did. My reads aren't worth too much if I'm dead. Would you prefer townies just roll over and play dead instead of trying to get someone else lynched?

I dont think your reads were clear enough to be considered towny in the first place. You posted huge case on yavuz bussing fox and getting nervous. Which I dont really understand and I especially dont see coming from your town playstyle at all. It just felt kinda random and beneath your intelllect

[brainbomb]

How stupid are you?

Why do you think its actual stupidity as opposed to scum induced dumbtelling?

Why do you think it's scum induced dumbtelling as opposed to actual stupidity?

Because you arent a stupid person..and youre generally good, perhaps even great as town. I find your case on yavuz convoluted and requiring too many what - ifs, which isnt how I see you conduct yourself. You also abandoned the case on a whim to push snowy who youd never even mentioned before then.

And more importantly youre debating me from a position of trying to convince me of your innocence rather than of trying to convince me who is scummiest. Which tells me you still just value survival over making coherent arguments.

[bo_sox48]

So you too just to a scumread instead of asking questions that might actually help you understand things?

I don't think I have ever built a case against someone that ended up being the basis for a plethora of people scumreading me instead of the person the case is against, and yet I have not been asked a single concrete question about my case by anyone except Squigs, who I was speaking to directly in that post to begin with.

[bozotheclown]

I catch up reading and confess I don't have much to say, I feel like the mechanics are far more important then the scum hunt.

I have done a quick re-readead of the EOD and the scummiest vote for me is Bozo. After all we discussed about the SK and the need of two votes lead to ensure the lynch can't see a reason for a town to risk a tie the way he did.

I also don't think scum will try to stole the Soul Stone. Town don't have an investigative role, only a weak tracker and scum can't win against a SK with the Soul stone so why take this risk? They could try it if their odds to win in the regular way is low, but can't see them taking this risk now.

Do you think it is better to lynch a town than to risk a tie?

[ghug]

I think brain is right about bo. He's spent the whole game pushing the lowest hanging fruit there is in yavuz and halfheartedly hitting xorxes. There's not much spread in opinions, and there's a lot of pontificating with minimal thought. Rereading EOD, it really looks like bo was coaching Darg to vote for him, which suggests they're scum together. I think Bo's scum meta is to attempt to die over his teammates in a scum v scum and try to make the team look good before he goes. This also fits with the late switch to snowy, which served to change who he was tied with (big red flag), and create a three way tie if someone switched to darg late or the SK was on darg. Bo's my vote tomorrow.

I think mad Vecna seems townie, but his fucking obsession with SK is problematic.

I would like DoubtingThomas to die so that I don't have to read anything he says anymore. I might feel more strongly about him than ND on this matter.

Where's y2k?

I normally think "I told you so" is scummy af, but because it's on the vig shot and not a lynch, it gives me pause on Mr. Number of the Beast. Interested to see where he goes with it.

Bozo is bad.

Flash, Chippe, worcej, brain, Fox all town.

[ND]

I've been fairly busy and the game is moving very fast. I think we can draw some results. First d1: I am pretty surprised with the result. The sk aplying the stone at X2 means he wanted dargorygel dead. Option a) he is on the wagon and going for stones. Option b) misdirection, but if so why apply an X2 power? Either way I think the dargorygel voters need to be watched. It was also a chaotic finish.

Second Jamie was basically passively looking for a wagon leader against me d1. a fall guy basically. I suspect he is scum and this kind of confirms it. He wants someone else to start the wagon so he can pile on without taking the blame later. It's a classic scum ploy. Let someone else drive it but try to quietly start it. And it was werid how a few others softed this too like bozo and xorxes. It's been 70 pages bozo gets no notice, posts nothing basically, then comes out of the woodwork to support Jamie but not vote on it? Bizarre and so scummy.

Then we have some night posters like yav? Asking for a second cc to brain during the night phase? That is an absolute scum tell imo. Also Doubting Thomas is ridiculous. Over defensive and hostile. He is either a newbie with a chip on his shoulder or a newbie mafia that is playing like he got his hand caught in the cookie jar.

I'll post a final reads hopefully by EOD but this is what I'm thinking right now. Brain I saw on catch up you had a question for me like six pages back but I don't understand it.

[bozotheclown]

Had a look at D1 voting and all I can discern is:

Ezio voters (Bozo, Squiggs, Xorxes & Ghug) slightly increased probabilty of being scum

Bozo's late switch from darg -> bo is a bit odd

Is this statement based on knowledge of the alignment of darg and bo?

[ghug]

There's two things you could have done here.

a) you're town, and don't know what bussing is.
b) you're mafia, and just blatantly towncleared me.

How stupid are you?

Why do you think its actual stupidity as opposed to scum induced dumbtelling?

The stupidity is there regardless of the motivation because it's a laughably bad argument.

[bo_sox48]

You also abandoned the case on a whim to push snowy who youd never even mentioned before then.

And more importantly youre debating me from a position of trying to convince me of your innocence rather than of trying to convince me who is scummiest. Which tells me you still just value survival over making coherent arguments.

Oh my god, are you that fucking stupid? I didn't push snowy; I voted for him to survive. Darg was behind by one and I couldn't affect that. Chippe had just put snowy within one vote of me with 30 seconds to go in the day. I tied the vote on purpose by voting for snowy. Had I known that darg would have actually had the lead if I had stayed put there, obviously I wouldn't have moved.

I just townread snowy a few pages back. I townread darg too. Why would I do that if I were exclusively focused on defending myself? I have scumread yavuz, Fox, and flash, who have all garnered interest since early in the game but none have actually had a consistent or effective wagon against them, which makes them even more suspicious in my eyes. I am not putting up with this attitude despite my obviously town-motivated play when I was about to get killed that I should automatically be the #1 lynch going into day 2 because that's fucking stupid and a waste of a day or this ridiculous notion that I am somehow so intelligent and perfect in every way that everything I do every single game should reflect that, and if I'm not playing like Superman, then I'm obviously mafia trying to hide in plain sight. That's the meta that gets me fearkilled and makes this game so fucking unenjoyable that I stop playing for months on end.

I'm going to go to the store so that I can actually eat food for the next week or so, and perhaps when I come back you will actually have a halfway decent understanding of what I have done this game. If not, perhaps you will ask clarifying questions - hell, even leading questions, if you're so biased and closedminded to take that approach - instead of rambling on and on about your opinion instead of facts or interpretations that I can actually answer to. Hopefully someone kills me by then so I can go complain about how moronic the last 18 hours have been instead of putting up with more of your steaming turds.

[bo_sox48]

You know what, fuck it. I'm done posting in this game.

[brainbomb]

Ok so your whole case on yav was he bussed fox.

Whyd ya never push fox? Why no questions for fox? Why no quotes, no vca, no analysis of fox?

It felt like you just railroades yavuz and totally ignored the other half of your argument.


bo_sox48
Night-1 28:00
page 69 How did we not lynch yavuz

. Fox, though, rubbed me the wrong way with this:
↑Foxcastle: "Yavuz seems off. He's usually more willing to engage, usually more willing to read up, and unusually willing to vote wit..."

At first glace, I agreed with him. I thought it was a good point. I noticed that he made the point and disappeared, which is important. Then, I reread yavuz. His vote on you, Squiggles, was classic yavuz. He took something you said and ignored all of the possibilities except for one that he wanted to go with, which is that you are the serial killer and you faked a slip so that nobody would catch you. What isn’t classic yavuz is that he is blatantly going against his own views by keeping his vote on you instead of throwing it all over like he often does, and by keeping his vote on you and trying to catch the SK, he is actively avoiding scumhunting despite reminding us on a couple of occasions that it's more important to catch the mafia team than the SK.

This doesnt explain why you scumread fox. You took 1 post by fox but instead jammed yavuz into your fos.


"I think three things are happening: first of all, yavuz voted for Fox on page 32 for basically nothing, which should have signified that he was leaving the “case” on you, Squigs, behind. Instead, he jumped back off of Fox and back onto you, and then all of a sudden picked up the case on you again"

None of this explains why yavuz would bus fox, and it doesnt explain foxes role in any of this other than the vague idea fox was being bussed for some reason.

Fox posted what I quoted above on page 33, after yavuz voted for him. He is upset that yavuz just needlessly connected the two of them and he is trying to separate himself from him. He doesn’t vote for him, or pressure him, or ask him anything - he just says what he says and waltzes off.

Show the quote where fox is visibly upset yavuz voted him.

If its this:

Foxcastle
Day-1 28:22
page 33 Yavuz seems off. He's usually more willing to engage, usually more willing to read up, and unusually willing to vote without stating much of a reason (his reasons are usually gut reactions, but they are strongly held

This isnt fox being upset. I dont understand where you think fox is scum with yavuz over this remark??

[ND]

You know what, fuck it. I'm done posting in this game.

Why?

[bozotheclown]

Bozo has also still failed to make any town posts

He's in danger of being obv-scum again like last game if he doesnt start producing some town posts soon.

You were wrong about me last game if you thought I was scum.

Lol what? I nailed you to the wall as non-town. Who gives a shit if it was scum or sk lol.

Theres both in this game as well. And youre giving off a very big non-town impression yet again so far.

Nice defence though

As SK I was trying to take out the scum first, yet you stated I was "obv-scum" last game.

[brainbomb]

What isn’t classic yavuz is that he is blatantly going against his own views by keeping his vote on you instead of throwing it all over like he often does, and by keeping his vote on you and trying to catch the SK, he is actively avoiding scumhunting despite reminding us on a couple of occasions that it's more important to catch the mafia team than the SK.

I think doing weird inexplicable things is actually very in character for yavuz. Last game he pushed me most of day 1. Then suddenly I was town to him. Alot of the traits youre trying to apply to yavuz are that hes 1 dimensional nervous scum as opposed to that hes very strange erratic town who plays unconventionally.

didn't..."
a) yavuz said you, Squiggles, are the SK.
b) if yavuz prefers lynching scum to lynching the SK, why is he voting for the guy who he thinks slipped SK instead of someone else? Remember that he reinforced his vote on you on page 32, switching back from voting for Fox earlier on page 32 for… reasons.
c) if yavuz thinks flash slipped SK as well, as he said on page 33, why is his vote still on you for slipping SK? Why is he saying that we should focus on the mafia team putting all of his effort into asking the GMs about SK mechanics and voting for people he thinks slipped SK?

I had told yavuz that squiggs was likely sk. But sk was not a priority.
Why is squiggs sk in YOUR opinion?
And I dont disagree with you that yavuz could be scum for these points.

But these points have NOTHING to do with foxcastle. And this doesnt do anything other than imply that you think yavuz is sk hunting. Which a towny CAN do. Theres no rule saying a townie CANT sk hunt. And lets say for a moment hes right, and squiggs is sk.. why exactly does Fox have to be someone yavuz bussed, but none of yavuz other pushes are bussed?

[bozotheclown]

Bozo is bad.

Can you elaborate on this?

[worcej]

I've been fairly busy and the game is moving very fast. I think we can draw some results. First d1: I am pretty surprised with the result. The sk aplying the stone at X2 means he wanted dargorygel dead. Option a) he is on the wagon and going for stones. Option b) misdirection, but if so why apply an X2 power? Either way I think the dargorygel voters need to be watched. It was also a chaotic finish.

Second Jamie was basically passively looking for a wagon leader against me d1. a fall guy basically. I suspect he is scum and this kind of confirms it. He wants someone else to start the wagon so he can pile on without taking the blame later. It's a classic scum ploy. Let someone else drive it but try to quietly start it. And it was werid how a few others softed this too like bozo and xorxes. It's been 70 pages bozo gets no notice, posts nothing basically, then comes out of the woodwork to support Jamie but not vote on it? Bizarre and so scummy.

Then we have some night posters like yav? Asking for a second cc to brain during the night phase? That is an absolute scum tell imo. Also Doubting Thomas is ridiculous. Over defensive and hostile. He is either a newbie with a chip on his shoulder or a newbie mafia that is playing like he got his hand caught in the cookie jar.

I'll post a final reads hopefully by EOD but this is what I'm thinking right now. Brain I saw on catch up you had a question for me like six pages back but I don't understand it.

In the SK read you make, I am inclined to believe misdirection more than wanting darg specifically - but honestly neither is probably the real reason. All the SK cares about is a death at this point and possibly getting stones, so someone dying is all that matters - padding the lead wagon higher makes it harder to tie. A tied vote was the worst case scenario for SK.

I also agree a little bit with your opinion on Jaime - he is definitely acting different then the past 2 rounds - R36 he hated snowy, R37 was hate on brain, and so far seems... nice? I don't have enough experience of playing with him to make a meta read, but I can say it seems different then what I've seen in the past.

Honestly, DT is playing the same as last game and he was town - I think he is being consistent this game. He is just defensive when people put pressure on him.

[brainbomb]

No two games are alike. You cant look at myself and Jamie from last game and assume hes scum based on that.

One thing you could argue for Jamie being scum is that he entered this game wanting me to be anti town.

He played like he EXPECTED me to be anti town, and attempted to actually induce that.

His first 7 or 8 posts of the game he fixates on me

Day 1, Page 1 : g=38&part=Day%201&user=Jamiet99uk

Jamiet99uk
Day-1 48:53
page 1 Ohhhhh yeah.
I got my role PM.

Feeling lucky Brainbomb?
Jamiet99uk
Day-1 48:39
page 1 Where's Brianbomb?

I want to know if he has any last words.

Jamiet99uk
Day-1 48:35
page 1
↑xorxes: "brainbomb still alive

therefore Jamiet not Vig

therefore odds of Jamiet being Mafia are slightly higher than for anyon..."
I figure he deserves to make one post.

Page 2 : g=38&part=Day%201&user=Jamiet99uk

Jamiet99uk
Day-1 48:33
page 2
↑xorxes: "In what way will Thanos want to influence the vote? Why would they care who gets lynched?"
This question +10. Vecna what you on about?

Page 3 : g=38&part=Day%201&user=Jamiet99uk

Jamiet99uk
Day-1 48:10
page 3 Well Brainbomb isn't rising to my threat so never mind.

I'm not the Vig obviously. In fact I'm quite disappointed to roll VT again.

##Vote Brainbomb.

Policy lynch.
Page 7 : g=38&part=Day%201&user=Jamiet99uk

Jamiet99uk
Day-1 46:31
page 7 Oh hey Brainbomb is here.

@BRAINBOMB: Are you planning to claim Roleblock this game whether or not you are roleblocked? If YES, how does that help town? If NO, what has happened since last game? Let us know please.

Its kinda strange to go from pregame saying hes gonna shoot me
Actually threatenimg to shoot me
Backing off that
To asking if I plan to do anything anti town
And suddenly hes laughing at my statements about ND.

This feels more like actual scum Jamie who wanted to out the vig early