MAFIA 71: "PAPERS PLEASE" - GAME THREAD [Hidden]

[brainbomb]

I'd like to hear from people who think Tom Bomb is towny, and why.

I just remember town tom tended to lurk and do next to nothing other than a few sparse check in posts. he won a few games playing scum as a pedestrian. I dont feel that here

Is it then your assessment that Tom is tending to lurk and do next to nothing in this game? And what does pedestrian mean here?

I think Tom is doing more than enough and tonally seems town to me. Pedestrian in this case would mean sitting on the sidelines watching the game, chiming in only now and then to muse about something jokey or totally pointless and then going back to doing nothing while the mob rips each other up

[bozotheclown]

@everyone who supports murder on day 1

So in normal games with one mafia team, the town has X amount of miskills they can make before they lose the game and that's pretty rigid. If the doctor or vig do well then sometimes you can gain an extra miskill but it's rare.
If town no-kills in a normal game, it almost always lowers the amount of miskills they can make before losing the game and that is always bad. The daykill is the only way for mafia to die so giving one of those up is always bad since we'll never get it back.

In Multi, we have no idea how many miskills we have. The last multi webdip game I think we barely killed any mafia most of the way through the game but we still won because the mafia teams shot each other to swiss.
I've been in several multi games on mafiascum and sometimes the town gets annhilated when it wasn't really their fault, and in others the mafias did all the work. I don't think I've ever seen a multi game where the game was lost on a lylo miskill. There isn't a huge loss if we don't kill on day 1, because that info will just be transferred to a later daykill, but we will have the added information of nightkill analsyis and give PRs more cover to do their thing as well.

I do not think you are accounting for M51.

What happened in M51, bozo (or anyone)?

One scum team was eliminated early, so the game did end in a mis-kill.

[brainbomb]

Tom is among my highest townreads and I feel there could even be an element within both scumteams just wanting us to kill off a perfectly reasonable town entity to see if there is enough energy to cause it

[snowy801]

I just remember town tom tended to lurk and do next to nothing other than a few sparse check in posts. he won a few games playing scum as a pedestrian. I dont feel that here

Is it then your assessment that Tom is tending to lurk and do next to nothing in this game? And what does pedestrian mean here?

I think Tom is doing more than enough and tonally seems town to me. Pedestrian in this case would mean sitting on the sidelines watching the game, chiming in only now and then to muse about something jokey or totally pointless and then going back to doing nothing while the mob rips each other up

Perhaps I misunderstood you here. You imply that town!Tom is one of lurk and inactivity, but then observe that current!Tom is not in alignment with this behavior, and therefore you conclude that he is town?

Is it that you also believe scum!Tom behaves this way? In which case what makes this behavior alignment indicative?

[snowy801]

bozo I want to see your list please

And nobody can accuse you of spamming useless lists because I specifically asked you for it

[BesharamSabi]

Lunch break from cleaning so let me whip up a few responses:

What was questionable was coming from snowy side, not yours, in that conversation. Mainly his whole argument that scum would sub out and the fact his predecessor subbed out for non emergency reasons is like huh worthy.

What did you think about his argument when it comes to eden being subbed out compared to his our sub situation?

Thank you for responding to my questions!

I didn't personally think snowy seemed defensive talking about mafia being more likely to sub out, but it's an interesting point. I do think he focused on Eden subbing out more than I was, but I don't think that's alignment indicative since others were talking about Eden subbing out being a town indicator. It seemed more like a way for snowy to justify his scumread on Eden (but not necessarily in a scummy way, I don't think).

In terms of snowy's own sub situation, then for snowy to be scum he'd have had to be trying to reverse-psychology me into townreading him, because I disagreed with the premise that scum are more likely to sub out, and it seems counterproductive for scum!snowy to project that belief into the thread. But, ya know. wifom I guess

I suppose you are right. Maybe my theory on snowy doesnt hold much water. I do think that slot is scummy. Not just from him but also Chris with his weirdness of the bona saying he saw his discord status.

Anyway it seems moot since he moved on from eden/squigs slot but I dunno, I still dont get good vibes.

When I said I had a secret scumread earlier on, it was Flying boat, but I don't have any strong reasons why. It's just a gut feel that he's trying to be placating.

I admit it's weak. Day 1s are hard because the daykill is never killed for a very good reason because there isn't much to go off.

I wouldn't hate a damo kill either because I can never read him anymore anyway.

Hi Flum,

Just a few follow up questions to this post:

What posts from the flying boat boy gave you these vibes or was it his general presence this game?

Do you have any examples of him placating?

Why do you feel damo is a good day 1 kill besides for the fact you cant read him?

Not related to this post but how do you feel about people making a wagon for meme due to his no kill stance but not for you either? Why him over you? Do you think its scum bussing their own?

Thank you ahead of the time if you ever do answers these.

I can answer the others later, but I don't like the Meme wagon. I only agreed to play because Meme was in it, and I will be heartbroken if he's killed day 1. His posting is completely NAI.
I do understand why the wagon is on him though and not everyone loves Meme's style.

I'm usually given a free pass on day 1 in most games because I get more useful in later days, so I'm not surprised there's no wagon on me.
I would be shocked if scum Meme gets bussed here, but I could see his partners voting him to get him to participate to later change their votes. (Still unlikely)

I only agreed to play because Meme was in it, and I will be heartbroken if he's killed day 1.

I feel the same way about meme. I legit have begged meme to play every game since I joined this community and im going to be big mad if hes killed day one.

I just find it weird you are getting a pass on all of this and meme isn't. Much to analyze about who is on meme's wagon and their relationship with you.

[kgray]

##vote theflyingboat

partially gut, partially his current wagon is majorly towny (sorry snowy) and mostly his damo vote really bothers me - and he's ignoring me scumreading him for it, and I really liked Tom's point that maybe he's trying too hard to avoid being defensive.

[brainbomb]

you only agreed to play because meme was playing?

you were #1 in the signup list?

[kgray]

@sabi I'm not trying to discourage your read of snowy, I just don't fully agree with it from my pov. You'll know if I'm trying to discourage someone's scumread

[kgray]

you only agreed to play because meme was playing?

you were #1 in the signup list?

The italics are Sabi quoting Flum

[ghug]

I don't think scum will openly defend a teammate in any game (I never do this as scum) but I could be wrong. I remember the game Ghug defended Damo and just get caught.

I think bussing is less likely at least a solid one (a key vote to get someone DKed). Because even if you get townread over it (and you don't get much with two Mafia) it could also just attract an NK.

Well yeah, I was hoping nobody would think I'd be that blatant, but we saw how that worked.

It does happen, just less over the top than I did it.

Actually you protected damo last game (M1020) and it worked, so there's that

What can I say? He's my favorite teammate.

[snowy801]

No need to be sorry, I also find TheInvalidVote man scummy

I'm just pondering here because this game should be like shooting fish in a barrel but isn't

[brainbomb]

meme hasnt even acknowledged your presence as far as im aware

[bozotheclown]

I could see Bonatogether and lfischl being on the same scum team, voting for each other for cat related reasons, but I am still more suspicious of lfischl. I think either one would be a better DK than captainmeme, whose chance of being scum I would estimate as 6/17.

[snowy801]

Has anyone considered Fluminator as a scum read?

[ghug]

##vote theflyingboat

partially gut, partially his current wagon is majorly towny (sorry snowy) and mostly his damo vote really bothers me - and he's ignoring me scumreading him for it, and I really liked Tom's point that maybe he's trying too hard to avoid being defensive.

Hey I was gonna do that!

[BesharamSabi]

you only agreed to play because meme was playing?

you were #1 in the signup list?

Reread what I said. I was quoting that line from Flum post. I didnt join for him, but I have been begging him to play so I am happy hes in this game.

Sorry if my post format is weird. I like to italicize parts of peoples post to emphasize what I am about to talk about.

But yes I was first but I legit screamed in happiness when he signed up. You can verify that in the sign up thread. I love meme : )

[kgray]

No need to be sorry, I also find TheInvalidVote man scummy

I'm just pondering here because this game should be like shooting fish in a barrel but isn't

I meant sorry for one of my reasons being that I liked who's voting for him lol

[snowy801]

No need to be sorry, I also find TheInvalidVote man scummy

I'm just pondering here because this game should be like shooting fish in a barrel but isn't

I meant sorry for one of my reasons being that I liked who's voting for him lol

Ah, yes I did say that didn't I

[kgray]

I could see Bonatogether and lfischl being on the same scum team, voting for each other for cat related reasons, but I am still more suspicious of lfischl. I think either one would be a better DK than captainmeme, whose chance of being scum I would estimate as 6/17.

I kind of agree that bona and lfischl voting for each other seems weird, but they're also not unlikely D1 targets, so it'd be a pretty odd strategy for them specifically to vote each other as scumbuddies