MAFIA 71: "PAPERS PLEASE" - GAME THREAD [Hidden]

[Jamiet99uk]

++ MINISTRY of ADMINISTRATION ++
+++ VOTE COUNT 1.7 +++

TheFlyingBoat(4) - brainbomb, Tom Bombadil, ghug, Fluminator
Captainmeme(4) - Rdrivera2005, Durga, kgray, Damo666
Lfischl(3) - Bonatogether, bozotheclown, Foxcastle
damo666(2) - Squigs44, TheFlyingBoat
Bonatogether(2) - BesharamSabi, Lfischl
BesharamSabi(1) - Macca573
Squigs44(1) - Snowy801

No‑Kill(1) - captainmeme

NOBODY is in the lead.

6 hours and 35 minutes remain in Day 1

Fluoride is added to your drinking water to promote dental and bone health.

Glory to Arstotzka.

[kgray]

Pourquoi?

Cause he's Eden, and that slot is one of my (and others', I think) strongest townreads. Can you explain what you thought was wagon manipulation?

I'm skipping the entire next page but uh

People commenting on the nature of the voters and not the votee is textbook manipulation in my opinion. Not that I base my reads off that, but it's somewhere to start

That said I don't read Eden as coming off as particularly towny until his ragequit. What made you feel that way?

I'm not really sure what you mean? I always look for people's motivations with their votes and don't really understand how that's manipulation. Or do you mean he's looking at wagon composition too much? I care about who's on wagons and all else being relatively equal, it could play a big part in where I vote.

I feel like people put too much stock in "only town would ragequit because mafia care too much about not letting their team down" but... idk I kind of feel that with Eden. If he were scum he basically spent his time here soft clearing Sabi, deciding I'm probably town after pushing a fake scumread onto me, and arguing with ghug. It just seems very unlikely to me that that's part of some scum agenda. Also, the thing I said to Durga about this reminding me of how Eden and I clashed in the no-reveal game and Eden coming to that same conclusion.

[Durga]

the game is speculation
thats the entire point of the game
im actually really annoyed you would gaslight me and pretend this isnt how the game works.

gonna walk away now before I snap at you

I dont think I've ever seen you get offended this way. I apologize for not making myself clear - I have no ill will towards you.
My goal is not to gaslight you or disregard your posts, it is to help you communicate better but if you don't want my thoughts on the subject I'll move on I guess.

were good man.
can you indulge me just the slightest and look back at that quote from flyingboat that I posted.

and just again; indulge me for a moment: if he were to flip mafia, how do you feel about that quote? how do you feel about the names he listed? what is the liklihood he listed a teammate in that grouping? what are the odds he listed both his teammates in that? or none?

just humor me and thats all I ask. what are your opinions on that outside of “we dont have time to wonder about possibilities”.

Are you talking about the list he copied from Flum's alliance?

[kgray]

##vote captain

prefer that to the other 2 wagons

What do you think of TFB's vote for you?

[brainbomb]

durga are those people actually planning to act upon that alliance? I guess I thought that was tfb’s loose interpretation of who was allied to flum. If that is a list of official people claiming they want to be in flums alliance I will totally drop all of this.

[brainbomb]

in torn on this wagon and it wouldnt take much to move my vote. but apparently im not alone in finding tfb suspicious. I would however be really surprised if this ends up todays elimination as its still intact 6 hours out

[Durga]

durga are those people actually planning to act upon that alliance? I guess I thought that was tfb’s loose interpretation of who was allied to flum. If that is a list of official people claiming they want to be in flums alliance I will totally drop all of this.

Yes. This is Flum's list iirc and tfb is merely restating it and then joking about it. I feel like that's obvious if you read the convo? And if you continued reading the convo you'd see that he didn't even pick the right list to talk about because his reading compréhension skills are suspect.

[snowy801]

Cause he's Eden, and that slot is one of my (and others', I think) strongest townreads. Can you explain what you thought was wagon manipulation?

I'm skipping the entire next page but uh

People commenting on the nature of the voters and not the votee is textbook manipulation in my opinion. Not that I base my reads off that, but it's somewhere to start

That said I don't read Eden as coming off as particularly towny until his ragequit. What made you feel that way?

I'm not really sure what you mean? I always look for people's motivations with their votes and don't really understand how that's manipulation. Or do you mean he's looking at wagon composition too much? I care about who's on wagons and all else being relatively equal, it could play a big part in where I vote.

I feel like people put too much stock in "only town would ragequit because mafia care too much about not letting their team down" but... idk I kind of feel that with Eden. If he were scum he basically spent his time here soft clearing Sabi, deciding I'm probably town after pushing a fake scumread onto me, and arguing with ghug. It just seems very unlikely to me that that's part of some scum agenda. Also, the thing I said to Durga about this reminding me of how Eden and I clashed in the no-reveal game and Eden coming to that same conclusion.

It's always easy to say "I have no particular opinions on this wagonee, but I (dis)like the people on the wagon." I'm not a big fan of it, and often see it during my EoD1/2 deliberations when I'm trying to decide which of my suspects to flash when people are trying to veer me in the wrong direction.

Re: Eden, sure but I would also purport (hi Jamiet) that certain types of players are on average happier as town than scum and Eden fits the profile. I for one would never sub out of a VT game I think, when I may as scum.

In the end, I choose not to read too deeply into meta concerns and the rest of his verbiage did not strike me as towny outside of that context.

[snowy801]

Anyone taking this "alliance" nonsense seriously is megasus, imo

[brainbomb]

durga are those people actually planning to act upon that alliance? I guess I thought that was tfb’s loose interpretation of who was allied to flum. If that is a list of official people claiming they want to be in flums alliance I will totally drop all of this.

Yes. This is Flum's list iirc and tfb is merely restating it and then joking about it. I feel like that's obvious if you read the convo? And if you continued reading the convo you'd see that he didn't even pick the right list to talk about because his reading compréhension skills are suspect.

I will not indulge attacking his literacy here. I merely wanted to know if it was an actual accurate list or if it was anti spew by design.

[brainbomb]

you don't have to reply to that.

[Durga]

I agree that most people are more likely to sub out as scum than town.

[kgray]

I'm skipping the entire next page but uh

People commenting on the nature of the voters and not the votee is textbook manipulation in my opinion. Not that I base my reads off that, but it's somewhere to start

That said I don't read Eden as coming off as particularly towny until his ragequit. What made you feel that way?

I'm not really sure what you mean? I always look for people's motivations with their votes and don't really understand how that's manipulation. Or do you mean he's looking at wagon composition too much? I care about who's on wagons and all else being relatively equal, it could play a big part in where I vote.

I feel like people put too much stock in "only town would ragequit because mafia care too much about not letting their team down" but... idk I kind of feel that with Eden. If he were scum he basically spent his time here soft clearing Sabi, deciding I'm probably town after pushing a fake scumread onto me, and arguing with ghug. It just seems very unlikely to me that that's part of some scum agenda. Also, the thing I said to Durga about this reminding me of how Eden and I clashed in the no-reveal game and Eden coming to that same conclusion.

It's always easy to say "I have no particular opinions on this wagonee, but I (dis)like the people on the wagon." I'm not a big fan of it, and often see it during my EoD1/2 deliberations when I'm trying to decide which of my suspects to flash when people are trying to veer me in the wrong direction.

Re: Eden, sure but I would also purport (hi Jamiet) that certain types of players are on average happier as town than scum and Eden fits the profile. I for one would never sub out of a VT game I think, when I may as scum.

In the end, I choose not to read too deeply into meta concerns and the rest of his verbiage did not strike me as towny outside of that context.

Alright I see your points but they don't particularly sway me, so I will continue to discourage a squigs wagon. However, obviously you should vote for your scumreads and if that's the Eden/squigs slot then that's fine and I will no longer brazenly shut down your votes lmao

[Durga]

durga are those people actually planning to act upon that alliance? I guess I thought that was tfb’s loose interpretation of who was allied to flum. If that is a list of official people claiming they want to be in flums alliance I will totally drop all of this.

Yes. This is Flum's list iirc and tfb is merely restating it and then joking about it. I feel like that's obvious if you read the convo? And if you continued reading the convo you'd see that he didn't even pick the right list to talk about because his reading compréhension skills are suspect.

I will not indulge attacking his literacy here. I merely wanted to know if it was an actual accurate list or if it was anti spew by design.

LOL and what about yours or are you using the bot to isolate certain messages without seeking context and then narrowing in on them

[kgray]

I agree that most people are more likely to sub out as scum than town.

I wouldn't

[damo666]

##vote captain

prefer that to the other 2 wagons

What do you think of TFB's vote for you?

Bad.

[kgray]

##vote captain

prefer that to the other 2 wagons

What do you think of TFB's vote for you?

Bad.

Yes but you find it to just be bad town?

[damo666]

I agree that most people are more likely to sub out as scum than town.

Disagree.

[brainbomb]

Yes. This is Flum's list iirc and tfb is merely restating it and then joking about it. I feel like that's obvious if you read the convo? And if you continued reading the convo you'd see that he didn't even pick the right list to talk about because his reading compréhension skills are suspect.

I will not indulge attacking his literacy here. I merely wanted to know if it was an actual accurate list or if it was anti spew by design.

LOL and what about yours or are you using the bot to isolate certain messages without seeking context and then narrowing in on them

The condescending tone is just intolerable. You dont have to reply to a post just because it is irksome. I just wanted clarification on what it was and if it was official and what it meant if it was not an accurate reflection.
you do not have to reply to this. feel free to move on. id prefer to talk to you at the absolute minimum possible because reading your posts makes my blood boil. I do not wish to continue this dialogue.

[Squigs44]

the game is speculation
thats the entire point of the game
im actually really annoyed you would gaslight me and pretend this isnt how the game works.

gonna walk away now before I snap at you

I dont think I've ever seen you get offended this way. I apologize for not making myself clear - I have no ill will towards you.
My goal is not to gaslight you or disregard your posts, it is to help you communicate better but if you don't want my thoughts on the subject I'll move on I guess.

were good man.
can you indulge me just the slightest and look back at that quote from flyingboat that I posted.

and just again; indulge me for a moment: if he were to flip mafia, how do you feel about that quote? how do you feel about the names he listed? what is the liklihood he listed a teammate in that grouping? what are the odds he listed both his teammates in that? or none?

just humor me and thats all I ask. what are your opinions on that outside of “we dont have time to wonder about possibilities”.

TFB didn't select people he thought were scummy, he compiled a list of Flums alliance and called them scummy collectively. I think he was more commenting on the idea of the alliance than on individuals. So as far as likelihood and probability goes, if TFB is scum, then the odds his scummates are on that list are probably close to rand.