M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

Does someone know whether bozo is known to crumb as PR

Yes, I know that I have never crumbed as PR, which could be verified if anyone wants to take the time.

I'm sure we should just take your word for it

[BesharamSabi]

Can we just end night and move on to day 3? I want to know what happens

[bozotheclown]

I think worcej chose to CC me when it looked like he would be the DK because he was confident he could win a CC battle (which so far looks like a safe assumption), or at least force town to kill the real doctor by killing both claimants. If worcej had claimed JOAT, he would just be CCed by the real JOAT at some point, so CCing me was his best option.

Your assessment here is fundamentally wrong because a caught scum would claim doctor first because it's the most harmful PR for the scum team. Your team needs me neutered to help you win.

Your assessment of the scum!worcej claiming doctor vs JOAT is also fundamentally wrong - if I was scum and you are the actual doctor, my team now knows they can just RB you to oblivion going forward so you're not an issue. The best play for a caught scum!worcej would be to take out another PR by getting the CC drug out and down the road so that we can kill that person instead.

By claiming JOAT, I would most likely not die on D2 and would enter into N2 as a semi-cleared state like what Chaqa currently is. If the real JOAT was inexperienced or excited, they might CC me since they caught a scum and then my scum team just got 2 PRs found for the price of one scum.

I am surprised how so many players seem to immediately believe worcej's CC and not take into account how I would have had to manage to claim worcej's role to get him DKed, but I believe that is my fault for being inactive leading up to D2 EOD.

I think of anyone, you're the most surprised that I am actually the doctor here. Your goal was to try to live past D2 and the doctor claim was the best bet to net a miskill of me (because if I wasn't PR I would've died, let's be honest) and then a CC eventually from the real doctor. This would net you the '2 for 1' that would benefit your team over losing you OR result in you being soft-cleared as scum, which would be great because of the no flip.

Unfortunately for you and your team, I'm the actual doctor so you're stuck at a 1:1 trade at best and just losing you at worst.

Also, for those who believe worcej's claim because he of his obnoxious and condescending N2 posts, I assure you that worcej is capable of being obnoxious and condescending as scum.

Again, the important point is that worcej must be eliminated for town to win the game.

Point to when I was obnoxious and condescending as scum. Please, go dig out some random quotes from games I was scum and flipped out like I just did. I doubt you'll find any.

The only time I think you can possibly point at it was the time that Kitsune ran the Firefly game where there were too many PRs with a role that can detect PR or VT, a 3 person scum team, and a 3rd party recruiting faction and I was scum and annoyed at how imbalanced the setup turned out to be.

Because really, my super~obvious~scumtell is when I'm way too nice than normal. Everytime I have been scum, I've been non-confrontational and tread water because I don't want to get daykilled.

if that really was your obvious scum tell, why would you not change it this game?

If you had claimed JOAT, you likely would not be believed over the real JOAT. I assume you thought you could get me DKed, and you are probably right.

[Jamiet99uk]

I actually think as under-pressure scum becoming the top wagon due to a PR claim that, as scum, you'd assume to be true, the response of claiming a *different* PR would be a pretty viable strategy as it exposes a second PR. Two PRs for one scum might, might be a worthwhile scum trade in this setup.....

[bozotheclown]

worcej is confirmed scum (at least to me), so I was correct that he first N1 post was a scum slip:

Do you know what a job is? EOD is @ 3:00 PM for me. I have meetings where I cannot be around explicitly play exactly how you want. I was watching via my cell under the table so that my damn boss didn't get pissed at me

Honestly - I hope scum do us a favor and kill you tonight. You're grinding my gears with your play style right now.

Also - well done all you 'super smart scum hunting people' who wanted to play the game instead of let mechanics drive the game - you forced the cop to claim. Top-notch scum hunting by the likes of you incredibly 'skilled' players this time around. For all the negativity that gets talked about our ability to scum hunt, you all contribute to that bad opinion with your egotistical methodologies.

Can you 'skilled players' take a moment to reflect on your absolutely horrible play and check your egos at the door this next phase?

Rant over. Time to go finish work so that I can gtfh.

Assuming Chaqa is the real cop (which I think is a very safe assumption at this point), when Chaqa claimed cop, worcej had no reason not to believe him. Since worcej had suggested no kills for the first few game days, I think he was anxious to point out that his suggestion would have prevented the cop from revealing, demonstrating that his suggestion was beneficial to town, and therefore give him town credit. worcej never considered the other possibility, that Chaqa fake claimed cop as mafia to avoid the DK and force the real cop to reveal, which I am sure most town players were considering. The slip is that worcej said "you forced the cop to claim". He was certain because he knew Chaqa was not mafia. If he had considered this possibility, he would not have been as anxious to reprimand everyone for not following his suggestion, because it meant we caught a scum D1.

Actually, what I am confirmed more than anything with my N1 post was that I was a pissed off PR that almost got daykilled (I was the 2nd highest wagon) and felt like I was exposed because of how hard I was defending myself.

Your take on my opinion of Chaqa is kinda weird to frame as a scum position considering you're depending on the same reasoning to apply to you here. You're dependent on people believing your claim was genuine and are arguing that when I believed Chaqa's claim that I was scummy.

How is "you forced the cop to claim" so incredibly scummy? Literally Chaqa had claimed that he was the cop and no one CC'ed him, so why wouldn't I believe Chaqa at this point?

Also, my rant post was made 20 minutes after Chaqa claimed. I was pretty pissed that D1 may have gotten our cop exposed because of a serious lack of people trying (a lot of people were sheeping IMHO) and we could've avoided this if we stuck to the proposed plan I made to no-kill.

I also had suggested no killing D1 to not risk immediately outing a PR, but when Chaqa claimed cop, I was skeptical of his claim, and certainly didn't jump to "no killing would have saved the cop". worcej posted as soon as N1 started, snowy even said he was trying to get the first N1 post in but worcej beat him to it. Prioritizing taking credit for a suggestion that he thought had been demonstrated to have been "correct" is not town indicative.

It is also telling that worcej's response to me pointing out his slip during D2 was to scum read me for mistakenly referring to his post occurring D2 instead of N1, when it was obvious what I was referring, and I had already corrected when I notice I had referred to it occurring D2 a couple of time instead of N1. worcej tried to make it sound like I was fabricating a timeline when it was obviously a simple mistake and clear I was talking about N1.

Here you're trying to hold me accountable for being present at the beginning of N1 and how I reacted and taking credit for how you didn't react when you were not even present. This seems pretty damn disingenuous to hold me accountable for being present at EOD1/Early N1 when you are trying to not be held accountable for be absent on D2.

As I said above, when I had posted my rant, it was ~20 minutes after the claim and right as N1 began. Within 20 minutes later, Chaqa rescinded his claim. My post was made when the thread was dead after watching an EOD1 where we have an un-CC'ed cop claim in the open when the entire day we had Bunny vs Jasnah already tee'd up and I was incredibly flustered/high energy because I was on the razor's edge as PR.

And your D2 vs N1 'mistake' is a big deal because your argument is awful if you approached it with N1 as the focus. You wanted it to be D2 because it looks far more calculating from me and would actually be scummy if I had that post going into D2. However, when you factor in actual context of the situation when that post was made, it makes total sense for doctor!worcej to be passionately pissed that:

1. I was almost killed EOD1 and was actively withholding pulling the trigger on claiming because it was so damn close.
2. Jasnah vs Bunny was the obvious route the day should've gone yet we were going down weird rabbit holes of flash wagons instead of processing the information in front of us.
3. The cop was forced to claim to prevent their own death at EOD1 and if we would've done #2, this wouldn't have happened.

If anything, the post your referencing actually helps confirm the case I am the doctor because my emotions were running high due to the above context. So thanks for trying really hard to frame that as a scum post lol...

I checked the N1 results but I did not believe it was necessary to post anything because it was best not to speculate on Chaqa's retraction in case he was the real cop.

[bozotheclown]

How convenient.

kgray's done the work for me - but your weird insistence that because I 100% believed Chaqa was the cop is a sign of being scum is garbage.

In a short span of time (~less than an hour), Chaqa claimed, I was pissed and posted my rage at the collective group playing because we forced a PR claim, and then Chaqa pulled back the claim.

Here worcej was already trying to imply my unavailability was scum indicative, as soon as I posted that I would not be online for most of the day.

You're assuming too much here. It was convenient that you were leaving when kgray and myself were both actively pointing out the inherent flaws in your case and you'd not be available to respond.

As I've said, being away isn't scummy nor is it why I scummed you. I scummed you for an incredibly bad case that had incorrect information and even with your attempted correction, the case was worse.

There was no false information, just a mistake (D2 instead of N1) that was obvious even if I had not already corrected it.

[BesharamSabi]

What do we call the bozo worcej ship?

[Chaqa]

What do we call the bozo worcej ship?

The Clownshire

[bozotheclown]

I also think it would be productive if doc claimants spent more time looking at eod wagons and who was the scum there.
(Worcej did that a little so far, but bozo did none of that)

My immediate concern was that worcej's fake claim was being so widely believed. Bonatogether, kgray, and Vecna looks suspect for their D2 EOD voting (or lack of voting).

[snowy801]

What do we call the bozo worcej ship?

The Clownshire

This is it

I feel like at some point I should read all of bozo's posts too

[Durga]

I also think it would be productive if doc claimants spent more time looking at eod wagons and who was the scum there.
(Worcej did that a little so far, but bozo did none of that)

My immediate concern was that worcej's fake claim was being so widely believed. Bonatogether, kgray, and Vecna looks suspect for their D2 EOD voting (or lack of voting).

Why them. Why not me? I tried to get you killed even after your claim

[bozotheclown]

worcej if scum would probably have claimed one of the other PR, whatever they are, not doc after seeing bozo

Why? His best chance of winning a CC battle was with me, not the JOAT or oracle. If I get DKed D3 with too many players assuming worcej is the real doctor, the game is over.

This is very melodramatic Bozo.

Why would the game be over?

worcej needs to be eliminated for town to win, which won't happen if too many players assume he is the real doctor.

[BunnyGo]

Why? His best chance of winning a CC battle was with me, not the JOAT or oracle. If I get DKed D3 with too many players assuming worcej is the real doctor, the game is over.

This is very melodramatic Bozo.

Why would the game be over?

worcej needs to be eliminated for town to win, which won't happen if too many players assume he is the real doctor.

Don’t worry. I’m the cop and I’m scanning him tonight. We may save you from an unnecessary daykill yet!

[bozotheclown]

It makes sense from worcej’s POV and maybe objectively too. bozo is pointedly not the Oracle as is worcej, and the sooner bozo dies, the sooner they kill worcej, and the longer they don’t target a potential Oracle.

It’s also worth noting that resolving an outright, no-BS counterclaim is the best use case yet for the Oracle, which incentivizes killing one claimant ASAP. And it’s probably for the best that we decide on which one we believe and stick with it.

The Oracle should be used to determine an alignment on someone we daykill with no information. I firmly believe this.

If I am DKed D3, the oracle should target me to reveal worcej is mafia.

[ghug]

What's hilarious about all of this is that they're both lying and I'm the real doctor.

It's like the time I CCed my teammate Durga.

[Jamiet99uk]

Why? His best chance of winning a CC battle was with me, not the JOAT or oracle. If I get DKed D3 with too many players assuming worcej is the real doctor, the game is over.

This is very melodramatic Bozo.

Why would the game be over?

worcej needs to be eliminated for town to win, which won't happen if too many players assume he is the real doctor.

Ok so we kill you and someone scans Worcej. E-zee.

[snowy801]

I'm actually the miller that's why I was so sure Jasnah was town

[Durga]

What's hilarious about all of this is that they're both lying and I'm the real doctor.

It's like the time I CCed my teammate Durga.

It's funny because when worcej initially claimed that's what my mind went to

[Jamiet99uk]

What's hilarious about all of this is that they're both lying and I'm the real doctor.

It's like the time I CCed my teammate Durga.

I knew it.

Which one of them is your team mate? Or is it both?

[bozotheclown]

I also think it would be productive if doc claimants spent more time looking at eod wagons and who was the scum there.
(Worcej did that a little so far, but bozo did none of that)

My immediate concern was that worcej's fake claim was being so widely believed. Bonatogether, kgray, and Vecna looks suspect for their D2 EOD voting (or lack of voting).

Why them. Why not me? I tried to get you killed even after your claim

You moved your vote to worcej after I claimed.