Mini Mafia 1018 - Race with the Devil [hidden]

[BobMcBob]

im sure it bothers you that its tricky to NK me atm. Ghug wont let you?

okay this is gold

[Chaqa]

At this point I think you know your days are numbered and you’re having fun playing to the gallery. I think you’ve been dealt a shitty hand by Jamie.

##vote Chaqa

Way to cut down and cherry pick a post out of context. It was a rhetorical post showing how the idea that ghug and I are scum together is ludicrous based off of Jamie’s reaction.

Are you actually scum because town!Maniac has no reason to manipulate info line that.

So I'm cutting down, cherry picking and manipulating your words by quoting your words?

You seem to be displaying all the signs of scum in trouble. Accusing Bona and Vecna of tunneling, attacking me for highlighting what you've said, forgetting that you thought RB on Celaph were suspicious, and then RBs made celaph town. Voting for Kaka and calling him scum then placing him in top half of your town-scum list. Good liars need good memories and you just seem to be a bad liar at the moment. Kill all liars is still a mantra that makes sense.

I can't know for certain that you're scum, but if you survive and we kill another townie today, I'll be raging that you've had my pants down.

Yes, because the full post was this:

It’s actually just me and ghug as scum

Which is probably why Jamie was upset about being subbed out

(See how that doesn’t make sense?) :D

Me and ghug can’t be a team together

Which is very clearly showing how ludicrous the idea of me and ghug as a scumteam is.

What you've done is the equivalent of taking someone posting "If I'm scum" and quoting them as saying "I'm scum" and using it as a gotcha.

I accused Bona and Vecna of tunneling because they both have a habit of doing so with me, both in mafia and in Among Us (Bona saying "PUNT CHAQA" has become a meme in our group). I didn't forget anything w/ Celaph. I had a town read on him, then the double roleblock made me suspicious, but then I remembered the doctor was dead, so it wasn't. It's called evaluating with new information.

Calling me a liar for having evolving reads makes you seem, well, like a Maniac, and I can't tell if you're pushing for an easy mis-kill or just misguided.

You keep saying "my unexplained town read" on ghug, but I've explained it a few times for different reasons, as it's gotten stronger based on a few different points:

Gonna post random thoughts

I think scum!ghug would have bussed Fish for town cred so probably town

(also the post quoted earlier, which shows my he and I cannot be scum together)

Also his townslip post:

There's literally only one mafia member left who can claim guilty, so if cop has a guilty, there is no reason to hide.

Oh, I forgot there was a godfather.

Hmm. You haven't mentioned the Godfather a single time according to the bot, so this might be a legitimate town slip. Just reinforces my read on you.

You're the one with bad memory here. You are shading me with fictitious and sloppy reasoning when the evidence right in front of you is literally the opposite of what you said.

As for my my "change of heart" on Kak, it's because I went back and re-reviewed the Day 1 votes and realized that he put Lfischl over the top, which scum probably doesn't do.

I think I got another insight like I had in a recent game (guns and roses I think).

##vote Chaqa

Elaborate?

I can't see town Chaqa really believing Ghug town slipped that way. He could have been faking and he could even have forgotten about GF as scum if he is goon. Town Chaqa doesn't jump on this to clear him.
It's much more likely scum Chaqa found a good way to justify his unexplained town read on a towny Ghug.

Literally this is how I establish town reads in every game I've ever played. I'm an Occam's Razor guy, and sometimes all it takes is a certain post or a certain mentality to ping my towndar, and it's been pinged for ghug here.

If he's scum, whatever, but I don't think I've misread ghug in a game in years.

[Chaqa]

I will admit I'm a little rusty as town, but besides a mini mafia I haven't lived past Day 1 in a town game in like six months or so, because people keep miskilling me early since they can't read me.

[BobMcBob]

In the unlikely event Chaqa does end up convincing Ghug to NK me tonight:

Reread my posts a few pages back while I was talking back and forth with Bob.

My main thought currently is that its Ghug + Chaqa. They are also the only scum pairing that would actually kill me here, so if I end up dying, dont let chaqa use his weak wifom to make you believe they would never kill me, after ive been tunneling them. They would. Because they know this train has left the station and aint slowing down. Other scum teams wouldnt, because they would be fine to have me continue the deathtunnel, and then get killed the day after for being wrong.

how likely is this to actually be the case?
im not really convinced on this
i could definitely see one being scum, and i think its actually likely, but i doubt both
but also why did the scumteam kill vecna then?

[Chaqa]

In the unlikely event Chaqa does end up convincing Ghug to NK me tonight:

Reread my posts a few pages back while I was talking back and forth with Bob.

My main thought currently is that its Ghug + Chaqa. They are also the only scum pairing that would actually kill me here, so if I end up dying, dont let chaqa use his weak wifom to make you believe they would never kill me, after ive been tunneling them. They would. Because they know this train has left the station and aint slowing down. Other scum teams wouldnt, because they would be fine to have me continue the deathtunnel, and then get killed the day after for being wrong.

how likely is this to actually be the case?
im not really convinced on this
i could definitely see one being scum, and i think its actually likely, but i doubt both
but also why did the scumteam kill vecna then?

Probably they either thought Vecna could be a cop candidate, but also to set me and/or ghug up for miskills.

[BobMcBob]

Well, that helps narrow things down.

Yep. Seems all we have to decide is whether to kill you or chaqa first.

RIP Vecna

is it really that simple though?
i maintain at best one of them is scum

[BobMcBob]

So what youre saying is that in your experience, Bona always has opinions that disagree with most of the game, and that tunnel hard on a single player and then suddenly reverse that opinion?

disagree with most of the game? absolutely
tunnel hard? not quite so sure
suddenly reverse opinions? seems very bona
were you around for voting lessons with bona? nobody agrees with him

if voting lessons with bona was the game i was scum i was trolling

i mean youve consistently clashed on voting opinions in other games too, and still try to tie things randomly

[Chaqa]

If I had to vote ghug to save myself I would, since I know I'm town but only think he's town, but I would much rather vote elsewhere.

I'm hoping the Cop has a guilty specifically because I feel pretty uncertain about who scum are, and also because it seems likely I get miskilled today and town has to go to MILO or w/e the appropriate initialism is.

I'm thinking RDR or Bob are most likely scum, and I may be wrong on Bona. I still don't feel like ghug is scum. Celaph should be town in any world where scum is actually worried about the Cop, since they wouldn't want to waste their roleblock, so he's out of the PoE for me.

[BobMcBob]

In the unlikely event Chaqa does end up convincing Ghug to NK me tonight:

Reread my posts a few pages back while I was talking back and forth with Bob.

My main thought currently is that its Ghug + Chaqa. They are also the only scum pairing that would actually kill me here, so if I end up dying, dont let chaqa use his weak wifom to make you believe they would never kill me, after ive been tunneling them. They would. Because they know this train has left the station and aint slowing down. Other scum teams wouldnt, because they would be fine to have me continue the deathtunnel, and then get killed the day after for being wrong.

how likely is this to actually be the case?
im not really convinced on this
i could definitely see one being scum, and i think its actually likely, but i doubt both
but also why did the scumteam kill vecna then?

Probably they either thought Vecna could be a cop candidate, but also to set me and/or ghug up for miskills.

yeah i think those are the two best options
either that or you and/or ghug were getting desperate
i really dont know what to make of this
i could see scum copreading vecna for lying unusually low, although why kill him if he was deathtunneling non-scum anyway?

[BobMcBob]

we are no longer buddies

odds are scum are rbing their kills and then rbing you for towncred

Why would scum RB their kill in this situation?

cause there's a cop out there? unless they are reasonably certain that celaph is cop, there's no value to roleblocking him repeatedly, but if they know he's cop, why not kill him????

because killing one and rbing the other basically blocks two different people?

[Chaqa]

how likely is this to actually be the case?
im not really convinced on this
i could definitely see one being scum, and i think its actually likely, but i doubt both
but also why did the scumteam kill vecna then?

Probably they either thought Vecna could be a cop candidate, but also to set me and/or ghug up for miskills.

yeah i think those are the two best options
either that or you and/or ghug were getting desperate
i really dont know what to make of this
i could see scum copreading vecna for lying unusually low, although why kill him if he was deathtunneling non-scum anyway?

Unclear. But if I were scum with ghug, and my entire PoE was worcej/Vecna, and worc flipped town, why would I nightkill Vecna, leaving my entire reads in shambles, a bunch of suspicion on me?

If I were scum with ghug, and this happened, and you flipped me as scum, ghug would get yeeted out quicker than anyone could think about it. It doesn't make any sense for me to kill Vecna there.

I will concede it makes at least some sense for scum!Ghug to kill Vecna there, to set up a miskill on me, and when I flip town he can be like "see? The whole theory is wrong," hence why in a pinch I would still vote ghug, but overall... this feels like a strange nightkill.

[Chaqa]

Why would scum RB their kill in this situation?

cause there's a cop out there? unless they are reasonably certain that celaph is cop, there's no value to roleblocking him repeatedly, but if they know he's cop, why not kill him????

because killing one and rbing the other basically blocks two different people?

I missed that post by Bona. He's a smart kid, I feel like he should understand that point

[BobMcBob]

My gut reaction to vecna's death was that we have to kill ghug or chaqa, but what if vecna was killed to provoke that reaction? That would mean that it can't be either of them as neither would be certain of winning that dual. But if not chaqa or ghug then my only other scum pick still alive is Bona. I suppose a Bona/Celaph pairing is possible. I need to sleep on this.

Maniac might be town??

I think ghug would absolutely believe he could win that duel. You know my view on this - I would not think I could.

i think ghug would win this duel naturally, so maybe ghug is the more likely scum here?
i kinda doubt chaqa would go for the wifom on this one because its so weak here
so maybe ghug is actually more likely scum

[BobMcBob]

Probably they either thought Vecna could be a cop candidate, but also to set me and/or ghug up for miskills.

yeah i think those are the two best options
either that or you and/or ghug were getting desperate
i really dont know what to make of this
i could see scum copreading vecna for lying unusually low, although why kill him if he was deathtunneling non-scum anyway?

Unclear. But if I were scum with ghug, and my entire PoE was worcej/Vecna, and worc flipped town, why would I nightkill Vecna, leaving my entire reads in shambles, a bunch of suspicion on me?

If I were scum with ghug, and this happened, and you flipped me as scum, ghug would get yeeted out quicker than anyone could think about it. It doesn't make any sense for me to kill Vecna there.

I will concede it makes at least some sense for scum!Ghug to kill Vecna there, to set up a miskill on me, and when I flip town he can be like "see? The whole theory is wrong," hence why in a pinch I would still vote ghug, but overall... this feels like a strange nightkill.

i mean theres no getting around its strange
and this is actually why im leaning that ghug might be the more likely scum here because of the way this pairing feels like it should play out
unless you really wanted to do a suicide run in town!ghug i guess
but i think scum!ghug is probably more likely responsible for this kill than scum!chaqa

of course theres always the possibility that it was just neither and vecna was completely wrong and somebody wanted to set up a duel here

[BobMcBob]

Why would scum RB their kill in this situation?

cause there's a cop out there? unless they are reasonably certain that celaph is cop, there's no value to roleblocking him repeatedly, but if they know he's cop, why not kill him????

Right. RBing the kill has no purpose, since the only PR left is the cop, and they won't get a scan off anyway if they're dead. RBing celaph makes a lot of sense in that scenario, because it doesn't create a new softclear and gives two shots at preventing a scan.

I have the luxury of knowing that the Vecna kill was not cop hunting, as I was his only consistent townread and I'm town. The fact that you're pushing the narrative that scum never kill to frame people because it doesn't work while also pushing to kill the people he scumread because he died is very strange.

you what exactly?
the person vecna was consistently scumreading says with authority scum was not cop because vecna townread him?
ghug what the heck is this post
was your intention to make bona look bad here?

i mean the post stands alone as not a good look for bona but this ghug post is... weird
i dont like it

[Chaqa]

Bob, you're being all too reasonable. I might need to unvote you lol

I feel like Maniac, Kak, and RDR should all be able to read through this and come to the same conclusions you are, so hopefully we can stop with this nonsense of voting me.

[Chaqa]

cause there's a cop out there? unless they are reasonably certain that celaph is cop, there's no value to roleblocking him repeatedly, but if they know he's cop, why not kill him????

Right. RBing the kill has no purpose, since the only PR left is the cop, and they won't get a scan off anyway if they're dead. RBing celaph makes a lot of sense in that scenario, because it doesn't create a new softclear and gives two shots at preventing a scan.

I have the luxury of knowing that the Vecna kill was not cop hunting, as I was his only consistent townread and I'm town. The fact that you're pushing the narrative that scum never kill to frame people because it doesn't work while also pushing to kill the people he scumread because he died is very strange.

you what exactly?
the person vecna was consistently scumreading says with authority scum was not cop because vecna townread him?
ghug what the heck is this post
was your intention to make bona look bad here?

i mean the post stands alone as not a good look for bona but this ghug post is... weird
i dont like it

I missed that. How can ghug be claiming he was a consistent townread of Vecna, when Vecna was scumreading him and I? Hmmm.

[BobMcBob]

Bob, you're being all too reasonable. I might need to unvote you lol

I feel like Maniac, Kak, and RDR should all be able to read through this and come to the same conclusions you are, so hopefully we can stop with this nonsense of voting me.

yeah im really not sold on you being scum here
i dont think it works except as some kind of crazy suicide play which i do not expect
i honestly half expect someone to come along later and tear this completely to shreds and put up a good case for you but really not feeling it right now

[Chaqa]

Bob, you're being all too reasonable. I might need to unvote you lol

I feel like Maniac, Kak, and RDR should all be able to read through this and come to the same conclusions you are, so hopefully we can stop with this nonsense of voting me.

yeah im really not sold on you being scum here
i dont think it works except as some kind of crazy suicide play which i do not expect
i honestly half expect someone to come along later and tear this completely to shreds and put up a good case for you but really not feeling it right now

I'm wondering if it might be ghug-bona at this moment.

Bona was reciprocally townreading me until the night time. I wonder if his teammate (ghug or not) could have told him to start scumreading me to help set up for a miskill with the double whammy NK on Vecna.

[BobMcBob]

It’s actually just me and ghug as scum

If I were scum I would have jokingly said so by now.

At this point I think you know your days are numbered and you’re having fun playing to the gallery. I think you’ve been dealt a shitty hand by Jamie.

##vote Chaqa

this is such an amusing and yet not at all good way to place a vote