MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

##Call GM
in the event that a setup was rolled in which only 11 players chose town roles, would the setup be considered balanced/playable?

that would mean even one mis-elim would make town unable to have parity

GM NOTE:

I said in the sign-up thread, and again on Page 1, post #3, of this thread, that the setup would run if the following minimum parameters were met:

i) At least 11 players (i.e. more than 50%) are Town;
AND
ii) At least 3 players are of anti-Town alignment.

This is all the information the GM will provide on this topic. Thank you.

[ghug]

Perhaps you are projecting. I remembered being shocked at your 180 on whether or not HR needed to die, so I mentioned it.

Besides, I don't need to lay groundwork for shading you. You did plenty of that yourself

Honestly I would have still advocated not hammering if I had still been alive overnight. We were too quick on the draw, and he has a pattern of jailing me N1 in multi-mafia games, which felt too convenient to be a coincidence (I'm very curious if he even remembered this now).

If you had been alive overnight? What does that mean?

I feel like you're explaining your questioning of scum!HR pretty unnecessarily hard... All someone has to do is say "HR's ego would allow him to act this way as town" and that's a decent reason to wonder.

Awake* clearly I'm still asleep. I missed the hammering.

The jailer bit is fun to talk about because it feels humorously foolish now (and somehow I managed to guess which role he was going to claim). The ego bit was the reason my gut townread him right after he did it.

Why are you telling me why I should have thought what I thought?

[ghug]

damo, me, rivera, kgray, rhk

thats a great towncore

Hamilton too.

Wait why is rivera here?

[kgray]

Honestly I would have still advocated not hammering if I had still been alive overnight. We were too quick on the draw, and he has a pattern of jailing me N1 in multi-mafia games, which felt too convenient to be a coincidence (I'm very curious if he even remembered this now).

If you had been alive overnight? What does that mean?

I feel like you're explaining your questioning of scum!HR pretty unnecessarily hard... All someone has to do is say "HR's ego would allow him to act this way as town" and that's a decent reason to wonder.

Awake* clearly I'm still asleep. I missed the hammering.

The jailer bit is fun to talk about because it feels humorously foolish now (and somehow I managed to guess which role he was going to claim). The ego bit was the reason my gut townread him right after he did it.

Why are you telling me why I should have thought what I thought?

I'm not telling you what you should have thought, and if you really went to that previous jailor!HR game for your doubts, then fine. It just seems to me like you're being overly defensive about all this when all I did was point out that jasnah wasn't the only person who did an immediate 180 on HR. I didn't say it means anything about her alignment or yours or if there's any connection there at all.

[kgray]

damo, me, rivera, kgray, rhk

thats a great towncore

Hamilton too.

Wait why is rivera here?

I decided he's town.

[ghug]

Hamilton too.

Wait why is rivera here?

I decided he's town.

Why?

[kgray]

Wait why is rivera here?

I decided he's town.

Why?

Because he's obvtown...?

[ghug]

I decided he's town.

Why?

Because he's obvtown...?

Why are you like this?

[brainbomb]

damo, me, rivera, kgray, rhk

thats a great towncore

Hamilton too.

Wait why is rivera here?

[brainbomb]

Hamilton too.

Wait why is rivera here?

[kgray]

Why?

Because he's obvtown...?

Why are you like this?

It's fun to troll you

[brainbomb]

ive liked rivera this game

[brainbomb]

damo have you ever seen the movie mr brooks?

[ghug]

Since kgray is so obviously town, I encourage the mafia to kill her.

[celaph]

Figuring that it's best to respond to both of kgray's questions at once.

My pre-webdip experience I played a game (Blood on the Clocktower) that was designed with more faking town PR claims (every town was town PR and scum are given fake claims). The best fake claims I've seen were so good because they came early. People know that someone who waited until late to say much can easily tailor their results to fit the current view. And they have plausible deniability when they go late because everyone is a target.

Now, I certainly don't expect Damo to have thought through all the above, but I think some of the core feelings would match up. I think scum Damo would be more acutely aware that the longer he waits on a generic PR claim the better his results have to be once he outs. He would know that he can cherry pick results so he would expect others to expect it. Whereas I think town Damo would be more concerned for himself. He had seen that Ezio has discarded town doctor leaving us low on protective roles.

In my experience with set-ups somewhat similar to this, a good fake claim can almost win the game on its own. That's why you plan them. At least listening to others, he is getting town credit for it so I'd say he's getting quite a lot. While I can only guess why I was chosen, I think it gives him a good answer to the question why out now. Speaking from personal experience, if you out yourself without a good reason, people will sus you regardless of your claim.

To answer the last question in your first post, I don't think that there was much pressure from others on him yet, though there is an indirect pressure as I outlined above. Lastly, I slightly disagree with the premise/wording in your last question. Everyone knows that Damo was claiming I'm not alien though I concede that I'm the only person that knows for sure that he's telling the truth. I think the reasons for scum trying to clear a townie exist here as always. Possibly he wants to pocket me (it worked with Bozo last game). He can always push me as mafia if he really needs to.

I think Ezio's claim came after damo's claim?

But okay. I still lean towards it being more likely that frustrated town!damo outs than calculated scum!damo comes up with this plan. I just don't think it sounds like something damo would do.

Macca style response bomb coming in. Glad we hit HR.

No, Ezio's came before Damo's.

[celaph]

So while you're all here, come and answer one question:

What on earth is my scum motivation for, well, anything that happened at the EoD?

Come up with a convincing answer and I'll even self-hammer

No, first you tell me why you think I'd switch from scumreading someone to calling them obvtown for basically no reason if they suddenly become my scumbuddy. That's trash and you know I'd never do that.

Isn't this what you thought I might have done with ghug? Almost like we can agree it is a bad move. :)

[celaph]

I might do one of those tonal analyses on her

Do it! I can get an idea of how much I should trust your conclusions haha

So kgray is very town, and not at all scum, so we should all sheep her

I'll do a real one in a bit

Hey, that was my line.

[kgray]

Since kgray is so obviously town, I encourage the mafia to kill her.

[celaph]

@celaph, how much weight do you think is reasonable in attributing to previous game performances? I'm just noticing you have been going back to a few very specific pieces to help contribute to a line of thinking in this game.

By previous game performances do you mean quality of play or particular habit and behaviors in their play? An example of the former would be Vecna who, despite having a rather poor D1, I would never vote for today because of the quality of his last two games when attentive.

If you're talking about specific habits then it's slightly situation dependent. Do you have an example in mind? As a general rule I think that previous game performances matter more early on when I have less info from this game. It also helps if you've seen them as both town and mafia so you have a fair comparison.

More possible to be aligned with vecna here

I defended Vecna D1 last game like this and it worked out in our favor.

[celaph]

@celaph

Did you claim VT?

If so, why?

I did claim VT. Given my extensive knowledge about my role pm, it was the obvious choice.