MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[Bonatogether]

Bozo, can you please start doing something other than bookkeeping the discard claims? Push a little, question a little (not about discards), give some of your feelings about people. Stop hiding behind a very basic mechs operation.

Bona is town after keeping to his thought process, though it is one I think is infuriating and makes me want to put head through wall.

But we need info because there's nothing out there right now than some easily faked discards.

[kgray]

Caught up reading.

For now I like Bob and Bona. I kind of like emc. He's barely written anything but I think that given the opportunity he would pick a town role, and at risk of doing too much mechs there's a pretty high chance of drawing at least one town card.

Would like to hear from Macca before EOD. I guess it's a somewhat better wagon than ghug but I'm not in love with it either.

Why did you dislike the ghug wagon? And if you disliked it, why did you (try to) join it when it was in the lead with 3 votes?

[Hamilton Brian]

I remember having some feelings earlier today.

I didn't like the Bunny-Ghug go-between. I do not think these two are on the same team (including TT).

I remember having some scummy thoughts about Bona earlier, but they have lessened as he responded well to the criticism I was reading.

I like kgray and damo.

Bozo seems weird, he isn't doing anything. I also don't like Vecna doing two posts and leaving, especially when one of those posts was "1".

What's this prefect business?

What makes you think Bunny and Ghug aren't on the same team? I think that means that you're ruling out scum scum, but...not sure you were in 63 but I think many people would have said the same thing about ghug and brain.

Was Bona responding well? Perhaps we were reading different passages. Where did they "excel?"

Why do you like kgray?

Why do you like Damo?

I'll agree with you about Vecna, especially the jibber jabber in the second post.

However, isn't this Bozo's MO?

[Bonatogether]

@bona, I think you should reconsider your lurker perspective. Usually lurkers aren't going to suddenly start talking and giving us "info" later, so keeping them around does nothing except for get rid of active players who are easier to read just by virtue of them contributing.

Well, I can always stare at Macca intently until they realise I want them to participate more. Like, seriously. (Does that count as out of game communication? idk) But I agree with you, bona, your perspective on lurkers and info flips is not... helpful.

Like I said earlier, there are other candidates I prefer, like celaph, but if it's brain vs ezio, I'm voting brain.

[Bonatogether]

anyway this discussion tells me that bona is new and worth disregarding. thats all Ive taken from this

Turns out this argument with bona has been more of a rabbithole than the massclaim was. I definitely didn't expect that. I personally think that if bona keeps up this attitude, anyone he votes in the first 2-3 days is probably a bad dk unless they obvscummed themselves.

##vote bona :)

[Bonatogether]

so are you even gonna try to explain why im a bad guy here

I'm not claiming that you're scum. I'm voting for better VCA to examine later.

Maybe I have the big dumb, but I don't understand voting for VCA.

VCA is analyzing the votes to discover the intent. However if the intent becomes meta, the you're analyzing the plan to analyze? If the voting's not natural, then what information can you hope to gleam from it? In this case you suggest "to force ties, to see reactions", especially with saying this is your plan, people can/will just vote around you, knowing that your vote is not based on it's effect and is therefore likely to change?

If I am mistaken, please correct me.

No, but forcing an artificial tie with 3 minutes on the clock makes people show town/scum pretty clearly, and that either leads to a more scum or partially clears someone.

[kgray]

I would not mind also a Maniac wagon, his total lack of content other then a weird vote on Brain isn't what I expect from him.

##vote Maniac

I don't agree with this take. I find his brain vote slightly ridiculous since it was based on an assumption that I find hard to believe, and hasn't been explained or backed up with anything since. But he has made iffy votes like this as town plenty of times - Durga in M62 and Jamie in M61, off the top of my head.

[kgray]

so are you even gonna try to explain why im a bad guy here

I'm not claiming that you're scum. I'm voting for better VCA to examine later.

Maybe I have the big dumb, but I don't understand voting for VCA.

VCA is analyzing the votes to discover the intent. However if the intent becomes meta, the you're analyzing the plan to analyze? If the voting's not natural, then what information can you hope to gleam from it? In this case you suggest "to force ties, to see reactions", especially with saying this is your plan, people can/will just vote around you, knowing that your vote is not based on it's effect and is therefore likely to change?

If I am mistaken, please correct me.

Love the way you put this. You are not mistaken, imo.

[kgray]

The most significant thing to have happened so far (and by a wide marģin) is Bozo claiming to have discarded Mafia GF.

If he is telling the truth he probably either has a valuable town role, a super valuable alien role or he fancied SK. Almost certainly not a weaker Mafia role.

He could be lying and gambling that GF wasn't dealt but with a probability of only 26/68 this is an unlikely Bozo type gambit.

I think the most likely reason for Bozo to claim to have discarded Mafia GF is that he actually RETAINED Mafia GF.

##vote Bozo

Why do you think bozo wouldn't pick a VT or not-so-valuable town PR role over GF?

[Hamilton Brian]

Do we DK Ezio to at least get the info of being whatever role? I know we've been around it so many times in previous games but would we rather not have the information rather than have them replaced and still keep guessing?

##Vote Ezio

[Bonatogether]

Do we DK Ezio to at least get the info of being whatever role? I know we've been around it so many times in previous games but would we rather not have the information rather than have them replaced and still keep guessing?

##Vote Ezio

This flip tells us nothing about anyone else.

[Bonatogether]

##vote hb

[Hamilton Brian]

The most significant thing to have happened so far (and by a wide marģin) is Bozo claiming to have discarded Mafia GF.

If he is telling the truth he probably either has a valuable town role, a super valuable alien role or he fancied SK. Almost certainly not a weaker Mafia role.

He could be lying and gambling that GF wasn't dealt but with a probability of only 26/68 this is an unlikely Bozo type gambit.

I think the most likely reason for Bozo to claim to have discarded Mafia GF is that he actually RETAINED Mafia GF.

##vote Bozo

Just placeholding this reply until I see if Bozo replied to this or not. It's a hell of a hypothesis.

Seeing Macca's follow up to this...the question I was wondering is if this puts Damo and Macca as scum teammates? Probably not; scum wouldn't be that bold to piggyback on one wagon when there's other possibilities. Should it carry through then they'd be suspect together.

[Hamilton Brian]

##vote hb

Heh. Ok. Why?

[Bonatogether]

##vote hb

Heh. Ok. Why?

Ezio is the worst dk by far. There's no town reason for pushing it.

[Hamilton Brian]

Do we DK Ezio to at least get the info of being whatever role? I know we've been around it so many times in previous games but would we rather not have the information rather than have them replaced and still keep guessing?

##Vote Ezio

This flip tells us nothing about anyone else.

Right; but I seem to recall some previous players dropping out because they scored a scum role. Or is that all a dream I had?

[Bonatogether]

Do we DK Ezio to at least get the info of being whatever role? I know we've been around it so many times in previous games but would we rather not have the information rather than have them replaced and still keep guessing?

##Vote Ezio

This flip tells us nothing about anyone else.

Right; but I seem to recall some previous players dropping out because they scored a scum role. Or is that all a dream I had?

But if he does drop out, he'll be modkilled, and if we dk him, it doesn't help us find his scum partners.

[kgray]

The most significant thing to have happened so far (and by a wide marģin) is Bozo claiming to have discarded Mafia GF.

If he is telling the truth he probably either has a valuable town role, a super valuable alien role or he fancied SK. Almost certainly not a weaker Mafia role.

He could be lying and gambling that GF wasn't dealt but with a probability of only 26/68 this is an unlikely Bozo type gambit.

I think the most likely reason for Bozo to claim to have discarded Mafia GF is that he actually RETAINED Mafia GF.

##vote Bozo

This is actually quite interesting, and it goes with his rather strange (at least to me) opening. I think I'll join you

##VOTE bozo

@Damo - maybe bozo doesn’t have to gamble on the Mafia GF not being dealt. If he has a mafia role and know someone else has picked Mafia GF.

I’m heavily town reading Damo for not realising mafia bozo would know who his scum mates are.

Why do you assumne that damo didn't realize scum!bozo would know who his teammates are?

Also, when Mafia role PMs are sent out, I think they usually just include the player names and not their roles? I've deleted mine from M1011, but I remember talking in the QT about who got what role, and Jamie GM'd that one too. Plus in the role PMs listed in the setup it just includes names of teammates, not roles. So scum wouldn't know who has what roles until they get to their QT.

[kgray]

I should say though that voting bozo of the back of him discarding mafia GF is poor town play. If he has drawn a super value non-mafia card he will be NK soon enough. If he is still alive D3/D4 then he might make a good DK but not now.

I don't understand this. How would scum know if he drew a super value non-mafia card regardless of whether he's being honest about discarding GF?

But yes, killing him because he claims to have discarded GF is dumb.

[kgray]

Town damo: Oh, I had two PR options in my role. I BET THAT MEANS THE ENTIRE GAME THAT HAS 1 PR OPTION MUST HAVE 2 OPTIONS

^ unlikely scenario

Scum Damo: Oh, ive been debating in scumchat with my hoodlums. We all had multiple strong options to choose, but we wanted scum obviously.

^ would result in him knowing that scum all had interesting choices, and making that post.

##vote Damo

nice scum-logic-slip bro

I don't think I've seen Vecna (attempt to) townslip before?

Also, damo claims to have discarded VT.