MAFIA 63: THE SCOURGE [HIDDEN]

[worcej]

I actually don't even care if a Cop claims and says worcej is innocent, my vote isn't moving

See y'all after EOD

Convenient, I start asking you to explain your complete 180 thought process and you run away.

[Chaqa]

##Vote President Eden
##END

[President Eden]

I'm pretty obviously being gaslit by either mafia or colossal asshole towns when my reasoning for thinking worcej as mafia isn't even bad.

I get yelled at and sussed for explaining myself and then when I get frustrated and decide to walk away I get yelled at and sussed.

The fuck am I supposed to do here exactly?

[Chaqa]

I will vote for any of the following today:
- Bozo
- Celaph
- Donny
- Flum
- HR
- President Eden

I won't vote for anyone else, barring a guilty scan.

[Chaqa]

I'm pretty obviously being gaslit by either mafia or colossal asshole towns when my reasoning for thinking worcej as mafia isn't even bad.

I get yelled at and sussed for explaining myself and then when I get frustrated and decide to walk away I get yelled at and sussed.

The fuck am I supposed to do here exactly?

Take a breath. Step out of the tunnel. Vote for one of the people who didn't vote for ghug, instead of one of the ones who did.

No reason for us to get into big-brain mindgames yet until we've chased down a few more likely leads. The Day 2 Bona and 3rd party voters are the likeliest place to find scum.

[Chaqa]

I'm trolling a bit, but I'm town and I completely follow worcej's logic. I don't agree 100% with him, but I can see town!worcej doing this play, because he's done similar things before (don't ask me for examples, I don't remember when/where they were).

His explanations make sense to me. You said you wouldn't change your vote even with an innocent scan. That's more scummy than anything he's done.

[President Eden]

It's not even a fucking tunnel dude. I explained point-blank over and over why I thought worcej's behavior was suspicious and what would be reasonable for him to do instead. I didn't get that behavior, but instead got endless batshit theories about me being the deep threat, and a whole bunch of other behavior that still doesn't amount to finding actual mafia and pressing them. I got harassed for "oversimplifying" while worcej bad faith oversimplifies what I'm arguing, and now I'm being harassed for pushing "big brain mindgames" because I think someone shouldn't be voting their town read and should be finding mafia to push.

You say you get worcej's thinking, but again I say, look at your reaction to the same situation. Did you vote your town read? No. Did you endhammer your town read? No. You've spent the whole phase looking for other answers and trying to push them. That's what town does in that situation. That is not what worcej has done.
That's why I don't suspect you even though I'm royally pissed at you right now.

I respect your heuristic that you don't want to vote ghug voters today, but I think worcej's behavior makes no sense coming from town and I am not moving my vote.

[Chaqa]

He did analysis, but it's mostly based around what happens after we flip Bona, which he assumed we would do (and might still happen).

Look how everyone else is letting you, me, worc, and Donny go back and forth on this? There's people like HR and Flum and Bozo being silent and watching us fight. That's where scum is.

[Jamiet99uk]

I've always disagreed with end votes being scummy. Maybe a bunch of them or piling on is, but one or two end votes don't mean anything, especially at this point. Shading worcej for his end vote is silly.

I didn't think Eden was being super scummy until today. I really don't understand his thought process here.

How do you not understand why I would be suspicious of someone declaring a player town and then voting them and endhammering them.

I didn't say endhammers are per se suspicious. Endhammers on people you townread sure are.

I DID THIS WITH BRAIN, BUT WHERE WAS YOUR COMPLAINT THEN?!?!

Come on Worcej that is hardly the same thing. You were the 14th voter on Brainbomb, and the eighth person to hammer, and it was very, very clear that he was the only wagon going to be flipped that day. It was pretty much a consensus. Sure you said you townread him, but it's not the same scenario at all, not even close.

[President Eden]

He did analysis, but it's mostly based around what happens after we flip Bona, which he assumed we would do (and might still happen).

Look how everyone else is letting you, me, worc, and Donny go back and forth on this? There's people like HR and Flum and Bozo being silent and watching us fight. That's where scum is.

He did a bunch of analysis assuming Bona would flip mafia, which is not what he himself believes will happen. That's the heart of the inconsistency that I struggle to grasp here. Why would you sink all your effort for the day (until the last few hours) into scenarios you concede are unlikely, and not try to present a convincing narrative that fits what you actually believe?

Your last point does make sense. It'd be nice for the bystanders to weigh in one way or another.

[worcej]

It's not even a fucking tunnel dude. I explained point-blank over and over why I thought worcej's behavior was suspicious and what would be reasonable for him to do instead. I didn't get that behavior, but instead got endless batshit theories about me being the deep threat, and a whole bunch of other behavior that still doesn't amount to finding actual mafia and pressing them. I got harassed for "oversimplifying" while worcej bad faith oversimplifies what I'm arguing, and now I'm being harassed for pushing "big brain mindgames" because I think someone shouldn't be voting their town read and should be finding mafia to push.

You say you get worcej's thinking, but again I say, look at your reaction to the same situation. Did you vote your town read? No. Did you endhammer your town read? No. You've spent the whole phase looking for other answers and trying to push them. That's what town does in that situation. That is not what worcej has done.
That's why I don't suspect you even though I'm royally pissed at you right now.

I respect your heuristic that you don't want to vote ghug voters today, but I think worcej's behavior makes no sense coming from town and I am not moving my vote.

You’ve also completely avoided my questions about your inconsistencies so far...

[Jamiet99uk]

He did analysis, but it's mostly based around what happens after we flip Bona, which he assumed we would do (and might still happen).

Look how everyone else is letting you, me, worc, and Donny go back and forth on this? There's people like HR and Flum and Bozo being silent and watching us fight. That's where scum is.

I could see one of those three people being scum, perhaps. If I had to pick just one, probably Flum. I townlean the other two, but not with any great certainty. HR has fooled me before and Bozo is Bozo.

[Jamiet99uk]

##Vote President Eden
##END

This is silly.
Don't be silly, Chaqa.

[Jamiet99uk]

@Worcej: Why do you always end up in these really heated, slightly unpleasant arguments with people? Seriously.

[President Eden]

It's not even a fucking tunnel dude. I explained point-blank over and over why I thought worcej's behavior was suspicious and what would be reasonable for him to do instead. I didn't get that behavior, but instead got endless batshit theories about me being the deep threat, and a whole bunch of other behavior that still doesn't amount to finding actual mafia and pressing them. I got harassed for "oversimplifying" while worcej bad faith oversimplifies what I'm arguing, and now I'm being harassed for pushing "big brain mindgames" because I think someone shouldn't be voting their town read and should be finding mafia to push.

You say you get worcej's thinking, but again I say, look at your reaction to the same situation. Did you vote your town read? No. Did you endhammer your town read? No. You've spent the whole phase looking for other answers and trying to push them. That's what town does in that situation. That is not what worcej has done.
That's why I don't suspect you even though I'm royally pissed at you right now.

I respect your heuristic that you don't want to vote ghug voters today, but I think worcej's behavior makes no sense coming from town and I am not moving my vote.

You’ve also completely avoided my questions about your inconsistencies so far...

You owe me some real answers before you get a fucking thing from me.

[President Eden]

@Worcej: Why do you always end up in these really heated, slightly unpleasant arguments with people? Seriously.

Hold on a sec, that's not really fair. I clearly started this fight and have been the more heated party by far. You can't blame him for that.

[worcej]

He did analysis, but it's mostly based around what happens after we flip Bona, which he assumed we would do (and might still happen).

Look how everyone else is letting you, me, worc, and Donny go back and forth on this? There's people like HR and Flum and Bozo being silent and watching us fight. That's where scum is.

He did a bunch of analysis assuming Bona would flip mafia, which is not what he himself believes will happen. That's the heart of the inconsistency that I struggle to grasp here. Why would you sink all your effort for the day (until the last few hours) into scenarios you concede are unlikely, and not try to present a convincing narrative that fits what you actually believe?

Your last point does make sense. It'd be nice for the bystanders to weigh in one way or another.

If he flips town, that would indicate that HB messed up more than anything else. I would also then look at the position each other person was on and try to see if they were online near EOD.

I am on mobile and that analysis is much more detailed than the easier one of if he is scum

[Hellenic Riot]

Why is there this obsession with solving eod 2 because to me it feels milked a bit. So we understand the scum thought process there too?
K, good point that the scumteam collapsed but I am concerned that it may not help us fully in the way we expect. Although if bona is scum it puts us in poe mode, but I think he is prob town so he is a cw then for ghug. I know i am ignoring nuances such as bb and hb weirdness around eod though.

Because EOD2 had multiple scum players under pressure and there was weird vote movements made by HB and BB that lead to suspicion of the Bona slot.

Did they make the weird moves because they had no great options?
Did they make the weird moves because they were just bad or not able to coordinate?
Did they make the weird moves because they were the only scum online around then?

Another reason why EOD2 is more important is because literally EOD3 and EOD4 were boring easy flips of obv!scum BB and HB. EOD1 also improves via VCA as more flips happen, but Bona's flip is the best information flip for that day whereas all you'll learn from my flip is EOD1 was TvT, which scum wanted to begin with..

I think you underestimate how much resistance there was to daykilling HB yesterday tbh

[Jamiet99uk]

I desperately need to finish working on a report (yes it's 10:15pm and I am working, pity me) but I will be back for EoD if I can, and in the meantime ##Vote Worcej.

[aarodactyl]

##end

this is the funniest post I've seen in a while