M61 - The Mastermind's Revenge - Game Thread - HIDDEN

[dargorygel]

SCUM Willing to Vote

Chaqa Chaqa
Bunny darg
Macca rdr
kgray ...
darg Macca
rdr Bunny
Jamie kgray
Damo Jamie

TOWN Do not wish to vote

My vote will be for the highest on my willing to vote list unless unviable when it goes to the next one on the list with a viable wagon. For example I will only vote Macca if all of chaqa darg and rdr and unviable. It can also be deduced I will only vote Jamie if it is a Jamie v me battle.

So...if I'm reading this right, Macca and I are scum you won't vote for. darg and rdr are town you WILL vote for....

Cool story. Very helpful in understanding what you're thinking and believing this is based on hunting.

I laughed loud at my workplace with this comment, had to +1 it. It's bizarre even for Damo. I can understand this in a regular daykill but not kilo.

I do understand him, I think. Damo trusts mechanics more than his "reads." Also this much effort from scum damo right at this moment does not make sense to me.

[rdrivera2005]

The thing is although I don't particularly scumread darg or rdr I am pretty damn convinced one of them must be mechanically scum. Although I scumlean Macca and you more than rdr and darg you could both be town, so if the Chaqa wagon crumbles I would rather vote darg or rdr than you or Macca even though it is counter to my reads. I hope this makes sense.


Typos amended.

This makes some sense, but I still don't think we should trust so much on mechanical info as considering the recruit there is a ton of options to scum roles.

[BunnyGo]

This was in response to my question.
BunnyGo is now Fluminator's second highest scumread.
It's clear.

It isn’t clear. You’re just mucking the waters.

I asked him if Damo was his #2 scumread.
His first post after me asking this question was just ##VOTE BUNNYGO.

Ffs. Have you caught up yet?

[Jamiet99uk]

I'm still salty about Jimbo. I'm trying to remember why so many people went from scumreading him to him not being a leading candidate. And how he managed to push all our daykills while not actively being read as pushing them.

This is a TOTALLY false narrative.

I totally owned up to pushing the Flum and Ghug wagons. I once again took responsibility for these in my response to "drunk" Bunny's ISO, on page 267.

Here it is again just to prove the accuracy of what I'm saying while you continue to tell lies about me instead:

tldr; The ballad of Jamiet:

1) Despite me thinking others had been leading town, Jamiet push Flum, saved kgray and pushed ghug, saved himself from Maniac, and acknowledged and then deflected chaqa's possible scum slip.

2) Jamiet closely read the Fruit Vendor role, and while he wasn't out as a healer then, knew the healers would be affected. And didn't say anything about it for a "scum" FV.

3) Every day Jamiet focused hard on getting everyone to declare they hadn't been RBd. Then finally announced "Oh! It costs scum coin...there ARE NO roleblocks happening." This seems like a possible tryhard fake town slip.

Conclusion: If darg is town, and chaqa scum, then Jamiet goes up my scum list.

There's a lot of rubbish in your emotive, sloppy iso of me, but let me pick up a few points here, in line with your own numbering:

1) You are right that I pushed Fluminator. His massclaim plan, at that time, was very bad. I figured it could be scum-motivated. You are right that I pushed Ghug. I made my reasons for doing so very clear at the time. I was wrong, but there we go.

1) How is it scum-indicative that I saved myself from Maniac? It seemed very obvious to me that Maniac would target me. Since I am town, this would lead to an additional town death. Naturally I wished to prevent this. You are suggesting this is scum-indicative, which is wrong.

1) Do you think that Chaqa's colour coding was a scum slip?

2) I did not realise that the Fruit Vendor was a "protective" until well into D2. I totally missed the fact that the FV could interfere with my save. I have previously said this, and you know that because it was on page 234 in a post specifically directed at you. From a setup perspective it's actually quite strange that a Fruit Vendor is regarded as "protective" in this setup; it provides no protection since the fruit does not save anyone. I have used FV in a setup I GM-ed in the past, and it was not a protective, its only purpose was to help scum distract a tracker. Hence my D1 comments to that effect. Your analysis regarding my thoughts on the Fruit Vendor is based on entirely incorrect assumptions.

3) Well, it wasn't, so there. In retrospect, doesn't it strike you as odd that so many people were uninterested in declaring whether there had been a roleblock or not? That information would actually have helped town work out a little bit of info about the Mafia's credit position.

See? At no point have I hidden from the fact that the Ghug and Flum wagons were pushed by me. I pushed them because I thought both were scum at the time I was pushing them. I am not dodging this.

[BunnyGo]

@kgray. My most sincere apologies. I completely underestimated Jamie’s ability to misunderstand something. Thank you for making it so blatantly obvious that he can still misunderstand things.

[Jamiet99uk]

@kgray. My most sincere apologies. I completely underestimated Jamie’s ability to misunderstand something. Thank you for making it so blatantly obvious that he can still misunderstand things.

Go fuck yourself. This could be the last day in the game and you're just slandering me. If you're town, you're shit.

[Jamiet99uk]

And I should know. I suck as town. But I don't like how Bunny is just making up false narratives about me.

[damo666]

@kgray. My most sincere apologies. I completely underestimated Jamie’s ability to misunderstand something. Thank you for making it so blatantly obvious that he can still misunderstand things.

Go fuck yourself. This could be the last day in the game and you're just slandering me. If you're town, you're shit.

That's the Jamie we know and love. Locktown!

[BunnyGo]

And I should know. I suck as town. But I don't like how Bunny is just making up false narratives about me.

Read the thread. For fu**s sake. Go read all of Flum’s posts in context. Tell me which of us is making stuff up wholesale.

[BunnyGo]

@kgray. My most sincere apologies. I completely underestimated Jamie’s ability to misunderstand something. Thank you for making it so blatantly obvious that he can still misunderstand things.

Go fuck yourself. This could be the last day in the game and you're just slandering me. If you're town, you're shit.

That's the Jamie we know and love. Locktown!

You’re not helping. He was already apparently “locktown” but only 2 spots below me in your “voting preference “

[BunnyGo]

@kgray. My most sincere apologies. I completely underestimated Jamie’s ability to misunderstand something. Thank you for making it so blatantly obvious that he can still misunderstand things.

Go fuck yourself. This could be the last day in the game and you're just slandering me. If you're town, you're shit.

I’ve never pretended otherwise. Especially after last game.

[rdrivera2005]

@Kgray - By the way, do you have any question to me? I won't answer that wall of text you wrote because it's pointless. You are either scum or tunneling hard at this point and I don't see value on answering the same things I already did.

I have a question for you. What happened today that put me in the top of your scum list? Your case on me point mainly things that happened on D1 and D2 but yesterday when we were already on milo you were ready to vote Chaqa without much questioning.

[Jamiet99uk]

<snip>

There's a lot of rubbish in your emotive, sloppy iso of me, but let me pick up a few points here, in line with your own numbering:

1) You are right that I pushed Fluminator. His massclaim plan, at that time, was very bad. I figured it could be scum-motivated. You are right that I pushed Ghug. I made my reasons for doing so very clear at the time. I was wrong, but there we go.

My issue wasn't with 1 push. It was every day.

1) How is it scum-indicative that I saved myself from Maniac? It seemed very obvious to me that Maniac would target me. Since I am town, this would lead to an additional town death. Naturally I wished to prevent this. You are suggesting this is scum-indicative, which is wrong.

Then why not just save Maniac?

1) Do you think that Chaqa's colour coding was a scum slip?

If bozo had done it, or I had done it, or you had done it. Yes. With Chaqa, I don't see how careful he is as town. At the time, I also agreed with ghug that it could just as likely be a very specific town slip. Now, I think more likely scum than general error.

2) I did not realise that the Fruit Vendor was a "protective" until well into D2. I totally missed the fact that the FV could interfere with my save. I have previously said this, and you know that because it was on page 234 in a post specifically directed at you. From a setup perspective it's actually quite strange that a Fruit Vendor is regarded as "protective" in this setup; it provides no protection since the fruit does not save anyone. I have used FV in a setup I GM-ed in the past, and it was not a protective, its only purpose was to help scum distract a tracker. Hence my D1 comments to that effect. Your analysis regarding my thoughts on the Fruit Vendor is based on entirely incorrect assumptions.

And yet you also read the FV role well enough to quote it. Did you not read the end of it saying it was protective?

3) Well, it wasn't, so there. In retrospect, doesn't it strike you as odd that so many people were uninterested in declaring whether there had been a roleblock or not? That information would actually have helped town work out a little bit of info about the Mafia's credit position.

Do you think anyone roleblocked would be quiet about it?

I missed Bunny's responses to my responses to his drunk is, because the horrible colours Bunny used barely showed up on my screen. You thought fluorescent green was bad?

Ok, here goes with my responses to Bunny on these issues, in some kind of order:

1. BunnyGo: "My issue wasn't with 1 push. It was every day."

JT: As it happens, I opposed the Bo_Sox wagon on D3. Rdrivera started that one and Ghug pushed it the hardest. Yesterday I was a supporter of Vecna's no-kill plan. To say I have pushed town wagons every day is an exaggeration.

2. BunnyGo: "Then why not just save Maniac?"

JT: Because then a RB on me, or Kgray trying to save Maniac, would have resulted in two deaths.

3. BunnyGo: "And yet you also read the FV role well enough to quote it. Did you not read the end of it saying it was protective?"

JT: I've answered this already. I refer you to my previous statements. You're repeating yourself.

4. BunnyGo: "Do you think anyone roleblocked would be quiet about it?"

JT: People sometimes are. I often get shitted upon for declaring when I'm not roleblocked.

[Jamiet99uk]

And I should know. I suck as town. But I don't like how Bunny is just making up false narratives about me.

Read the thread. For fu**s sake. Go read all of Flum’s posts in context. Tell me which of us is making stuff up wholesale.

I've just said that you're making shit up about me.

[Jamiet99uk]

So after all this, it remains the case that Flum wants to kill Chaqa.

Nobody wants to kill Dargorygel.

BunnyGo is probably just wrong, angry, town with a lack of focus and a drinking problem I can totally relate to.

So it looks like I need to choose between Rdrivera, Kgray, Chaqa.

I've been reluctant to vote for Chaqa.

I'm usually wrong when it matters.

Therefore either this vote will ironically be the right one, or it will preserve the JamieTown meta that's so precious to me when I roll scum.

##VOTE CHAQA

[Jamiet99uk]

Damn that last post of mine is so scummy. Flashwagon on me, anyone? I bet Bunny will join it.

(Please don't really do that, I'm town).

[Jamiet99uk]

I'll be back before EoD.

Do what you think best.

xxXXxx

[kgray]

@Kgray - By the way, do you have any question to me? I won't answer that wall of text you wrote because it's pointless. You are either scum or tunneling hard at this point and I don't see value on answering the same things I already did.

I have a question for you. What happened today that put me in the top of your scum list? Your case on me point mainly things that happened on D1 and D2 but yesterday when we were already on milo you were ready to vote Chaqa without much questioning.

The biggest thing that happened is me doubting my Chaqa read. I believe Jamie, so the fact that scum used 2 RBs to kill Vecna makes me think they assumed they had this game on lock. Chaqa was the most likely DK. If he's scum I don't see the point in scum spending the money to kill Vecna the way they did, because with a scum!Chaqa daykill the game continues on and they'd probably want to save for future roleblocks. So although I've been focused on Chaqa all game, I'm forced to question that.

You've been my next strongest scumread after Chaqa. I just don't get town vibes from you (because until today I don't think you've been very invested and I've never gotten the impression that you're trying to solve, and a lot of your posts feel like fake outrage), I think you or Bunny was the recruit, and you're at the top of my POE.

All that said - Chaqa not being concerned that he's being set up is really making me question my theory. It's like he doesn't want to bring attention to the fact that I'm wrong.

[BunnyGo]

I'll be back before EoD.

Do what you think best.

xxXXxx

Are those the x’s from old timey poison alcohol? I can totally get behind it.

And yes. My drinking problem comes from an inability to hold it. Both literally and metaphorically.

[kgray]

2. BunnyGo: "Then why not just save Maniac?"

JT: Because then a RB on me, or Kgray trying to save Maniac, would have resulted in two deaths.

I don't understand this question or this answer. Jamie was scumreading Maniac throughout D3, why would he save him?