M1011 - Revenge of the Space Mutants - Game Thread

[BunnyGo]

I still don't understand the scumread of Neph. He barely posted D1, missed the deadline - posted little D2 and subbed out. POE makes him plausible, but I don't understand people genuinely scumreading him.

It's like the people who believe he deliberately missed the deadline haven't considered that his subbing out brings credence to the fact that he may have genuinely missed the deadline.

Or he was asked to sub out by his team so his mislynch wont ruin their perfect scumwin today...

He was inactive during the first few days in last game too but was just fine playing along at a low volume.

It’s not clear whether this is still your driving motivation on reading me or not.

[BunnyGo]

I guess its possible ive been misreading Bozo or Kgray, but it seems far more unlikely than the above being the solve

Does this mean that damo is your strongest town read?

Besides the claimed vigs? Probably yeah.

I dont really think the distinction between how much I townread Kgray/Damo and you matters, because im not going to vote for any of those regardless

Hmm.

[BunnyGo]

Im pretty sure this is a mislynch and town loses the game on the spot today, but since im a replacement and all town PR's are adamant im really not caring enough to try and go crusade mode again.

will save me the effort of catching up as well.

Congrats chaqa, your mediocre reasoning on pushes mislynches was enough

This is interesting. I need to go reread town!vecna from recent game lylo/mylo

[Jamiet99uk]

VOTE COUNT 8.0

- Nobody has voted.
- Kgray has yet to meet the posting requirement.

NOBODY is set to be lynched.

26 hours and 38 minutes are left in Day Eight.

[kgray]

Well, I guess I shouldn't be too surprised here since this was guaranteed to cause paranoia and confusion. I'm clearly being set up by one of you, and I need to figure out who.

I'm sure it will shock no one when I say that my instinct is that it's Bunny. If I had died as expected, I think there would have been a pretty good chance that Bunny was going to be lynched and he may have been counting on making the argument of "kgray's still alive but everyone thinks she's town, she must be scum" as a last resort to save himself. Vecna certainly made that plan a valid option with is "I'm lynching kgray if she survives" post.

The problem with that is that scum!Vecna could not only be counting on town!Bunny going along with that logic, but he also seems more likely to have killed Tom than Bunny would be. Tom was scumreading Vecna pretty hard and I'd been townreading Vecna for most of the game and also tunneling on Bunny. So it would make sense for Vecna to kill Tom and take away a vote for Vecna while keeping me, a likely a vote for Bunny, alive. Plus he'd get to push his "kgray is alive and therefore is scum" argument for Bunny, and scum!Vecna would just sit back and let Bunny and I duke it out.

[kgray]

Let me say the indicators that kgray is scum:

Why the long pause in her voting no lynch and then end? She was checking with GM about rules.

Why save me? And you? To set me as the counter wagon. Keeping tom would not work as we had town read each other.

I hope you considered how surprised you’d be with every kill. If vecna had died, I’d have been confused. Kgray wouldn’t have been so foolish. But if Tom died, this was obvious.

The pause was not that long but it was because I was walking my dog and was therefore on my phone and distracted. You were not around near the deadline and Jamie was, so if I were going to check with the GM about rules so that I could set you up, I would have done that earlier and avoided looking sketchy.

Saving me seems obvious in hindsight: either you're scum and you're counting on Vecna being so suspicious of me being alive that he'll go against all his prior reads and vote for me, or Vecna is scum and is counting on you and I tunneling each other to death.

[kgray]

I suppose since vecna has voted me every day (I had to go check). So scum!kgray could be setting me up.

Frame me for the hammer (with her evidence of checking the rules).


So why would scum!vecna leave me alive with kgray? We’ve been at each other. In all honesty I had decided (and I think I made a post saying this) that she was defending herself like town!kgray.

You can speculate all you want about whether or not I was checking the rules in that time (I was not) but to claim it as "evidence" is ridiculous. If you're town, please don't get stuck on this. If you're scum, you're going to have to hope Vecna thinks your theory is more likely than the obvious answer, which is that there was no NK because you weren't around to submit one.

[kgray]

seems tom actually didnt really have a strong opinion between bunny and Kgray. His latest posts even called out that he felt bunny was more questionable than gray

What? Tom had "towncleared" me. It's likely that he would have been suspicious that I'm still alive if he hadn't been the NK, but he died convinced I'm town. And I think you're overestimating Tom's townread of Bunny. He said it had nothing to do with Bunny and was based on damo voting Neph D1, and I don't see how that's enough of a factor for Tom to townread that slot. Granted, Tom's instincts turned out to be spot-on regarding damo and I also didn't understand that reason... But to say that Tom didn't have a strong opinion between Bunny and me is just inaccurate.

[kgray]

Why on earth would you not kill Kgray bunny?

I mean....

we'll totally lynch you if you survive the next nk as well Kgray

[BunnyGo]

Let me say the indicators that kgray is scum:

Why the long pause in her voting no lynch and then end? She was checking with GM about rules.

Why save me? And you? To set me as the counter wagon. Keeping tom would not work as we had town read each other.

I hope you considered how surprised you’d be with every kill. If vecna had died, I’d have been confused. Kgray wouldn’t have been so foolish. But if Tom died, this was obvious.

The pause was not that long but it was because I was walking my dog and was therefore on my phone and distracted. You were not around near the deadline and Jamie was, so if I were going to check with the GM about rules so that I could set you up, I would have done that earlier and avoided looking sketchy.

Saving me seems obvious in hindsight: either you're scum and you're counting on Vecna being so suspicious of me being alive that he'll go against all his prior reads and vote for me, or Vecna is scum and is counting on you and I tunneling each other to death.

Honestly? I'd stopped tunneling on you after a while. Most of your responses to me were "towny!kgray" who was confused why I was slamming on her. I kept it up an extra post or two, and then dropped it. I decided to sit back and watch the show.

I think the reason I've been left alive is obvious. Both of you have tunneled on me hard. You for WIFOM and Vecna seemingly for Neph not being around. It's not at all clear why he tunneled me besides that.

[kgray]

Why on earth would you not kill Kgray bunny?

Yeah, Bunny has been my most constant scumread. But Bunny has constantly been under suspicion and is the final scum in at both bozo's and food's reads. He may have been feeling desperate and needed something to shake the game up. I think he'd have a better chance at getting Vecna (or Tom, really) to cave to their paranoia that I'm still alive than to get them to actually vote for each other.

But, the fact that I'm still alive is definitely making me second-guess that. Scum!Vecna would have a much better chance at lynching Bunny by keeping me than by keeping Tom.

[BunnyGo]

Why on earth would you not kill Kgray bunny?

I mean....

we'll totally lynch you if you survive the next nk as well Kgray

Yes...the problem I'm having getting a tonal read on Vecna is that his town play the last few games has been insane.

Comparing this Vecna with the one that shot you in self defense last game is wildly different. But is that because of role madness or alignment?

I need to check how he did in the previous game too, I don't remember town!Vecna tunneling on one slot this hard.

[BunnyGo]

Why on earth would you not kill Kgray bunny?

Yeah, Bunny has been my most constant scumread. But Bunny has constantly been under suspicion and is the final scum in at both bozo's and food's reads. He may have been feeling desperate and needed something to shake the game up. I think he'd have a better chance at getting Vecna (or Tom, really) to cave to their paranoia that I'm still alive than to get them to actually vote for each other.

But, the fact that I'm still alive is definitely making me second-guess that. Scum!Vecna would have a much better chance at lynching Bunny by keeping me than by keeping Tom.

It's not clear *why* Bunny has been scumread. Was it all Neph? Was it all that Bunny has been a largely hard to pin scum the last few games? Why has nobody *actually* read Bunny and listened to what he's saying? This is a Bunny trying to get town to come together. A Bunny who played to listen because it was clear that *if* we made it to this stage he'd be there (as everyone scum read me!).

[kgray]

Now. My next question: is scum!vecna trying to sway me to defend myself and vote kgray and make sure Town!kgray and I can’t get together?

Tone and town trust matter more than mechanics here. Read for that.

Highly, highly suspicious that this is the case. Not only have we been scumreading each other, I think it has been pretty clear that we don't always communicate well, and we get under each other's skin.

[BunnyGo]

Now. My next question: is scum!vecna trying to sway me to defend myself and vote kgray and make sure Town!kgray and I can’t get together?

Tone and town trust matter more than mechanics here. Read for that.

Highly, highly suspicious that this is the case. Not only have we been scumreading each other, I think it has been pretty clear that we don't always communicate well, and we get under each other's skin.

Actually, what was the last time we were both town together?

I know I've picked fights with you as mafia because you were new and I was abusing that. I started it here because I didn't like your town when I joined, then kept it up a little longer than necessary because I started liking your response to my accusations. I wanted to be sure.

At this point, I'm willing to think hard.

[BunnyGo]

Now. My next question: is scum!vecna trying to sway me to defend myself and vote kgray and make sure Town!kgray and I can’t get together?

Tone and town trust matter more than mechanics here. Read for that.

Highly, highly suspicious that this is the case. Not only have we been scumreading each other, I think it has been pretty clear that we don't always communicate well, and we get under each other's skin.

Actually, what was the last time we were both town together?

I know I've picked fights with you as mafia because you were new and I was abusing that. I started it here because I didn't like your town when I joined, then kept it up a little longer than necessary because I started liking your response to my accusations. I wanted to be sure.

At this point, I'm willing to think hard.

*didn't like your tone

It sounded a little like you'd made a plan in daychat how to deal with damo and chaq being caught.

[kgray]

Why on earth would you not kill Kgray bunny?

Yeah, Bunny has been my most constant scumread. But Bunny has constantly been under suspicion and is the final scum in at both bozo's and food's reads. He may have been feeling desperate and needed something to shake the game up. I think he'd have a better chance at getting Vecna (or Tom, really) to cave to their paranoia that I'm still alive than to get them to actually vote for each other.

But, the fact that I'm still alive is definitely making me second-guess that. Scum!Vecna would have a much better chance at lynching Bunny by keeping me than by keeping Tom.

It's not clear *why* Bunny has been scumread. Was it all Neph? Was it all that Bunny has been a largely hard to pin scum the last few games? Why has nobody *actually* read Bunny and listened to what he's saying? This is a Bunny trying to get town to come together. A Bunny who played to listen because it was clear that *if* we made it to this stage he'd be there (as everyone scum read me!).

Honestly Bunny, it was partly because you entered the game and immediately called me scum. I know that that's omgus, but none of your arguments made any sense to me (and Bozo and Tom both also questioned you on it, so I don't think it was just me being indignant). It really seemed to me like you felt you could get me worked up and were trying to do that intentionally. I know that happens naturally between us anyway, but for example: You said I was too upset about being accused, when I hadn't really been accused of anything. When bozo asked you to explain what I was accused of, you said that you were accusing me, but you did that in the same post that you claimed I was upset at being accused... That really just made me suspect you were trying to get me to overreact, and definitely did not make me think you were trying to get town to come together.

And then the D3 lynch ending the way it did with Chaqa's last minute switch just makes so much sense if you're scum. Chaqa's vote not only saved damo and created a tie, but he moved so late that no one else was likely to move either, so you weren't in danger of being the lynch.

[kgray]

Now. My next question: is scum!vecna trying to sway me to defend myself and vote kgray and make sure Town!kgray and I can’t get together?

Tone and town trust matter more than mechanics here. Read for that.

Highly, highly suspicious that this is the case. Not only have we been scumreading each other, I think it has been pretty clear that we don't always communicate well, and we get under each other's skin.

Actually, what was the last time we were both town together?

I know I've picked fights with you as mafia because you were new and I was abusing that. I started it here because I didn't like your town when I joined, then kept it up a little longer than necessary because I started liking your response to my accusations. I wanted to be sure.

At this point, I'm willing to think hard.

The last mini game, when we were both town PRs and I led the charge on your lynch D1 because I thought you were doing the same thing you intentionally did as scum by twisting my words...

[BunnyGo]

Highly, highly suspicious that this is the case. Not only have we been scumreading each other, I think it has been pretty clear that we don't always communicate well, and we get under each other's skin.

Actually, what was the last time we were both town together?

I know I've picked fights with you as mafia because you were new and I was abusing that. I started it here because I didn't like your town when I joined, then kept it up a little longer than necessary because I started liking your response to my accusations. I wanted to be sure.

At this point, I'm willing to think hard.

The last mini game, when we were both town PRs and I led the charge on your lynch D1 because I thought you were doing the same thing you intentionally did as scum by twisting my words...

Ah yeah...and then I wasn't even around to defend myself. I actually tried really hard that game to make a point of listening and not focusing on mechanics.

[Vecna]

Interesting developments.

You do know I was just taunting you right bunny? With my comments about your nightkill selection and them other throwaway comments?

Because it sure felt like it made you think you had to switch from trying to convince me to trying to convince Kgray.

Do let me know what you find out though about whether I tunnel people as town.