M55: The Last Party - Game Thread

[xorxes]

Hm, well, I'm not the only person to find Vecna more shitposty than usual at this point, no?

if you ever felt the need to trust my reads before, because I sometimes have good reads, dont you think the time when im putting humiliation by chipotle on the line is a good time to have some faith in me?

Since you said the bet was void is one of you was scum, that means you're not really risking anything if you're scum.

I find your theory that brain and RHK were teammates so implausible that it's very hard to believe you believe it. Brain is most likely town, there's a chance he could be 3P, but getting into a double Doctor claim with RHK on D3 makes so little sense. It's not like brain gains eternal towncred for that, so what would be the point? If the idea was to sacrifice brain so that RHK gained towncred, why would RHK react to brain's claim the way he did?

It makes no sense no matter how you look at it. And the crumbs of Interceptor from brain you supposedly saw were not convincing at all.

[xorxes]

Really? Isn't day chat when it would say "you can talk anytime you want here", and if it's a role keeping it open it would say that you need the role.

Do you still not understand the Secretary role?

It doesn't allow daychat for their team. The role allows the Secretary to post in the Mafia QT during the day - only the Secretary, not the other Mafia team members.

this depends on the variation. pretty sure in M42 it was just a regular encryptor

I think the more relevant game is when worcej was GM. I was Secretary that game, and only I could post to the QT during the day.

[xorxes]

So why would scum need a jailor and a doc

They need Jailor as roleblocker.

Protection they needed to protect from JOAT, Vecna if he is not mafia, and any other killing roles we may still not know about.

[xorxes]

Is the 3P hunting scum at night? There's been 2 kills in one night, but it seems the flavor text chalked that up to Kgray visiting Vecna? But that's not confirmed.

If there's an SK it would have to be me (jailed N2), or they targeted kgray or TheMarche N2. I don't know if they had targeted me whether I would have been told or not. I was only told that I was jailed.

I would say odds are there is not an SK, but maybe tonight's results will say something different.

[xorxes]

Bungo in response to your questions, no, no, we won't know until tomorrow since it's possible RHK saved a teammate from 3P kill, but flavour is pretty clear and as close as we can get to confirmation

Ah yes, that's another possibility. RHK claimed he protected Chaqa though, I don't remember if his claim came before or after you revealed your tracker target. Do you know?

[xorxes]

https://youtu.be/AnnoXzBVi-s

I felt uncomfortable after the guy sneezes at the beginning and then goes around touching everything in the store. Probably this connotation was not intended when this was filmed...

[xorxes]

I dont have a clue what you even think my role is. if you really think my dreaming god stuff was an actual roleclaim, dreaming has never existed on webdip and id be really shocked if worcej even knows what it is

He thinks your're Interceptor or something like that. I don't get it either.

[Temasek22]

I've just reread Sarah's game so far via peterbot, and I can say with confidence that if the GM didn't send me a role PM I'd be expecting to be in the scumteam. Her gameplay so far is... questionable at best, which really hits deep inside as I'm not exactly the best player either.

No strong scum reads so far, still trying to play catch up. I'm inclined to believe Donny Dude was town and summit is solidtown (though perhaps the latter sentiment is shared by many)

[xorxes]

That's why I was thinking he could be 3P, but the Flavor shows it was Kgray that visited him and I don't think it exists a 3P that just sit still and wait for people to visit him. And even if this is the case he will never claim this role. So either town or scum, and the way he told people to stay away from him looks town to me.

It's hard to tell people effectively to stay away from you, because many people will take that as more of a reason to investigate you.

I don't now remember how or when Vecna did that. Was it N1 or N2? I think he did say that Jailor should not jail him or emc at one point. Can you point me to where he made a general statement that nobody should approach him?

"he will never claim this role" is hard to sell. Lying about their role is something that scum will try to avoid at all costs, because lies will come to bite them in the long run. They of course need to lie about their alignment, but they will be as truthful as they can about their role.

[e.m.c^42]

Bungo in response to your questions, no, no, we won't know until tomorrow since it's possible RHK saved a teammate from 3P kill, but flavour is pretty clear and as close as we can get to confirmation

Ah yes, that's another possibility. RHK claimed he protected Chaqa though, I don't remember if his claim came before or after you revealed your tracker target. Do you know?

After my claim that I tracked flash and flash claiming he tried to visit you, but before flash hardclaimed watcher. So I certainly do have my doubts.

[xorxes]

Also, once again, a doctor would not protect from the ability the way my role pm is worden.

My ability fires first, and kills anyone before they can do their visit, so it should have killed whoever visits me before the doc can even protect them

RHK's role says: "During the night, you may ##save a player. If you do, your target is immune to killing actions."

It doesn't have any caveats that I can find. So if your role says that kgray would have died even if RHK had attempted to save her, there seems to be a contradiction somewhere.

There's this:

Kills can be roleblocked, unless an ability prevents it

which suggests that you may be immune to roleblocks, but I can't find anywhere that says that saves can be prevented (other than by roleblocking the protective of course).

If your interpretation of your role is correct, I would say there's an inconsistency.

[xorxes]

chaqa is very flip floppy this game. He seems to play reactively to the flavor of the moment and acts like an authority at times. Whats weird is none of the people affiliated to chaq ever seem to question his authority

I suppose it's possible that Chaqa could be a scum Neighbourizer. I did find Chaqa scummy before I was added to the 'hood, and Chaqa's idea about not killing RHK was really pretty bananas, given we had no solid leads and no town consensus about anything other than "lynch RHK or brainbomb" and we had a cop scan saying RHK was guilty.

What do you think of Chaqa's play so far brainbomb?

Why did it took you so long to vote for RHK if Chaqa's idea about not killing RHK was really pretty bananas?

[e.m.c^42]

Hey all. 275+ pages to read through for me so I'll try my best to keep up. But could anyone give me a quick TL;DR?

Check the catchups written for Bungo when he subbed in, I believe you can find it if you ISO Chaqa on D3 in the bot.

[xorxes]

Night Ability adjudication is the following:
1. RB-type abilities
2. Protective-type abilities
3. Investigative-type abilities
4. Killing abilities

You see Vecna if you read this literally, Doctors are completely useless in this setup. If you read Worcej's Order of Operations in the most pedantic way possible, the doctor shows up first, finds the patient in good health, and goes away, then later the Mafia arrive and kill the formerly healthy person.

I don't think it's useful to assume that's how Doctors work, and in the same way, I don't think your assumption that your ability over-rides a Doctor save is necessarily correct either.

Yeah, I had not read this whaen I replied.

[Jamiet99uk]

Night Ability adjudication is the following:
1. RB-type abilities
2. Protective-type abilities
3. Investigative-type abilities
4. Killing abilities

You see Vecna if you read this literally, Doctors are completely useless in this setup. If you read Worcej's Order of Operations in the most pedantic way possible, the doctor shows up first, finds the patient in good health, and goes away, then later the Mafia arrive and kill the formerly healthy person.

I don't think it's useful to assume that's how Doctors work, and in the same way, I don't think your assumption that your ability over-rides a Doctor save is necessarily correct either.

Yeah, I had not read this whaen I replied.

You agree with my remarks to Vecna about this issue?

[xorxes]

brain talked about "patching up" on D1, which is the same word used in RHK's role PM. I think that's a pretty solid indicator that brain is indeed a Doctor. He may be a 3P Doctor, and I would not be surprized if there is one in case the 3P faction has more than one member, given that mafia had one as well, but I think we can be pretty sure that brain is not mafia.

[xorxes]

You see Vecna if you read this literally, Doctors are completely useless in this setup. If you read Worcej's Order of Operations in the most pedantic way possible, the doctor shows up first, finds the patient in good health, and goes away, then later the Mafia arrive and kill the formerly healthy person.

I don't think it's useful to assume that's how Doctors work, and in the same way, I don't think your assumption that your ability over-rides a Doctor save is necessarily correct either.

Yeah, I had not read this whaen I replied.

You agree with my remarks to Vecna about this issue?

Yes, I believe a Doctor could protect from Vecna's kill even if his kill may be immune to roleblocking.

[Jamiet99uk]

Yeah, I had not read this whaen I replied.

You agree with my remarks to Vecna about this issue?

Yes, I believe a Doctor could protect from Vecna's kill even if his kill may be immune to roleblocking.

Yeah.

I mean if it is un-preventable, like a Strongman kill, I would expect that to be explicitly clear from the Role PM, not just something inferred from the order of night actions.

[xorxes]

You agree with my remarks to Vecna about this issue?

Yes, I believe a Doctor could protect from Vecna's kill even if his kill may be immune to roleblocking.

Yeah.

I mean if it is un-preventable, like a Strongman kill, I would expect that to be explicitly clear from the Role PM, not just something inferred from the order of night actions.

I think even the existence of a Strongman is unlikely because there are no caveats anywhere to account for that. At one point I thought point 7 indicated a possible Strongman, but it obviously doesn't, because it seems much more coherent that it indicates a roleblock immune killer as in Vecna's claim.

[Chaqa]

Morning peoples.

I think we lynch Neph, Damo, or Bozo tomorrow.

Ideally I'd like summit to scan one of Squigs, Bunny, and foodcoats. Or one of the three above.