M54: Not a Carrot Conspiracy

[BunnyGo]

It would be nice to firmly decide if we were no lynching or lynching before we get the major wagons of the day going.

Agreed.

It would also be nice if the voters put in half as much effort communicating as they do snap voting...

[BunnyGo]

I think 90% of impressive newcomers end up being scum in my experience, so I don't think I'll ever be able to townread kgray, no matter how good and townie she is lol.

This is a weird first post to mention her name in...

[xorxes]

I kind of feel like I'm in a movie, where I'm a sherrif and there's 4 guys yelling at me to kill xorx. I arrest them and execute them, and then I turn around and notice xorx with an evil glint in his eye and I'm like "uhhhh, xorx? I didn't make a terrible mistake, did I?"
and he just shrugs as he inches closer.

You're pushing this narrative that you are leading the lynches and I'm following you, but my impression is that you have been following me, not the other way around. I'm pretty sure I started suspecting rivera way before you did, and I was never too sure about Fox but when I started suspecting him it was because of his sudden change in reads of me, not because of anything you said. In fact I don't have the impression you have been doing any leading. So why are you painting yourself as the executioner? If anyone led the rivera lynch, it was me, and if anyone led the Fox wagon it was Balki. I don't think you have been sticking your neck very much at all.

[BunnyGo]

Probably will be at a phone meeting over EON

Like I've complained multiple times, the final scum who doesn't know the partners is hard to read, and I don't know who that one would be. I'm hunting for the scum who know who the other scum are and hoping we catch the other one on the way. Every townread has an * because of this >_>

Balki Bartokomous - Town, he hasn't really done anything wrong yet, and he's continued doing pro-town things like voting scum at an important time yesterday. I’m not super familiar with his scum play, but some players hype it up to be absolutely identical. My mantra is usually “if scum want to bus, let them finish doing it before lynching them.”

bozotheclown - Null, I have no idea, I never do with him because I still think he's a robot irl. Probably town by poe, and his switch off EMC to Bob and staying on it is good town points. Doesn't seem like bussing.

BunnyGo - I already explained I think he's a pretty likely town at this point.

Chaqa - Too scummy to be scum is never a thing.

damo666 - He was a strong town read awhile ago, but he's kind of been coasting on that not towning it up since then for me. He's probably demoted to null, although he goes back to a town if I'm somehow wrong on Chaqa.

e.m.c^42 - Town, his catchup was good, and I don't see it being scum vs. scum at the end. He's had a few posts where I don't see him being scum either.

Foxcastle - Null-Scum, suspect eod behavior, but it's not impossible it was confused town.

Jamiet99uk - Similar to damo, in that he hasn't done a lot town indicative since first town reading him. EOD wasn't the best. I don't think he's a good candidate tomorrow for lynch.

kgray - I hope she's not scum, I feel like we've been in agreement and on the same page a lot which makes me think she has a town mind. She’s definitely not afraid to post. I haven’t seen any good case to lynch her yet, so I’m comfortable saying she’s town.

rdrivera2005 - He's been the one of the main people I haven't really got town vibes from throughout the game, his eod behavior also doesn't help. Slight scum

worcej - The flavius catchups sometimes seem a little forced, but I think he's still above the null line in townie.

xorxes - Like Balki, he hasn't really done anything wrong yet, and I don't see much room for him on a scum team. Kickstarting the Bob wagon is good town points. I recognize the room for bussing, but not there yet.

Town: Bunny, Xorx, Balki, kdray, worjce, EMC
Townish: Jamiet, Damo, Bozo
Scummy: Rdrivera, Fox, and Chaqa

This is Flum's 6th post where kgray is mentioned (most are nothing). And yet he's completely flipped. He's also mentioned "being on the same page a lot" despite not addressing her at all prior to this. Have they been on the same page in scum chat?

[BunnyGo]

I remembered to search for Flum saying kdray too...still working, back later.

[xorxes]

It would be nice to firmly decide if we were no lynching or lynching before we get the major wagons of the day going.

What would be the point of having wagons today if we decide no-lynch?

[xorxes]

##VOTE Flum for now (but we probably should no-lynch)

[Fluminator]

I think 90% of impressive newcomers end up being scum in my experience, so I don't think I'll ever be able to townread kgray, no matter how good and townie she is lol.

This is a weird first post to mention her name in...

Do you know why this is true?

Everyone in mafia is clueless. No one knows who scum is and it's flailing around.
So when a newcomer comes in that seems really competent, it's probably because they aren't clueless and know more than the average player.

I kind of feel like I'm in a movie, where I'm a sherrif and there's 4 guys yelling at me to kill xorx. I arrest them and execute them, and then I turn around and notice xorx with an evil glint in his eye and I'm like "uhhhh, xorx? I didn't make a terrible mistake, did I?"
and he just shrugs as he inches closer.

You're pushing this narrative that you are leading the lynches and I'm following you, but my impression is that you have been following me, not the other way around. I'm pretty sure I started suspecting rivera way before you did, and I was never too sure about Fox but when I started suspecting him it was because of his sudden change in reads of me, not because of anything you said. In fact I don't have the impression you have been doing any leading. So why are you painting yourself as the executioner? If anyone led the rivera lynch, it was me, and if anyone led the Fox wagon it was Balki. I don't think you have been sticking your neck very much at all.

Ehh, I felt like I did all the heavy lifting with Rdrivera. I definitely caused the EMC lynch rip. (I also led the hammer vote on Vecna)
I at least felt largely responsible because Rdrivera and Fox appealed to me multiple times, and I had the power to save Rdr.

Probably will be at a phone meeting over EON

Like I've complained multiple times, the final scum who doesn't know the partners is hard to read, and I don't know who that one would be. I'm hunting for the scum who know who the other scum are and hoping we catch the other one on the way. Every townread has an * because of this >_>

Balki Bartokomous - Town, he hasn't really done anything wrong yet, and he's continued doing pro-town things like voting scum at an important time yesterday. I’m not super familiar with his scum play, but some players hype it up to be absolutely identical. My mantra is usually “if scum want to bus, let them finish doing it before lynching them.”

bozotheclown - Null, I have no idea, I never do with him because I still think he's a robot irl. Probably town by poe, and his switch off EMC to Bob and staying on it is good town points. Doesn't seem like bussing.

BunnyGo - I already explained I think he's a pretty likely town at this point.

Chaqa - Too scummy to be scum is never a thing.

damo666 - He was a strong town read awhile ago, but he's kind of been coasting on that not towning it up since then for me. He's probably demoted to null, although he goes back to a town if I'm somehow wrong on Chaqa.

e.m.c^42 - Town, his catchup was good, and I don't see it being scum vs. scum at the end. He's had a few posts where I don't see him being scum either.

Foxcastle - Null-Scum, suspect eod behavior, but it's not impossible it was confused town.

Jamiet99uk - Similar to damo, in that he hasn't done a lot town indicative since first town reading him. EOD wasn't the best. I don't think he's a good candidate tomorrow for lynch.

kgray - I hope she's not scum, I feel like we've been in agreement and on the same page a lot which makes me think she has a town mind. She’s definitely not afraid to post. I haven’t seen any good case to lynch her yet, so I’m comfortable saying she’s town.

rdrivera2005 - He's been the one of the main people I haven't really got town vibes from throughout the game, his eod behavior also doesn't help. Slight scum

worcej - The flavius catchups sometimes seem a little forced, but I think he's still above the null line in townie.

xorxes - Like Balki, he hasn't really done anything wrong yet, and I don't see much room for him on a scum team. Kickstarting the Bob wagon is good town points. I recognize the room for bussing, but not there yet.

Town: Bunny, Xorx, Balki, kdray, worjce, EMC
Townish: Jamiet, Damo, Bozo
Scummy: Rdrivera, Fox, and Chaqa

This is Flum's 6th post where kgray is mentioned (most are nothing). And yet he's completely flipped. He's also mentioned "being on the same page a lot" despite not addressing her at all prior to this. Have they been on the same page in scum chat?

I was assuming Balki/Xorx/Kgray were town because they were always wanting the same things as me. That was probably a mistake.

It would be nice to firmly decide if we were no lynching or lynching before we get the major wagons of the day going.

What would be the point of having wagons today if we decide no-lynch?

Bunny already explained why. Scum will probably push no lynch if it looks like scum are getting lynched. If it's townie, they'll hop on board.
Come on now Xorx

[Fluminator]

Xorx, how are you justifying in your head that literally no scum hopped onto your wagon day 4.
How does that affect your reads?

[xorxes]

What would be the point of having wagons today if we decide no-lynch?

Bunny already explained why. Scum will probably push no lynch if it looks like scum are getting lynched. If it's townie, they'll hop on board.
Come on now Xorx

That does not explain why you want to have wagons today.

[xorxes]

Xorx, how are you justifying in your head that literally no scum hopped onto your wagon day 4.
How does that affect your reads?

I don't think you could justify hopping onto my wagon at that point, so if you're scum that's why you didn't. In fact, most everyone else was townreading or townleaning me, so it would have been hard to justify. Why would they risk it, if it was TvT? The reason I started scumreading Fox was that his hopping on was so unexpected to me.

[Fluminator]

So you're not the slightest bit paranoid you were being buddied?

[xorxes]

So you're not the slightest bit paranoid you were being buddied?

I was definitely being buddied, that's very clear. The question is by who and were they scum? You and Balki were definitely overfriendly at times. Possibly damo as well. I don't think I noticed anything over the top from Jamie or Bunny. Bozo and kgray were just being sensible most of the time.

[xorxes]

I didn't bring it up originally because it's getting too speculative, but I do suspect that if Xorx and kgray are scumbuddies, xorx coached kgray to have more gutreads, since she didn't start talking about them until night 3 I think.

When did you notice this change in kgray? Can you give an example?

[Fluminator]

If it's very clear to you that you were being buddied, why did you say the reason no scum jumped on your wagon was because it would simply be bad optics for them?

[Fluminator]

Kgray played a very logical game where everything she said was backed by reasons and everything she ever did had a well documented history behind why she did it.

That's not abnormal for a scum to play this way. I was curious if she ever once used her gut to drive things besides logic and in her iso she didn't mention any gut-reads until around Night 3.
It's not unreasonable to me that Balki or you told her this in scumchat.

[xorxes]

If it's very clear to you that you were being buddied, why did you say the reason no scum jumped on your wagon was because it would simply be bad optics for them?

Not sure what your point is. If they were townreading me, they could not vote for me without looking bad.

[Fluminator]

Have you finished your reread yet?

[xorxes]

Kgray played a very logical game where everything she said was backed by reasons and everything she ever did had a well documented history behind why she did it.

That's not abnormal for a scum to play this way. I was curious if she ever once used her gut to drive things besides logic and in her iso she didn't mention any gut-reads until around Night 3.
It's not unreasonable to me that Balki or you told her this in scumchat.

I see. She didn't use the word "gut" until N3, and after that she did use it a few times. Definitely not something I would have told her to do if I was scum with her.

[Fluminator]

Are you bored?