M1009 [HIDDEN]

[bozotheclown]

Alright, I'm back in town, time to catch up, the whole weekend is here, time to start digging. Well first of all, well done damo, you died a hero, too bad our doc wasn't able to heal you. I would've loved if you had posted more, but nicely done.

Also these things here:

I just don't want to make a huge quote post but Flav here wants links

So basically Nepghtys wagon was started on nothing, and people piled on for nothing, this is why I told you NOT to vote for lurkers but no you decided that would be the best use of your vote
Nepthys barely talked, no one was defending him, this was the easiest wagon for people to fall into, and also the absolute and utter silliest

we got information from Nephthys, which we wouldn't had gotten if we didn't vote that way, voting on lurkers is fine. The mistake I made was not being back in time to respond to new information, shouldn't have trusted availability without checking it prior, maybe I should buy myself one of these smart phones after all.

Anyway, for now, lets just accept it happened and take that information we got. "It was started on nothing" and "people piled on for nothing", have you done any further research on that or do you just want to emphasise you point?

[...]
There is one burning question there I want to get the answer to: bozo, how do you feel that Chaqa followed you voting on Nephthys? You were the one leading the Chaqa wagon (tied with Nephthys 3-3 for first place) and (given Nephthys changed the vote first away from Chaqa) changed to Nephthys, what are your thoughts on the matter?
[...]

@bozo I still want your answer

look it up in the post #600 page 30

so basically you know nothing so you'll commit to nothing, cmon dude take a stand

right back at you

Gee, what a warm welcome to step into a game. Thank you everyone.

I've only skimmed EOD and the first ten pages, so I have a little bit of homework to do. On first read xorxes looks a bit off, but I really need to get a better sense of things before I commit to a vote. Unfortunately the re-read won't happen until after work, so unless someone gives me a SparkNotes version, I'll be a little OOTL for 8-12 hours.

welcome goldfinger, get well soon Chaqa. If you come around, please explain the vote on Nephthys on the first day, if you'd be so kind. (also congrats on post 666)

look at post 667 page 34

I'm town...

xorxes looks a bit off

My research also shows that Chaqa and Kakarroto drive the same kind of car, both watch "Tho Office", and were roommates in college.

actually, we were twins got seperated at birth, though I was sent over the ocean he grew up in the US of A. I have no car (public transport rules), never watched the office (everyone tells me I finally should get to it) and it all started ON THE SAME PAGE with the flavour from e.m.c^42

... now, can you please answer my question?



So, I read up, though it was much and I think I need to go over it once or twice again, I feel like I missed something. Anyway, I see you've left me a treat, goldfinger (former Chaqa) 2 votes, bozo 2 votes, xorxes 1 vote ... how can I resist, this will give us much data: ##VOTE xorxes

I missed EOD, and I was not online after my last post, 25 minutes before EOD. Chaqa voted for Nephthys 8 minutes before EOD, so I never had the opportunity to consider his vote for Nephthys while not knowing Nephthys was town. Now that I know Nephthys was town, I do not think Chaqa's vote indicates much. I could see him making the vote as town if he agreed Nephthys was suspicious. However, I could also see him making the vote as scum, since he indicated he was town reading me and xorxes and we were voting for Nephthys, so it could be a continuation of an attempt to pocket us.

[bozotheclown]

I don't know, I fail to see a motivation to do that as either town or scum, it's NAI. I find more likely town Woecej tried to do some kind of reaction test that didn't work that scum Worcej decide to get some heat doing this

It sounds like you just don't want to think about it.

scum!worcej obviously did not decide to get heat doing this. He made a mistake (acting as if he did not know that Jamie had voted for damo) because it was a way of writing some filler, then without realizing that it was incompatible with that he slipped that he had in fact looked at the bot before posting, then he got caught in the contradiction, and then he came up with the reaction test sstory. That's the scum!worcej version

The town!worcej version is that he came up with a very elaborate reaction test that required him to make two posts with some other filer posts in the midddle, and in which he somehow had to predict, when writing the first post, the type of thing he would need to respond to with the second post.

Which version sounds more likely?

If you don't want to bother analysing what happened, say so, but don't dismiss it when you don't even seem to be aware what the argument is all about.

You are right I wasn't carefully following this at the time. I still don't see why him not seeing Jamiet voted Damo is scum indicative or why he would make all this instead of just saying "ops, my bad, didn't see the vote"?

What am I missing, as I really fail to see why this is so scum indicative?

That would be the town reaction to say he did not set he vote, what worcej did instead was acknowledge it was a slip but claim it was intentional as a reaction test.

[Kakarroto]

hmm (it's a little late after a long day work, had to read it multiple times) ... the first thing that came to mind was 'the posts were made in steps, maybe he overlooked jaimies vote when he checked' , but that can't be it, only in case he wants to taunt/poke you and made that decision in the 'nugget' post (which, personally, in context of people, leaving 'nugget' makes me think formerly eaten stuff, which might refer to his sh**posting but then again, I think for you it might be more like goldnuggets, treasures?)

got a bit off the question here, but it depends what exactly he meant (with words and intent). Maybe he was just going to **** with you with that following post 'wolf and sheep', it's also possible he wanted jaimie to answer that question - ok that last one I just noticed can't be it, with his 'too late xorxes already fell into it' post

hmmm. this are times when I wish I studied psychology. Yes, it's odd, it would fit together if he's scum trying to aggrevate someone on a townie and make something up after being called out. I was about to say (since it is page 6 and 7) that it's in the joke phase and you can expect some foolery/joking, but no, it's 20 hours in, that shouldn't be a joke phase. In fact it isn't.

so deducting he didn't know (he said so himself he did), reaction test (declared it void right after), joke (phase over), that leaves only the possibility wanting to fool you (or all). If I don't overlook something. Now he wanting to fool you, xorx, isn't bad if he thinks you are scum or at least null. I can't read minds, so sorry there.

Luckily, he posted his reads right when you posted, more fresh isn't possible, and he stated to see you as second highest tier townish (highest only himself), so why is he trying to fool someone who is a 'fellow' town?

I mean, is there something I'm missing? Misunderstanding? It's around half past 4 a.m. here, so it might well be, and I'm hyped that xorx might've found scum, so can someone else check this please?

Also, right before I went on look at xorxes post, I started to rereading about the same part of the game, found

That Jamie/EMC thing is weird.

But this Bozo voting for me for not remembering someone I’ve had no interaction with in 3 years is even stranger. I don’t see why I would do that as scum, but it seems pretty normal for town!Bozo. Whatev.

Where’s Flavius?

Flavius is probably waiting for there to be enough pages so he can do his meta thing where he responds to stuff that has already been dealt with and sorted out.

Do you think enough time has passed and stuff has happened for him to respond, xorxes?

and (to all)

Where's Flavius?

[Kakarroto]

did I really use one and a half hour to read, double and triplecheck that? off, I'm slow. Guess I really should sleep before I go on. well please check my post, see if I missed something.

[xorxes]

You are right I wasn't carefully following this at the time. I still don't see why him not seeing Jamiet voted Damo is scum indicative or why he would make all this instead of just saying "ops, my bad, didn't see the vote"?

What am I missing, as I really fail to see why this is so scum indicative?

If he had said something like that, that he saw the two votes on Jamie but missed Jamie's vote on damo, that would be a reasonable explanation. But he disn't say that, instead he claimed it was a reaction test. I don't know why he did that, maybe he thought it would be more believable. I thought it was weird at the time, but I didn't realize how much weird it was until I went back and reread it.

For it to really have been a reaction test, it had to be a very elabotate one, and why go to so much trouble when the result is going to be NAI.

And what do you make of this post now that you know it either came from scum or that it was part of a reaction test:

Both Tom and Xorxes voting Jamiet and Food watching him. Interesting.

I thought that the mass claim was a joke but the emc question is useless unless Jamiet is questioning if emc should be posting flavor. Will wait for his answers.

I had the same thought when I quickly checked the bot for votes.

Tom seems to be in typical form, xorxes is a little more laid back. NAI but at least observations.

Worcej still hasn't clarified whether "I had the same thought" was real or just something he made up in order to complete his test.

If it was made up, it looks like something someone might say for buddying purposes. If it was real, then he was very lucky that a post came up in his catching up that would allow him to insert what he needed to complete his test so seamlessly.

[xorxes]

That Jamie/EMC thing is weird.

But this Bozo voting for me for not remembering someone I’ve had no interaction with in 3 years is even stranger. I don’t see why I would do that as scum, but it seems pretty normal for town!Bozo. Whatev.

Where’s Flavius?

Flavius is probably waiting for there to be enough pages so he can do his meta thing where he responds to stuff that has already been dealt with and sorted out.

Do you think enough time has passed and stuff has happened for him to respond, xorxes?

He did respond to that and did his catch-up as predicted. That's when he told us about the clan raiding.

and (to all)

Where's Flavius?

Raiding clans, presumably.

[xorxes]

So here's where we are:

bozotheclown: I think/hope he is town. Solid arguments and not just because he agrees with me on worcej. I thought his case on Chaqa was a bit on the tunnelly-obsessive side, but who knows.
goldfinger0303: Chaqa's vote for Neph asking for someone to direct him instead of deciding by himself was the only really scummy thing I remember, but his being ill seemed like a reasonable explanation. I wasn't happy with the "a bit off" comment, especially since he has refused to give an opinion on anyone or anything else until having read everything. It seems a bit inconsistent.
e.m.c^42: I liked how he pushed Tom EOD1. I don't like that he has done nothing today, but still townleaning.
FlaviusAetius: Another MIA. It's becoming a pattern with him. A good candidate for the third slot.
foodcoats: I disagree with his vote for bozo, but at least he is taking a stance. It wouldn't be a bad thing if he participated more.
Jamiet99uk: I'm being lenient with him, hopefully I'm not wrong. Vote for is Tom good.
Kakarroto: Hopefully he will reconsider his vote. Probably town.
rdrivera2005: I probably would be scumreading him if it wasn't for the townslip, but he is most likely town. Hopefully he reconsiders his vote.
Tom Bombadil: Caught scum. Probably why he disappeared.
worcej: Caught scum. Probably why he disappeared.

[xorxes]

goldfinger0303 (2) bozotheclown Tom Bombadil
xorxes (2) rdrivera2005 Kakarroto
bozotheclown (2) foodcoats worcej
worcej (1) xorxes
Tom Bombadil (1) Jamiet99uk

It's annoying that I'm the leading wagon if we were only to count the town votes.

Third scum is most likely here:

Non-votes
goldfinger0303
e.m.c^42
FlaviusAetius

[foodcoats]

There are two players I haven't thought much about, emc and rdr, so let's take a look.

In D1 emc's iso has a lot of emc-isms that I would consider NAI, but I actually really like emc's counter to Tom. I've only played a half-dozen times here, but I think this is the most explanation I've seen emc put into a vote rationale on D1.

I’m not sure what you mean about “meta and more obscure things”

Will regret starting answer to this as do not think it will be finished in time before EOD to have any impact lol

But here goes, will just stop and post at 15 minutes before regardless.

First of all, with all personal bias in mind what was noticed first was 1)Your misspoken Jamie comment (already mentioned, so no more elaborations), and 2)You missing and scumreading me for a strange? reason, and 3) the read on xorx based on disagreement over Jamie's meta. Idk, it is as if you've forgotten parts of us.

As in, typically I recall you as basing reads more off of activity/content type rather than stylistics/content, and this game so far has been mostly latter and not former.

The over-affability of mine you mentioned... isn’t anything new? As in, it is quite understandable had you been referring to someone else who typically does not do so (worce, perhaps, or like damo or chaq), but me? It's a staple of this personality, lol. And it is not as if you are unfamiliar with any of us.

Also, on xorx, out of all things why focus on that for a read? Like, it's not even just this, but there were other points where I'd have expected you to poke at or mention (due to your analysis style) that did not happen, such as Karrot. He is playing affable just the same as I.....and just ran out of time so posting at this point :v

Actually, now considering how different this is from baseline-emc, maybe this is a scumtell: scum!emc feels the need to be extra-reasonable. Especially given that emc has a reputation of not voting in a timely manner and being frivolous on D1, which often puts emc under scrutiny... I don't recall emc ever digging so deep to explain a vote like this so early. The other explanation would be emc having a very strong scumread on Tom, but I don't think that's the case... it's more... a lot of words and work to explain a middling read (which admittedly all reads are on D1). It's fundamentally a town behaviour, but I just don't know that it's a town!emc behaviour.

Regarding N1, this catches my eye:

With all the full deductive reasonings that two hours of sleep gives a guy, gut feeling say xorx carrot tom seem scummy, which means they're prolly town PR, and towny seems jamie carrot rivera so they prolly scum.

Is this PR fishing? Shouldn't emc know better? It's nicely couched, "I think they're scum therefore they are probably PR l-o-l," now-wait-and-see-what-others-think. Good reaction test for scum to throw to get POE for their NK.

[xorxes]

@food, what do you think of worcej's reaction test? Real, or something he came up with in a hurry to cover for a mistake?

[foodcoats]

Regarding rdr,

I really have trouble reading rdr. Something about rdr's posts is both opaque and transparent and I never know what to make of it.

However, I like this:

I think we need an interesting EOD. And I am liking Neph more then Tom.

##vote Tom

I will point this out in contrast to how I am scumreading bozo. rdr chose a wagon to even the race, and force an interesting EOD that would provide information. By contrast, bozo, who was super confident on Chaqa all D1, left that confident position and created a leader - meaning someone else (like rdr) would have to fight to even out the wagons, or let Neph run away with it. I think the rdr line here is very townie: embrace your own lack of knowledge and push a situation that will give you more.

The only other thing to say is, after reading both emc and rdr, I should probably also read Tom and compare. emc and rdr seem to be aligned in their "Tom-bad!" evaluation, and there is probably something to be figured out in all that.

[xorxes]

Regarding N1, this catches my eye:

With all the full deductive reasonings that two hours of sleep gives a guy, gut feeling say xorx carrot tom seem scummy, which means they're prolly town PR, and towny seems jamie carrot rivera so they prolly scum.

Is this PR fishing? Shouldn't emc know better? It's nicely couched, "I think they're scum therefore they are probably PR l-o-l," now-wait-and-see-what-others-think. Good reaction test for scum to throw to get POE for their NK.

Well, I doubt scum!emc would spend any time baiting PRs like that. He would probably leave the PR hunting to his teammates while he flamed the flames of arguments while trying to look good to everyone. That was my experience of scum!emc anyway.

[foodcoats]

@food, what do you think of worcej's reaction test? Real, or something he came up with in a hurry to cover for a mistake?

I am probably missing an important detail; I'm scanning your iso and flicking through the thread to try to understand.

Did worcej claim somewhere that they (1) deliberately implied they did not know the vote count (i.e. by asking if Jamie had voted for damo) and then (2) deliberately showed they did know the vote count (referring to checking the bot in the same timeframe), therefore (3) showing himself to be lying? And then claiming that he did all this in order to see if someone would catch him out?

[xorxes]

@food, what do you think of worcej's reaction test? Real, or something he came up with in a hurry to cover for a mistake?

I am probably missing an important detail; I'm scanning your iso and flicking through the thread to try to understand.

Did worcej claim somewhere that they (1) deliberately implied they did not know the vote count (i.e. by asking if Jamie had voted for damo) and then (2) deliberately showed they did know the vote count (referring to checking the bot in the same timeframe), therefore (3) showing himself to be lying? And then claiming that he did all this in order to see if someone would catch him out?

Correct, that's what happened.

[bozotheclown]

Regarding rdr,

I really have trouble reading rdr. Something about rdr's posts is both opaque and transparent and I never know what to make of it.

However, I like this:

I think we need an interesting EOD. And I am liking Neph more then Tom.

##vote Tom

I will point this out in contrast to how I am scumreading bozo. rdr chose a wagon to even the race, and force an interesting EOD that would provide information. By contrast, bozo, who was super confident on Chaqa all D1, left that confident position and created a leader - meaning someone else (like rdr) would have to fight to even out the wagons, or let Neph run away with it. I think the rdr line here is very townie: embrace your own lack of knowledge and push a situation that will give you more.

The only other thing to say is, after reading both emc and rdr, I should probably also read Tom and compare. emc and rdr seem to be aligned in their "Tom-bad!" evaluation, and there is probably something to be figured out in all that.

I voted for the player I preferred to see lynched after concluding it was not going to be Chaqa, I did not want to see the wagons evened at that point.

[foodcoats]

@food, what do you think of worcej's reaction test? Real, or something he came up with in a hurry to cover for a mistake?

I am probably missing an important detail; I'm scanning your iso and flicking through the thread to try to understand.

Did worcej claim somewhere that they (1) deliberately implied they did not know the vote count (i.e. by asking if Jamie had voted for damo) and then (2) deliberately showed they did know the vote count (referring to checking the bot in the same timeframe), therefore (3) showing himself to be lying? And then claiming that he did all this in order to see if someone would catch him out?

Correct, that's what happened.

Well, that's pretty convoluted, and it hurts my brain, and it makes me think that one of you must be scum, either a lazyscum worcej or a penetratingly aggressive scumxorxes.

[xorxes]

I am probably missing an important detail; I'm scanning your iso and flicking through the thread to try to understand.

Did worcej claim somewhere that they (1) deliberately implied they did not know the vote count (i.e. by asking if Jamie had voted for damo) and then (2) deliberately showed they did know the vote count (referring to checking the bot in the same timeframe), therefore (3) showing himself to be lying? And then claiming that he did all this in order to see if someone would catch him out?

Correct, that's what happened.

Well, that's pretty convoluted, and it hurts my brain, and it makes me think that one of you must be scum, either a lazyscum worcej or a penetratingly aggressive scumxorxes.

Why would I be scum if worcej is somehow town with an incredibly intricate and pointless reaction test? I don't follow your reasoning there.

[Kakarroto]

I've slept a bit, had a new look at what xorxes noticed, I can't say I see a major flaw right now in my reasoning, maybe a bit tunneled. There is one other explanation, which isn't really role indicative, that he made a mistake by overlooking it and didn't want to find anyone out so he constructed this story (for whatever reason), but after so long, wouldn't he just tell us that?

Considering the current flow of the game, it's standing quite still with only some trying right now. Maybe it's because of the weekend, maybe because scum is content with the current state. This 2-2-2 doesn't seem to tingle even anyone, maybe I shouldn't have declared that, now everyone seems not liking to vote.

Thank you for answering bozo, that was yesterday I think, I must've missed it then with me being all over the xorx/wor thing. Missing EoD? I'm guilty of that too (thanks to unforseen circumstances), Chaqa was ill at that time (was even replaced) ... that's 3 out of 5, Nephthys had a really bad luck that day it seems.

Goldfinger taking his time getting to read what has happened, I presume, with my current information, I'll need to have a look at him and Chaqa previously again.

I'm not too keen to vote worc right now, I know, I said myself there is something wrong with that post streak, but I'm not too keen to follow xorx (again) given the outcome yesterday. I like much more my vote going to ##VOTE FlaviusAetius

[Jamiet99uk]

Ok, ladies and gentlemen, I am here.

Looks like I have a little catching up to do but I can do that.

Looks like Flavius has gone missing. Yo FLAAAAVVIIOOUUSSSS? Where you at?

The votes are spread out, seems like town don't have much clue.

Let me see if I can INSPIRE ya all.

YEAH.

[Jamiet99uk]

Also, there are few people around here that have a tendency to try to take charge. The currently group of people who seems to lead is rather short.

There are too many sheep for the amount of herders we have to protect from the wolves.

Okay, Jimmy Dub, I hear ya. You're worried there's danger down on the farmyard. Tom the sly fox is sniffing around your chicken coop. Xorxes is looking to make off with your prize pumpkin. I see it.

Join with me. I'll show you a LEADER, brother. Let the National Heavyweight Champion take charge, Jimmy. Follow me and lynch TOM the BOMB to-DAY.

YEAH.