M50: Madness in Memetown [HIDDEN]

[BunnyGo]

See, I haven't clicked on that doc link, but it contains the description of my role made PUBLICLY

I wasn't aware of that, would have done this differently or rather not used it at all unless I was chosen for a lynch

I'm just catching up (as is probably clear by my recent posts). But as confusing as everything is (like kitsune being lynched before I logged on the first time) I'm sooooooo confused by this post. Can someone spell it out for the stupid bunny?

[Squigs44]

So the only role you knew was your own?

QT is now open, I'm aware what my mates can do and what they can fakeclaim

you should know this by now, Squigs don't act so naive

Wait did you claim mafia?

[Vaporwave]

So the only role you knew was your own?

QT is now open, I'm aware what my mates can do and what they can fakeclaim

you should know this by now, Squigs don't act so naive

Wait did you claim mafia?

No, others have pointed their greasy finger at me

[Vaporwave]

Can someone spell it for the stupid bunny?

This game belongs to 3p. It's a 3P world and we just live in it

[Squigs44]

QT is now open, I'm aware what my mates can do and what they can fakeclaim

you should know this by now, Squigs don't act so naive

Wait did you claim mafia?

No, others have pointed their greasy finger at me

Okay, so you are 100% mafia. Got it.

[BunnyGo]

Yeah, I think scum came off this day better than they should have, with one incorrect town death. It's unfortunate, but we'll have to live with it. People with experience, how are the odds looking for town right now? I feel like we should still be okay given that we know Vapor is scum, but we're significantly lacking in D1 voting information.

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

[BobMcBob]

See, I haven't clicked on that doc link, but it contains the description of my role made PUBLICLY

I wasn't aware of that, would have done this differently or rather not used it at all unless I was chosen for a lynch

I'm just catching up (as is probably clear by my recent posts). But as confusing as everything is (like kitsune being lynched before I logged on the first time) I'm sooooooo confused by this post. Can someone spell it out for the stupid bunny?

By my limited understanding, Vaporwave got confused, didn't read the setup, misinterpreted his role and accidentally revealed himself as mafia hammerer. We're going to lynch him tomorrow (I think. I can't see why not).

So the only role you knew was your own?

QT is now open, I'm aware what my mates can do and what they can fakeclaim

you should know this by now, Squigs don't act so naive

Wait did you claim mafia?

Does it matter? I think we know he's mafia already (was this a joke? You should have put an emoji next to it to make it clear). Him claiming mafia doesn't change anything. If he wants to give us insights into the mafia team and setup then by all means let him.

[BunnyGo]

Thanks @Bob, that makes sense.

[rdrivera2005]

So the only role you knew was your own?

QT is now open, I'm aware what my mates can do and what they can fakeclaim

you should know this by now, Squigs don't act so naive

If there is a Vig out here he should probably claim and shoot Vapor. We don't miss a day and have a clear if we don't massclaim.

[Squigs44]

Re Massclaim:

Town-roles with an easy self clear mechanism(20):
Bulletproof: wait for mafia to kill or lynch near end game to see
Commuter: Use watcher/tracker or other NA's to confirm
Conditional Innocent Child: Lynch vaporwave tomorrow
Cop: Use watcher/tracker or other NA's to confirm
Driver: Drive two confirmed townies and they can confirm
Friendly Neighbor: Reveal to confirmed townie
Gladiator: Challenge vaporwave tomorrow
Governor: Extend the day phase
Gunsmith: Use watcher/tracker or other NA's to confirm
Innocent Child: Leave alive to day 4
Interceptor: Correctly describe the PMs of confirmed townies, such as cop, tracker, watcher, etc...
Item Smith: Hand out the specified item to a confirmed townie
JOAT: Use Vig power in a specified way
Medium: Choose a specified player to continue posting
Philosoraptor: Send a message to a confirmed townie
Reviver: Revive a townie
Tracker: Either watcher, or they can say who a confirmed townie visited
Vigilante: Use vig power in a specified way
Watcher: Either tracker, or they can say who visited their target (less good)
Wednesday Frog: Wait until Wednesday

More problematic town roles (8):
Anti-Encryptor: Really nothing we can do
Bodyguard: Will not know until dead
Bulletproof: We just leave them alive until they are our last resort
Doctor: Can only confirm through successful save, RB makes things difficult
Lover: Can really only confirm when they are dead
Magnet: Can confirm, but at the expense of learning nothing else that night
Omniscient: If this role is in this game, then a mass claim is absolutely the right call and this game is on auto-win pretty much.
Vengeful: Can confirm upon death

Mafia Complications:
Roleblocker: Can basically negate one town confirm
Janitor: Can prevent a role reveal from giving us info in a 1v1 showdown
Role thief: Can basically negate one town confirm, but creates a 1v1 showdown
Traitor: Can kill one town confirm that could be valuable in gathering other info

3rd party complications:
Arsonist: Can be very dangerous if they can make it towards the end game. Their dousing would be much more effective in a mass claim where they likely know who will be killed or not.
Assassin: Will kill their target roles no matter alignment, which could hurt town a lot if their target roles are mostly/all town
Chameleon: Just a giant wildcard. Possibly useful to target them with a town role to get an extra townie if they reveal.
Infector: Will thrive in a mass claim. Knowing who is visiting who will make it easy for this person to infect everyone. Only thing standing in this persons way is the doctor (if the doctor is even in the game).
Harambe: Weird role. We can just lynch them at the end though.

Overall conclusion:
Mass claim generally seems like it has a lot of potential clears, but is certainly not broken. Mass claim benefits infector and arsonist the most, and screws over mafia the most I think.
If someone is omniscient, then we should definitely definitely mass claim.

[TrPrado]

Yeah, I think scum came off this day better than they should have, with one incorrect town death. It's unfortunate, but we'll have to live with it. People with experience, how are the odds looking for town right now? I feel like we should still be okay given that we know Vapor is scum, but we're significantly lacking in D1 voting information.

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

I wouldn't say so. We're down two town and only have one scum with two hours worth of usable interactions. We'll be down another town going into D3 unless we get lucky.

[BunnyGo]

Yeah, I think scum came off this day better than they should have, with one incorrect town death. It's unfortunate, but we'll have to live with it. People with experience, how are the odds looking for town right now? I feel like we should still be okay given that we know Vapor is scum, but we're significantly lacking in D1 voting information.

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

I wouldn't say so. We're down two town and only have one scum with two hours worth of usable interactions. We'll be down another town going into D3 unless we get lucky.

OK. I'm new to forum mafia. In f2f with the ratios I'm used to, this would be a win all day.

[Squigs44]

Yeah, I think scum came off this day better than they should have, with one incorrect town death. It's unfortunate, but we'll have to live with it. People with experience, how are the odds looking for town right now? I feel like we should still be okay given that we know Vapor is scum, but we're significantly lacking in D1 voting information.

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

I wouldn't say so. We're down two town and only have one scum with two hours worth of usable interactions. We'll be down another town going into D3 unless we get lucky.

No I think Bunny is right here. Trading two town for one mafia is good.
Also, I think there was some decent info in the first two hours. Xorxes' mass claim idea certainly made some people uncomfortable

[BunnyGo]

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

I wouldn't say so. We're down two town and only have one scum with two hours worth of usable interactions. We'll be down another town going into D3 unless we get lucky.

No I think Bunny is right here. Trading two town for one mafia is good.
Also, I think there was some decent info in the first two hours. Xorxes' mass claim idea certainly made some people uncomfortable

What are you thinking? I didn't really follow that discussion at all. No idea if Xorxes claim made sense, or if he's secretly trying to bully the town into revealing too much with no benefit

[TrPrado]

Isn't basically having a start on day 2 with a known scum and two dead town a good trade?

I wouldn't say so. We're down two town and only have one scum with two hours worth of usable interactions. We'll be down another town going into D3 unless we get lucky.

No I think Bunny is right here. Trading two town for one mafia is good.
Also, I think there was some decent info in the first two hours. Xorxes' mass claim idea certainly made some people uncomfortable

Only about half the people in the game interacted with the idea in those two hours, and 8 players didn't post at all in those 2 hours. Maybe it can point to MAYBE one person, but it's not nearly enough to call this situation a win.

[Ezio]

Hello everyone. It's been a few games since I've played.

@Xorxes, @Squigs

What's the quality of Flavious' play been in the recent games he's been in?

[FlaviusAetius]

I've been the best there ever was

As for @xorxes, so you basically proved my point, mass claiming day one doesn't allow us to confirm anything on day 1(or now I guess day 2)

@Squigs the point was that when you massclaim, theres a lot of roles revealed and a lot of information flying all at once. I think we can both agree, that at a certain point when there's too much information, its easy for people to slip under the cracks. And those cracks matter because that's where mafia find themselves in. As for everyone else we are all put on the backpedal, forcing to defend ourselves when we could instead be solving the game.
YES I agree if there's an Omniscient that we can PROVE is Omniscient then 100% we should mass claim right now, but mafia are already talking to each other they already knows the roles they can fake claim, their going to be prepared for this, and we will be walking essentially blind, its a strategy error.
And I do know how to play mafia that was the strawman, me not 'understanding basic concepts of mafia' because I didnt agree with you that we should massclaim? What a joke

[FlaviusAetius]

Also, xorxes is 100% mafia IMO
He didn't bring up Omniscient not once, yet he claims he's gone through all the roles a thousand million times, wonder why

I think @squigs your want for everyone to massclaim is genuine, xorxes' not so much

[FlaviusAetius]

FINAL POINT;
If massclaiming is actually going to work, it sounds like this game is broken, which PROBABLY isnt true, so lets not risk it, no?

[Squigs44]

Hello everyone. It's been a few games since I've played.

@Xorxes, @Squigs

What's the quality of Flavious' play been in the recent games he's been in?

I have only played one game with him (he was mafia). He was one of the most prolific posters I have played with, but I generally didn't find myself enlightened by any of his posts ever. He seemed to fixate on incorrect ideas he had and tunneled quite a lot. Not sure how he plays as town, but I would assume even as town he wouldn't be a super valuable poster. I could be biased from a rather large clash in playstyle I have with Flav though.