Kamala Harris ftw

[Stressedlines]

Is it free? Tell me how u plan to pay for it and she plays identity politics with the best of them

[Octavious]

Unless you believe that the US is inherently poorer than other western nations, paying for universal healthcare should not pose a particularly difficult problem. From a purely economic standpoint maintaining a healthy and productive workforce makes a lot of sense. From a moral standpoint not having a decent standard of universal healthcare is indefensible.

[ND]

How about they go get jobs and pay for it like the rest of us like I have to do

[Stressedlines]

Oct. That isnt the reality here though. You can wish in one hand and shit in the other...which one fills up first

First the lobbyists. Then the gross negligence of our government where our one example of social healthcare already exists is a damn nightmare (va system)

I dont mind having such a system but I want to understand how its gonna be put j to play and how we are managing it before

[Octavious]

@ Stressedlines

I refuse to accept that the American people are somehow too inept to come up with such a system. But to make it happen there must be political will, and political will is driven by public demand.

In terms of creating such a system, the ingredients are all there. America is full of talented people who could create and run it. America dedicates vast amounts of its wealth to painfully inefficient healthcare each year, so the money exists in plentiful amounts. You have countless examples from foreign nations you can adopt best practice from.

All you need is the will to make it happen.

[Stressedlines]

Again Oct. We have a rather large very inept system.now for our veterans that is a freaking disaster

Men shooting themselves in waiting rooms or the parking lot cu their rehab spot was filled. Very needed operations being delayed months and guys dying before hand

I got zero damn faith in this government to make a system that works

So before we start chirping for universal how about fixing the smaller version first and using that as the model?

[Octavious]

So before we start chirping for universal how about fixing the smaller version first and using that as the model?

Because arguments like that have been used against virtually every plan of significant change since time immemorial. Ultimately they are just an excuse, and no amount of tweaking or improvements to the stepping stone project will make a damned bit of difference whether the major change is adopted. There will always be problems to sort out first, lessons to be learned, crucial bits of preliminary evidence to gathered... and before you know it another decade has passed and nothing has changed.

America has the money, or else you claim that American capitalism has been a failed project. America has the ability, or else you claim that the only thing exceptional about America is a remarkable deficiency in leadership and capability. The only question is whether America has the good sense and moral fortitude.

[Stressedlines]

Capitalism is a joke

And how is a failing universal health care run by the government and currently letting guys die in waiting rooms an 'excuse'?

This I'd some. The government runs a healthcare system.now for 9 million vets....its a complete disaster. Can we get that one right first?

Hell some of the more liberal politicians seem to think its working fine....its comical they think that. I dare them.to use that themselves

[Stressedlines]

I mean the logic is easy Oct. We cant help 9 million but we will certainly be fine doing 300 plus million

[Octavious]

Letting veterans die in waiting rooms is a disgrace, stressed, and Americans everywhere should be embarrassed and ashamed and angry. But using this shocking failure as a reason to avoid doing anything else is using it as an excuse. It's pathetic, it's pitiful, and if that's what passes for the American way these days then God help us all.

[Stressedlines]

I can tell u horror stories with my own eyes. Saw one old guy like 85 or so. Shit himself in a wheelchair. All these guys are telling the nurses and they said "it's not his turn"

It's a national disgrace

My poi t is the government runs this debacle so I aont gonna give e them.free reign to make a bigger mess of shit

[Stressedlines]

Americans are not gonna trust anyone who says free healthcare Oct

Swing states wont go for it.

Between ACA and va we have seen the dirty hand of the government t

[StevenC.]

Hell, I'm not opposed to some sort of universal healthcare system in principle (and neither are most Americans) but here's the thing. The VA healthcare system, Medicare, and our federal tax code need to be reformed if it has a chance in hell of being passed in Congress and accepted by the states. Right now the hurdles appear to be insurmountable.

I think heavily reforming our private healthcare system has a much better chance of coming to fruition at this point.

[Jamiet99uk]

So basically Stressed is admitting that Americans are incompetent. Sounds about right.

[Stressedlines]

I'm admitting that a lot of us are but good job on missing the point

The government's track record for managing healthcare is pitiful

[Stressedlines]

I'm all for it but I want it to have a chance not be a clusterfuck

[StevenC.]

I'm all for it but I want it to have a chance not be a clusterfuck

Exactly. I have zero trust in the federal government implementing a successful NHS as things stand.

[Fluminator]

Are you still a Kamala Harris fan? She has proven to be very sneaky in terms of pandering and changing her views depending on the situation.