Mafia 85: Return from Lockdown

[damo666]

I was happy to see that everyone ignored BunnyGo and claimed only their real result.

you don't think it's possible that there are some town masking their real result and lied about it like sweet suggested?

It is possible, but it would not be very helpful. What I meant, though, was that no one gave 2 alternative results.

I would go further. Any town lying (or indeed not reporting, Bob) would be detrimental to town and if any town are please cough now.

[Jamiet99uk]

EXPLANATION:

The two town roles that give return message as "delivered" or "undelivered":

You are the Paper Delivery Boy. You deliver a newspaper subscription to a target, including their name, which will remind them who they are. They will get an additional message with their role PM. Returns "delivered" or "undelivered", as appropriate.

You are the Door-Darter. You you deliver a delicious dinner to someone in the building. They will receive an additional PM with the food. You return "delivered" or "undelivered", as appropriate.


damo's and bozo's claim fit very neat together for damo being paper delivery boy and bozo detective. Could be extremely bold fabricated mafia lie, but there was no real counterclaim (aside of the 3 delivered/undelivered message count)

sweet claimed that he did deliver his package, and with the power of elimination, he should be door darter if he doesn't lie. So Jamie should've gotten the food (btw how fitting, we all should get us some 'food' today imo). Now two option: if Jamie confirms, that would make chaqa lying mafia and we should vote him out to confirm sweet as town. If Jamie says he didn't get anything like that after checking, then one of Jamie or sweet has to be lying mafia.

well, that would be if any involved town doesn't lie like sweet said, but he himself said before he did not in this case and Jamie and chaqa probably not. If they are town and lying, now would be the time to confess to get this unravelled.

Oh, I see!

I think this is very good detective work, Kak.

Sweetandcool said he successfully made a delivery to me.

I did NOT get a PM telling me about any food. I have checked my PMs a third time to make absolutely sure.

Therefore Sweet cannot be the Door Darter. I think you are right that Damo is very probably the paperboy. Therefore Sweet is likely scum.

##Vote Sweetandcool

[Chaqa]

@Kak what do you think of Bob not claiming anything?

I find it odd that no one else is caring about it

[Kakarroto]

there was also a very slim chance bozo+damo lying and sweet being actually paper delivery boy and Jamie would be Electoral Comissions Officer, but then Jamie should've received the ECO message on top of that role.

so with both their claims this way, one of them just HAS to be lying

[lfischl]

actually mine got changed, I put brainbomb in earlier in the phase as I wasn't going to follow the system and then flipped with about an hour left to hamilton brian but the GMs did not see it so I returned failure for brain

Did you PM both GMs?

I did not that's why it didn't work

[lfischl]

Food's wagon is gaining traction. Sometimes I think town can run ahead of itself and talk itself into a decision UNLESS there is incredible hard proof.

I'm interested in what's going on with lfischl. Why didn't you stick with what the plan was?

##Vote lfischl

I've been very against the whole mechs plan since it first started, and I did try to switch back but I messed up my PM

[Jamiet99uk]

there was also a very slim chance bozo+damo lying and sweet being actually paper delivery boy and Jamie would be Electoral Comissions Officer, but then Jamie should've received the ECO message on top of that role.

so with both their claims this way, one of them just HAS to be lying

Yes. I also think that if Bozo and Damo are scum together and agreed to fabricate their results in that way, this would be a _very_ risky scum gambit because if one of them was later exposed, the other one would be exposed too. In my experience Bozo likes to play it safe as scum, so I think such a gambit is very highly unlikely.

I promise I am not lying. I did not receive any notification of a delivery. Therefore it seems extremely likely that Sweet is scum here.

I was already assigning town points to Chaqa for being ready to gladiate Sweet but Kak's excellent work here pretty much confirms it, I reckon.

[Jamiet99uk]

actually mine got changed, I put brainbomb in earlier in the phase as I wasn't going to follow the system and then flipped with about an hour left to hamilton brian but the GMs did not see it so I returned failure for brain

Did you PM both GMs?

I did not that's why it didn't work

Y'see, this is why we have a long standing instruction that says "Send your PM to BOTH GMs".... but never mind.

As a GM, I know it's the worst feeling when you don't notice a player's PM or when you accidently delay sending a PM at EoN, but such things do happen.

This does not clear you of course but I am perfectly willing to accept you would not make up this detail.

[Jamiet99uk]

@Chaqa: I agree that Bob is being scummy by withholding information, but I think on the basis of Kak's detective work, it's a good idea to swing Sweetie.

[bozotheclown]

you don't think it's possible that there are some town masking their real result and lied about it like sweet suggested?

It is possible, but it would not be very helpful. What I meant, though, was that no one gave 2 alternative results.

yeah, I know, bunny's suggestion with the 2 different results. Would've been fun, but not the road taken.

disregarding any mechanics, who do you think between Jamie, sweet and chaqa is lying mafia?

I don't think I can disregard what we know, because I believe one of Jamie/foodcoats and one of sweetandcool/Chaqa must be mafia. If sweetandcool delivered something to Jamie, he would have to be the Door-Darter, and Jamie did not claim to have receive a food message, so if sweetandcool is the Door-Darter, I think both Jamie and Chaqa are mafia. However, if Jamie's is town, then foodcoats and sweetandcool are both implicated as mafia.

[lfischl]

Did you PM both GMs?

I did not that's why it didn't work

Y'see, this is why we have a long standing instruction that says "Send your PM to BOTH GMs".... but never mind.

As a GM, I know it's the worst feeling when you don't notice a player's PM or when you accidently delay sending a PM at EoN, but such things do happen.

This does not clear you of course but I am perfectly willing to accept you would not make up this detail.

yeah I was right in between classes and didn't realize, but it's whatever, would've gotten the same result anyway

[Kakarroto]

@Kak what do you think of Bob not claiming anything?

I find it odd that no one else is caring about it

surly odd, but it's in line of stubborn town, at least not a small chance for that. Maybe he just doesn't want to do it. Maybe he IS mafia and lying. But I wouldn't be too concerned about it, if we really want we could night 2 to scan him with 3 or 4 actions, like, town is so close to overwhelm mafia, that one mafia doing this would just stretch the game one more day. At least if the majority of town is saying the truth of their claims and we have a somewhat correct picture of the game

but yeah, playing that way isn't necessarily mafia, and at the end of day, he is free to do so if he follows the rules. The "Playing for the win" rule should not trigger here, I think, like damo said he's anti-town, and in a way, but he could also have a plan to follow that is not connected to the mass claim, and he is free to follow his thought of winning the game as town.

[brainbomb]

Im sure there is probably some way to use my role on one of the remaining scum candidates right? have me tonight visit one of them and I get to see who they targeted?

[brainbomb]

basically I become a tracker/informant role of sorts

[brainbomb]

I saw will because babyspice visited lfischl and saw the last person lfischl voted for.

so what would I get a result of I visit the person who performs the night kill. I would see the targets result of the person who dies?

[brainbomb]

wait I was right the first time it is basically an informant.

You are the Mail Man. You take a sneaky peak at people's mail as you deliver it. You return what your target returned.

So I see the result that my target gets from the GM.

[Kakarroto]

Im sure there is probably some way to use my role on one of the remaining scum candidates right? have me tonight visit one of them and I get to see who they targeted?

not a bad idea, though you get the same message as they do, so it could maybe be not so decisive info depending on their role (like the sicko would get 'SUCCESS', so that wouldn't say too much)

we could do something like this: you scan bozo (as detective), bozo visits one candidate, lfischl (as doc) saves bozo. If mafia rb's lfischl and nk's bozo, you get bozo's detective message.

well mafia could just rb bozo, but that's about all they can do to mess with town, so then there is the news host and the ECO to give us information. Like they can't just stop town from gaining more accurate information

[Jamiet99uk]

I did not that's why it didn't work

Y'see, this is why we have a long standing instruction that says "Send your PM to BOTH GMs".... but never mind.

As a GM, I know it's the worst feeling when you don't notice a player's PM or when you accidently delay sending a PM at EoN, but such things do happen.

This does not clear you of course but I am perfectly willing to accept you would not make up this detail.

yeah I was right in between classes and didn't realize, but it's whatever, would've gotten the same result anyway

Likely, if you were roleblocked, but I don't think you can be 100% sure of that at the moment.

[brainbomb]

I am assuming mafia is not sacrificing everything here without someone out there being nestled up in a safe haven mechanically.

If this ends up being true, then mafia risked two people to get Jamie killed here under the hope that jamie was being so overwhelmingly scumread that people would follow me on him and trust food here.

What I dont quite trust is Neph in this but I do agree sweet is probably scum and chaqa is not. Chaqa has not been very scummy, hes been more annoying and hard to work with, which is usually his town game.

and then between D&W, Kak, worcej, hamilton; I think its been established worcej is town now, D&W is pretty uninvolved in the game and visited bob; not sure how we view that crowd of 4 but hamilton seems like a logical choice to be scum here.

[Jamiet99uk]

Im sure there is probably some way to use my role on one of the remaining scum candidates right? have me tonight visit one of them and I get to see who they targeted?

Since you are so interested in me, I am willing to volunteer to be targeted by you tonight.