M82: Magic the Gathering Mafia [Game Thread]

[Foxcastle]

Hamilton agrees with my proposal to take me, Sweet, and Kak off the table today. So Kak-Ham-??? would make sense here, on the idea that HB knows he's not on the radar, so taking Kak out of the equation gives him pretty good odds that he push through another miskill.

Although Kak's vote on "Brian" (not counted by bot) detracts from the theory...

[Hamilton Brian]

Not wholly comfortable with sweet and I lining up on the same player right now.

Bunny with this End voting. That’s pinging me wrong.

Then there’s Bona with the one word responses; just doesn’t offer anything.

But there’s the low key Rivera factor and that’s jammed town time and time again. Totally rethinking my Vecna vote.

And if I seem staccato I’m in the car traveling.

[Foxcastle]

Sigh. Not the best day for the deadline to fall, I'm going to have to vote and then I'll be gone all afternoon. If I'm able to be back on at EOD, it's going to be on my phone.

[Hamilton Brian]

Going on the limb here and ##vote sweetandcool. <shrug and question marks>

[Vecna]

Worcej and Bunny are too obvious, so I don't think they're scum.

That means that looking at the final D1 wagons, either Kak is scum or Vecna is. And then it's two of Hamilton, Rdr, and Bona.

two people that are usually pretty obvious town, are now obviously scummy.

And yet you think that makes them town?

Can you elaborate a bit more on that?

[Foxcastle]

If Kak and Bona are scummates, the theory would be:

1. Bona joke-busses Kak at the start of the game

2. Then shifts to Bunny and then ghug (perhaps opportunistically following Damo's vote)

3. 26 min before EOD, he busses Kak again. Before he votes, Kak is leading Damo 4-3, so this looks good for Bona if Kak flip scum, but he doesn't actually push Kak into the lead out of a tie. This makes sense for a scummate to do—if he's bussing, he either gets credit or he gets to move off for a bigger swing in the wagons.

4. And that's exactly what happens: Bona moves off Kak with one minute to go, breaking a 5-5 tie between Kak and Damo to put Damo in the lead 6-4.

[Foxcastle]

Worcej and Bunny are too obvious, so I don't think they're scum.

That means that looking at the final D1 wagons, either Kak is scum or Vecna is. And then it's two of Hamilton, Rdr, and Bona.

two people that are usually pretty obvious town, are now obviously scummy.

And yet you think that makes them town?

Can you elaborate a bit more on that?

What incentive do scum have to bring attention to themselves? Both Worcej and Bunny are perfectly capable of emulating their town behavior as scum. They aren't doing that here. Maybe it's WIFOM, sure, but scum have an incentive to blend in, and it wouldn't be hard for them to do that.

I've said this kind of thing before (both as town and as scum trying to look townie), but the times I have come closest to actually catching scum are the times I put aside the people who look scummy to me and start focusing on the people who aren't drawing my attention as scum candidates.

[Foxcastle]

So, Kak-Bona-Hamilton (with Rdr an outside chance).

##VOTE BONA

[BunnyGo]

Worcej and Bunny are too obvious, so I don't think they're scum.

That means that looking at the final D1 wagons, either Kak is scum or Vecna is. And then it's two of Hamilton, Rdr, and Bona.

Tell me more about me and worcej.

Who called you nihilistic? Whatever post that was was similar to my thinking.

And Worcej has been low activity, there are a bunch of people he's barely mentioned (notably, Bunny, he hasn't typed the trigram BUN at all this game...), he responded to several posts with images of cards, etc etc.

It's entirely possibly both/either of you are scum and are just trying to prove that you can win as scum while blatantly being surly, but I don't think it's likely.

I already HAVE won as scum by being surly. It isn’t fun.

I’d dispute that I’m being nihilistic, but I can’t be bothered.

I’m with you on worcej, just wanted to hear your thoughts on us in more detail. Not too original, but that’s ok.

[BunnyGo]

Tell me more about me and worcej.

Who called you nihilistic? Whatever post that was was similar to my thinking.

And Worcej has been low activity, there are a bunch of people he's barely mentioned (notably, Bunny, he hasn't typed the trigram BUN at all this game...), he responded to several posts with images of cards, etc etc.

It's entirely possibly both/either of you are scum and are just trying to prove that you can win as scum while blatantly being surly, but I don't think it's likely.

I already HAVE won as scum by being surly. It isn’t fun.

I’d dispute that I’m being nihilistic, but I can’t be bothered.

I’m with you on worcej, just wanted to hear your thoughts on us in more detail. Not too original, but that’s ok.

Wait. I’m not at all with you on worcej. Got turned around here. I’m so confused by your posts!

[BunnyGo]

Worcej and Bunny are too obvious, so I don't think they're scum.

That means that looking at the final D1 wagons, either Kak is scum or Vecna is. And then it's two of Hamilton, Rdr, and Bona.

two people that are usually pretty obvious town, are now obviously scummy.

And yet you think that makes them town?

Can you elaborate a bit more on that?

What incentive do scum have to bring attention to themselves? Both Worcej and Bunny are perfectly capable of emulating their town behavior as scum. They aren't doing that here. Maybe it's WIFOM, sure, but scum have an incentive to blend in, and it wouldn't be hard for them to do that.

I've said this kind of thing before (both as town and as scum trying to look townie), but the times I have come closest to actually catching scum are the times I put aside the people who look scummy to me and start focusing on the people who aren't drawing my attention as scum candidates.

Ah.

But Hamilton and kak have proven repeatedly they can’t hide.

So who else does that leave?

I will say that rdr is now retroactively pinging me. Last game he commented that I always scumread him, and so maybe he’s trying to pocket me?

[Foxcastle]

Further thoughts on the Kak-Bona-Ham team.

i wasn't around


hmmmm

I'm pretty sure I saw your name in the list of people here though. So sure of that I would bet valuable things (but betting is not allowed so I wont do it) on it. If you're telling the truth though then you're probably not on vacation right now? At home and your computer running? We had that issue before in other games as far as I remember.

we talked about this last game

i just have the tab open and don't close it so it appears like i'm online

Kak calls out Bona for having been looking at the thread, Bona says that they talked about this last game and that it's just him having the tab open. (I don't think this is correct; I think having the tab open is not sufficient for the site to recognize you as active, I think you have to actually be active on the page... but that's not the point.) Cheap and easy way for Kak to manufacture an early interaction with Bona that Bona can easily slip out of.

Is this a "mafia-heavy" setup?

I am asking because I just don't consider those things right off the start of the game.

If yes, then...best way to get through this as town? Day 1 is a shitshow ordinarily. If VCA is a key way to solve (and not sure it is), then what if we threw the hammer of the gods, made like a bunch of squirrels swinging at a nutbag, and voted to end today!

Don't like that at all.

Or I could go the Gen X vs Gen Z route and vote Bona. I'll keep that in mind as I make that transition from the joke Damo vote.

Is the whole Boomer v Zoomer thing something that HB is manufacturing with Bona so that they can have an excuse to interact without interacting about actual scum hunting?

Kak trying to trigger the vanillaizer could just be cover for him being the vanillaizer...

Hamilton on page 12 doing a little work on Kak. "No one really feels off or on this game so far. ... Well, Kak maybe. These codes of text to trigger the card role? Super duper." And asking Sweet about his vote on Kak.

I don't want this to become a wall of text (too late?)... so I'm stopping at the end of D1.

So much of this you can read either way, but I do think if you read the three of them together, you can see a pattern of making sure they don't ignore each other while also making sure they don't actually draw attention to each other.

[Vecna]

Thanks for answering fox.

Im fully willing to go for Bona if that means we get some coordinated voting.

You seem to be trying to solve this thing, and while I dont fully agree that just because people can effectively fake their townplay fully that they will also endeaver to do so, theres no real way of knowing which of those 2 scenario's we currently have regarding Worcej. So you may just as well be right.

##vote Bona

[Vecna]

as for Kak, I keep going back and forth.

Ive really liked his recent content. But we can always revisit that at a later time.

Lets hope were right on Bona first

[rdrivera2005]

Bad Ghug died and was a PR.

The day was shortened? This is really bad as I am traveling today and was hoping to catch up at night.

##vote Sweet - going with my first feeling.

[BunnyGo]

Bad Ghug died and was a PR.

The day was shortened? This is really bad as I am traveling today and was hoping to catch up at night.

##vote Sweet - going with my first feeling.

Tell me how you see or don’t see the townslip of his I called out

[sweetandcool]

I haven't had time for analysis and I'm not sure I will ):

But I have caught up on reading, and holy moly Vecna comes in and I've agreed with like 95% of what they've said. Even Fox made a good point or two.

Town: Kak, Vecna
Maybe town: Bad Bunny, Bad bad Fox (needs analysis)

Neutral: rdr (I gave them too much town cred earlier)

Mafia?? Worcej, Bona, Ham

Please note that the mafia category is almost completely made by PoE rather than any other real evidence. Though Ham has been bothering me a bit all game.

[sweetandcool]

So ##VOTE worcej, and please note that while I previously claimed that I liked worcej's play, that was very early in the game and a lot has changed since.

[rdrivera2005]

Bad Ghug died and was a PR.

The day was shortened? This is really bad as I am traveling today and was hoping to catch up at night.

##vote Sweet - going with my first feeling.

Tell me how you see or don’t see the townslip of his I called out

Could you point me the page?

[rdrivera2005]

Bad Ghug died and was a PR.

The day was shortened? This is really bad as I am traveling today and was hoping to catch up at night.

##vote Sweet - going with my first feeling.

Tell me how you see or don’t see the townslip of his I called out

Could you point me the page?

I know it's lazy but I am boarding a plane.