MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

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Chaqa
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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2441 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:52 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:42 pm
Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:19 pm
@Balki:

I suspect our failures to find common ground are simply due to two VERY different personalities. Your entire assumption is that I would be worried about Lfischl because of last game.

I am being 100% honest when I say that, as far as I can remember, it has not factored into my play at all until the post I made in response to you.

You may not believe that. That's fine.

I'll pull a quote from worcej from LAST GAME here:
worcej wrote:
Sun Dec 18, 2022 6:33 pm
He’s done it in the past as scum, but chaqa is not someone who is consistent with his game.
I'm sorry I can't answer more to your satisfaction or convince you I'm town, I wish I could, but you simply are trying to get blood from a stone here.
What was it that you found scummy about Lfischl this game? You never told us.

Why didn’t you try to convince other people to vote lfischl? In your most recent game as town, you tried to convince people to vote your scumread all the time.
I mean, Lfischl was sorta just scum by default, wasn't he?

I spent most of Day 1 and 2 tunneled on worcej and tied up with in claim BS. By Day 3 we had 3 PR claims, a dead ghug, and worcej no longer suspicious. By that point, I had it down to this:
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:29 pm
Anyway, I think the clears help this be narrowed down a lot.

Gun to my head, right now I'd say Balki, Lfischl, Damo, though Bozo and Rivera are in my PoE as well.

I just don't think bo is scum.
I still don't think Bo is scum, but he's failed to impress today, so I'm not so sure. Meanwhile Rivera, while being in my PoE, I'm more confident is town now.

So I'm not really sure what you're looking for here. And the way you describe it make it seem like I was frothing at the mouth to kill Lfischl, but he was only 5% higher than you on my list. He made sense to go first as a consensus kill and an easy win.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2442 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 pm

Maybe it's weird to you, but my reasons for voting someone are rarely based on me sitting down and reading in-depth at someone's words.

Instead, I've got an internal scum-meter that moves over time for people. It's not numeric, it isn't written, it's not consistent, and it's completely based off of little interactions and things people do.

Sometimes I comment them out. Apparently, I did that a lot last game. I was off work for most of December, so I guess I just had more time or felt more motivated.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2443 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:59 pm

Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:52 pm
I mean, Lfischl was sorta just scum by default, wasn't he?

I spent most of Day 1 and 2 tunneled on worcej and tied up with in claim BS. By Day 3 we had 3 PR claims, a dead ghug, and worcej no longer suspicious. By that point, I had it down to this:
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:29 pm
Anyway, I think the clears help this be narrowed down a lot.

Gun to my head, right now I'd say Balki, Lfischl, Damo, though Bozo and Rivera are in my PoE as well.

I just don't think bo is scum.
Well you said this:
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:39 pm
Scum percentages inspired by Damo:

lfischl 80%
Balki Bartokomous 75%
bozotheclown 55%
damo666 55%
rdrivera2005 25%
bo_sox48 10%
Did you have any reasons to suspect lfischl the most out of those six choices?

And why again are you so confident that Bo is Town?

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2444 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:00 pm

Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 pm
Maybe it's weird to you, but my reasons for voting someone are rarely based on me sitting down and reading in-depth at someone's words.

Instead, I've got an internal scum-meter that moves over time for people. It's not numeric, it isn't written, it's not consistent, and it's completely based off of little interactions and things people do.

Sometimes I comment them out. Apparently, I did that a lot last game. I was off work for most of December, so I guess I just had more time or felt more motivated.
That's possible.

I hope you can understand why someone might think that another more likely explanation for you failing to solve puzzles in this game is that you have no puzzle to solve.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2445 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:18 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:59 pm
Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:52 pm
I mean, Lfischl was sorta just scum by default, wasn't he?

I spent most of Day 1 and 2 tunneled on worcej and tied up with in claim BS. By Day 3 we had 3 PR claims, a dead ghug, and worcej no longer suspicious. By that point, I had it down to this:
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:29 pm
Anyway, I think the clears help this be narrowed down a lot.

Gun to my head, right now I'd say Balki, Lfischl, Damo, though Bozo and Rivera are in my PoE as well.

I just don't think bo is scum.
Well you said this:
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:39 pm
Scum percentages inspired by Damo:

lfischl 80%
Balki Bartokomous 75%
bozotheclown 55%
damo666 55%
rdrivera2005 25%
bo_sox48 10%
Did you have any reasons to suspect lfischl the most out of those six choices?

And why again are you so confident that Bo is Town?
I've already answered both of these, and in fact the answer to the former is in your own posts from before.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2446 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:18 pm

For reference:
Chaqa wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:18 pm
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:14 pm
It could be lfischl.

What is the general profile on lfischl? I've just found him low interest/low impact in this game, but I don't really know which way that points for him.

On the bright side, I'm kind of sick of looking up the correct ordering of all those consonants every time I have to type his name.

On the downside, all we've really done in this game is chop the low-hanging fruit/low activity players. That doesn't mean it's not a hit this time. I just wish someone would sell me on it.
Last game he was scum and fooled me at final 3 with a similar playstyle, though he seemed a bit more invested that game, but also it was over a break from school, I think.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2447 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:20 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:00 pm
Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:58 pm
Maybe it's weird to you, but my reasons for voting someone are rarely based on me sitting down and reading in-depth at someone's words.

Instead, I've got an internal scum-meter that moves over time for people. It's not numeric, it isn't written, it's not consistent, and it's completely based off of little interactions and things people do.

Sometimes I comment them out. Apparently, I did that a lot last game. I was off work for most of December, so I guess I just had more time or felt more motivated.
That's possible.

I hope you can understand why someone might think that another more likely explanation for you failing to solve puzzles in this game is that you have no puzzle to solve.
You're playing Chess, I'm playing Khet.

You have lots of tactical thoughts and strategies.

I just like to make the laser go brrr.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2448 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:22 pm

Chaqa wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:18 pm
For reference:
Chaqa wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:18 pm
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:14 pm
It could be lfischl.

What is the general profile on lfischl? I've just found him low interest/low impact in this game, but I don't really know which way that points for him.

On the bright side, I'm kind of sick of looking up the correct ordering of all those consonants every time I have to type his name.

On the downside, all we've really done in this game is chop the low-hanging fruit/low activity players. That doesn't mean it's not a hit this time. I just wish someone would sell me on it.
Last game he was scum and fooled me at final 3 with a similar playstyle, though he seemed a bit more invested that game, but also it was over a break from school, I think.
Let me translate this to Eden-speak:

In the prior game M1023, Lfischl played in a similar manner to the current game of M77. This means there is a high likelihood he is also scum this game. However, he was slightly more active last game, which I chalk up to him having been off school for the holidays, so I don't factor the activity difference, if there is one, into my evaluation. Lorem ipsum deesnutsm.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2449 Post by BunnyGo » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:23 pm

KoalaAttack wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:02 pm
KoalaAttack wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 7:31 am
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 7:13 am
Bed time for me.

Koala, if you’re looking for something to do, my advice is:

Re-read Day 1. You can probably skip over the posts from the clears and the dead. Focus on the VT claimers. Look for things that stand out, now that you know so many other alignments that you didn’t know when you read this the first time. Especially look for posts that can help show that particular combinations of the VTs are unlikely to be Mafia teammates. Eliminating these potential pairs is really helpful in solving the puzzle. If you see something that you think can help us eliminate a pair, quote it here and talk about it.

ISO the VT claimers. You can do this in Peterbot. For posts that stand out to you, think about the possible scum motivation for making the post. Think about the possible Town motivation for making the post. Evaluate which motivation strikes you as more likely.


Hmm... this feels off.

I've already sent you a bot link with your own ISO in that discussion of the fake binding vote. And I have already been talking about doing ISOs with Bunny and I have already posted at least one unpairing I found. Given that your very advice is to carefully read through what others posted, I can only assume you did not flat out miss those.

So, to apply your rubric:

The Town motivation for this post above would be... Stating the obvious that I already know? ... Honestly, the best I can come up with is "good intentions, honest mistake, simply doesn't quite know how to pair/mentor someone without overbearing" ... So, question for the rest of the folks who know Balki: does that sounds like typical Balki?

The Mafia motivation for this post though is quite clear ... butter up the new guy with nice-sounding but not actually new/useful advice, assume the role of a vizier for them, gently guide then right where you want them. And it does tie in interestingly to your earlier statements about how we should just let the PRs decide things.

I would like both Bunny and Balki (and anyone else) to grade my thinking here and/or respond to my question about Balki.

BTW, it really grows my suspicion when Balki posts and responds to some of my points where I suspect him or answers some of my questions, but just kind of skips the others. This has happened several times now. If you are a Town Balki, you are really not helping your case but leaving these threads handing.
C

It’s good you’re thinking about motivations, but you’re getting lost in the WIFOM

I wouldn’t give Balki town nor scum points for this

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2450 Post by BunnyGo » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:40 pm

Quiet here…

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2451 Post by bo_sox48 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:41 pm

I am not going to tie or try to swing the vote for survival’s sake, but I have been politely reminded that I have not voted yet and will do so based on what I actually think even if it’s completely irrelevant today. ##VOTE bozo

I quite frankly don’t think Chaqa is scum but will take direction from the clears if they decide they want to orchestrate this EOD.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2452 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:43 pm

I'd still like us to vote Chaqa or Bo, and I'd love to hear Bunny and Koala's reactions to some of my recent ISO posts.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2453 Post by rdrivera2005 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:56 pm

bo_sox48 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:41 pm
I am not going to tie or try to swing the vote for survival’s sake, but I have been politely reminded that I have not voted yet and will do so based on what I actually think even if it’s completely irrelevant today. ##VOTE bozo

I quite frankly don’t think Chaqa is scum but will take direction from the clears if they decide they want to orchestrate this EOD.
I won't give you town points for this as only clears could really swing the voting at this point. But I still don't think you are the most likely to flip scum.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2454 Post by dargorygel » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:00 pm

Vote Count 4.5
bo_sox48 (3): bozo, Balki, Bunny
chaqa (2): rdr, damo
damo666 (1): Chaqa
KoalaAttack (1): Koala
Bozotheclown (1): bo
Bo_sox be besotted by sox.
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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2455 Post by bo_sox48 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:02 pm

rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:56 pm
bo_sox48 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:41 pm
I am not going to tie or try to swing the vote for survival’s sake, but I have been politely reminded that I have not voted yet and will do so based on what I actually think even if it’s completely irrelevant today. ##VOTE bozo

I quite frankly don’t think Chaqa is scum but will take direction from the clears if they decide they want to orchestrate this EOD.
I won't give you town points for this as only clears could really swing the voting at this point. But I still don't think you are the most likely to flip scum.
I’m not looking for points. I’m looking to be helpful for the first time this game.

My flip won’t surprise you, by the sound of things.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2456 Post by rdrivera2005 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:11 pm

bo_sox48 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:02 pm
rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:56 pm
bo_sox48 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:41 pm
I am not going to tie or try to swing the vote for survival’s sake, but I have been politely reminded that I have not voted yet and will do so based on what I actually think even if it’s completely irrelevant today. ##VOTE bozo

I quite frankly don’t think Chaqa is scum but will take direction from the clears if they decide they want to orchestrate this EOD.
I won't give you town points for this as only clears could really swing the voting at this point. But I still don't think you are the most likely to flip scum.
I’m not looking for points. I’m looking to be helpful for the first time this game.

My flip won’t surprise you, by the sound of things.
If you flip scum I will be a bit surprised.
Anyone that is too sure at this point is scummy to me, which points me to Bozo and Chaqa. Balki insisting on flip you to get info is also making me nervous I am wrong about him.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2457 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:12 pm

Bo Sox is just so damn noble and stoic.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2458 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:15 pm

rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:11 pm
bo_sox48 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:02 pm
rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:56 pm


I won't give you town points for this as only clears could really swing the voting at this point. But I still don't think you are the most likely to flip scum.
I’m not looking for points. I’m looking to be helpful for the first time this game.

My flip won’t surprise you, by the sound of things.
If you flip scum I will be a bit surprised.
Anyone that is too sure at this point is scummy to me, which points me to Bozo and Chaqa. Balki insisting on flip you to get info is also making me nervous I am wrong about him.
I would submit me hammering Bozo last game as proof against this hypothesis being true

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2459 Post by Chaqa » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:18 pm

Also, the number of times I've been sure Bona was town only to watch him get miskilled and THEN get called scummy for rightly believing he was town.

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Re: MAFIA 77: RETURN TO THE WEST [GAME THREAD] - [HIDDEN]

#2460 Post by damo666 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:24 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:23 pm
Chaqa/Bo is my best bet.

I think that voting Bo first is a good idea. Having some clarity on that D2 vote would be useful, and I think the Bo/lfischl interactions make a pretty good case for Scum!Bo.
Balki do you really think scumChaqa would put scumBo on 10%?

Your case on Chaqa is quite strong. You say flipping Bo would sort D2 votes. I say flipping Chaqa would sort why he is still alive. Please consider switching to Chaqa who seems to be your stronger scumread anyway.

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