wolfu wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
pyxxy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:34 pm
You are...not wrong. But I think you need to consider that you were making the case on sabi before bona even flipped.
Combine that with the way your opinion on bona progressed from townish to full scum D4, it really did look like a plan where you and bona had both decided to let you fully bus him and then try and set up sabi as the next day's miskill since they would look really bad for townreading their friend bona.
Your enthusiasm for this case on sabi fits with a town who really believes that they're solved the game and nobody is listening to them. Or it's a pre-constructed case that scum was preparing for over 2 days and so it's much easier than normal for scum!you to present it believably.
wolfu wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
i think that's a pretty biased view
ultimately if i see a connection as town am i supposed to not talk about it? part of the reason i turned against bona was that his interactions with sabi felt toothless, like he was never trying to actually read them
No, you would be hurting town not to talk about it. Town wins from gathering more information. Town also wins by voting scum. If all scum had to do is say "How come I'm being voted for just presenting my reads?" then town would never win. If we're wrong about you, then your reads live on to win you glory.
wolfu wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
surely if the plan was to throw bona under the bus, i could simply...come up with reasons he was scummy on his own? with an informed perspective i don't have to do all this blah blah about finding a partner i can just find the scummy things he's done
but as part of what i was doing yesterday, i had to re-evaluate EVERYONE and that meant taking a closer look at sabi and that meant bringing up the stuff i saw, because people were discussing if bo or ike was one of the scum and neither actually felt right to me based on my reading of the game
again it's rather frustrating to have multiple people deal with me this way where they are kind of clearly starting from a conclusion and working backwards - "a scum could bus bona here so wolfu was bussing because his read changed". it's very irritating because i feel like i've been pretty transparent with my thought processin terms of hiow things changed but there's no attempt to figure out whether i was genuine, i just get slapped with "read changed = bus" and that's a very overly simplistic view of the game.
no one has even attempted to actually understand my thought process to figure out if i'm scum or not
i don't think i try to push an unpopular option like sabi as scum, so many of you were completely willing to believe that there was a scum in the lurkers that that'd be pretty easy to get away with
I hear you (in the world where you're not scum and really are a frustrated townie) but I feel like you didn't really read my explanation.
It's the combination of turning on bona _and_ spending so much time setting up sabi as the next pick _in_ your interactions with bona.
D4 ~5 hours left before day was hammered:
wolfu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:27 pm
i'm just gonna say it
i still think sabi is mafia
i don't think them having emotional outbursts is town indicative. they're capable of faking that as scum
i think rdr and bo have towntold reasonable amounts and i kind of just don't think the afk is mafia
i think their argument with demon day 2 looks all the world like scum distancing to me
really for me the question is whether damo or bona is their partner...and i kiiind of think bona makes sense? would be highly theatrical but it makes sense if mafia bona decided to jump on my nuts because i was suspecting sabi
wolfu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:53 pm
bona snipes at sabi for shieldig people a ton
but i'm literally not sure he has ever attempted to solve sabi's alignment this game even once - the most he does is say sabi looks bad on night 2 but then day 3 happens and it all gets swept under the ug
and for two people who know each other and are friends that's
really weird???????
And then idk the ending of D4 just feels like scum theater:
wolfu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:49 pm
Bonatogether wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:46 pm
wolfu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:37 pm
it literally avoids taking any sort of definitive stance, yes
it's fancy words dressing up a non-read that is just summarizing play
it's literally not wrong you dumbass.
yes factual summaries tend to not be wrong
my issue is not that it is false it is that i do not get the sense you are attempting to solve sabi in that post, or have ever attempted to solve sabi
Does this explain better what I find suspicious about you?
You say you're not going to hammer. Then you spend the time to lay out this case for scum!sabi, a case which _largely_ depends on bona flipping scum. After the case is hot and fresh out of the oven then suddenly it's okay to (try to) hammer. Voilá! bona flips scum and you've got sabi in your sights as the next miskill.
Why sabi? Well let's look at your other options on D4:
- bona -> going to die
- bo -> possible, but hard, given he's started trying
- ike -> probably town because of the whole GM would sub a scum theory (forgive me for meta-thoughts or w/e it's called)
- damo -> most people here ruled out a bona/damo scum team, also he keeps doing weirdly scummy things, probably should keep him around
- pyxxy (myself) -> damo and sabi both townread me so you would need a strong counter consensus and would have to openly lead it yourself
- rdr -> basically confirmed town, as you said yourself, which, more about that in a second
sabi is pretty clearly the easiest target, not to mention you already talked about looking into sabi on D3 before demon and rumi died
it's kinda wild actually, you demon and bona are all chatting it up in the thread _immediately_ after darg gets day vigged
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... d=w:315323
you watch him die, drop this post to maybe try and set the tone on sabi, and then dip
wolfu wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:18 pm
Bonatogether wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:16 pm
wolfu wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:11 pm
i dunnoit's...more the timing of it feels like it could be artificial
i don't know who you're referring to here? me or him
demon not you
anyway i'm going to watch tv
sabi is still mafia
and then you come back pretty quickly, just to keep chatting with bona and believing demon's claim
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... t=p105-109
wolfu wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:59 pm
Bonatogether wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:56 pm
wolfu wrote: ↑Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:54 pm
i'm waiting to make sure no one counter claims commuter although i fairly doubt demon is faking that role
you doubt demon is faking?
i doubt he's faking commuter yes because it puts him in a 1v1 as mafia for very questionable reasons, where he could just claim the scan and probably get away with it every time
possible i'm overthinking it but we will see
I'm not the best person to view this situation neutrally because I knew that demon was lying because of the scan claim since I had actually gotten the scrying stone on N1. But you don't look good, wolfu.
wolfu wrote: ↑Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:42 pm
pyxxy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:18 pm
This really is a funky little situation.
wolfu lost his control by thinking he was hammering (he hasn't posted since either)
So bo gets to hammer the day when he feels like it.
Re: opinion from a Bona voter, I'm the wrong person to ask about that part of the day. My suspicions lie in more in how he interacted (or didn't) with demon.
But I will say that wolfu, you kinda branched off my post on Bona. Especially when I went and found and highlighted his list of reads that you quoted a few hours ago. That makes me feel weird. Maybe I'm just narcassistic and wanted credit, though.
pyxxy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:25 pm
wolfu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:19 pm
i think rdrivera is basically always town. just buy that he's legitimately scumhunting here
sorry if I'm having a classic webdip EOD moment rn
wolfu are you just echoing what other people including myself have said about rdr?
context so that it's not completely taken out of context
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... d=w:316037
no, i'm not really trying to echo what you say ftr (that is something i rarely do as mafia). i'm just...doing my own research largely and coming to the same conclusions as you
I've never seen your anything game, nor has anyone in this game besides sabi? So while it's a nice reassurance to say "I don't do X as mafia"...
...what tickled my brain at the time was it reads more like "ignore that other part where you pyxxy were suspicious about why you wolfu felt so comfortable saying something like that about rdr, a player that I pyxxy don't think you've ever played with before, but a player that you wolfu would have talked to your scummates about"
Sorry if this wallpost isn't cohesive I was trying to engage with wolfu's post and then got deep into peterbot and re-reading and after 45 minutes on this I just need to post it and go to sleep.