M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

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celaph
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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2941 Post by celaph » Sat Sep 24, 2022 1:05 am

rdrivera2005 wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:57 pm
wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:53 pm
i think sabi asking to vote first on demon was performative, neon was clearly being stubborn by refusing to unvote and sabi only posted once or twice, it wasn't like they were fightig likehell with neon to do it - and then they voted demon anyway to enable the hammer. so i don't think that is clearing
I still need to re-read Sabi, but right now I still stick with the obvious. Bo give the chance for Demon to hammer and was tryng to avoid a Bona kill yesterday. He also avoided voting Bona D1 tryng to jump on my wagon. Please don't give him a pass to him if I am not around tomorrow.
Sounds like Bo is worth a read too!

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2942 Post by BesharamSabi » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:40 am

Anyway hi.

I am still td-ing moot.

My game that sucked up all my energy and wim which was a wolf rand ended today in a win.

This is why I'm exhausted and haven't played myself.

Now that I can talk freely about that game since it's over,

Gira look at that game.

Now look at this game.

If you can't tell the difference idk man.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2943 Post by BesharamSabi » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:40 am

This is said game

https://mafiathesyndicate.com/viewtopic.php?t=2417

I play under Sabiplz

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2944 Post by pyxxy » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:53 am

wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
pyxxy wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:34 pm
You are...not wrong. But I think you need to consider that you were making the case on sabi before bona even flipped.

Combine that with the way your opinion on bona progressed from townish to full scum D4, it really did look like a plan where you and bona had both decided to let you fully bus him and then try and set up sabi as the next day's miskill since they would look really bad for townreading their friend bona.

Your enthusiasm for this case on sabi fits with a town who really believes that they're solved the game and nobody is listening to them. Or it's a pre-constructed case that scum was preparing for over 2 days and so it's much easier than normal for scum!you to present it believably.
wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
i think that's a pretty biased view

ultimately if i see a connection as town am i supposed to not talk about it? part of the reason i turned against bona was that his interactions with sabi felt toothless, like he was never trying to actually read them
No, you would be hurting town not to talk about it. Town wins from gathering more information. Town also wins by voting scum. If all scum had to do is say "How come I'm being voted for just presenting my reads?" then town would never win. If we're wrong about you, then your reads live on to win you glory.
wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:04 pm
surely if the plan was to throw bona under the bus, i could simply...come up with reasons he was scummy on his own? with an informed perspective i don't have to do all this blah blah about finding a partner i can just find the scummy things he's done

but as part of what i was doing yesterday, i had to re-evaluate EVERYONE and that meant taking a closer look at sabi and that meant bringing up the stuff i saw, because people were discussing if bo or ike was one of the scum and neither actually felt right to me based on my reading of the game

again it's rather frustrating to have multiple people deal with me this way where they are kind of clearly starting from a conclusion and working backwards - "a scum could bus bona here so wolfu was bussing because his read changed". it's very irritating because i feel like i've been pretty transparent with my thought processin terms of hiow things changed but there's no attempt to figure out whether i was genuine, i just get slapped with "read changed = bus" and that's a very overly simplistic view of the game.

no one has even attempted to actually understand my thought process to figure out if i'm scum or not

i don't think i try to push an unpopular option like sabi as scum, so many of you were completely willing to believe that there was a scum in the lurkers that that'd be pretty easy to get away with
I hear you (in the world where you're not scum and really are a frustrated townie) but I feel like you didn't really read my explanation.

It's the combination of turning on bona _and_ spending so much time setting up sabi as the next pick _in_ your interactions with bona.

D4 ~5 hours left before day was hammered:
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:27 pm
i'm just gonna say it


i still think sabi is mafia

i don't think them having emotional outbursts is town indicative. they're capable of faking that as scum

i think rdr and bo have towntold reasonable amounts and i kind of just don't think the afk is mafia

i think their argument with demon day 2 looks all the world like scum distancing to me


really for me the question is whether damo or bona is their partner...and i kiiind of think bona makes sense? would be highly theatrical but it makes sense if mafia bona decided to jump on my nuts because i was suspecting sabi
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:53 pm
bona snipes at sabi for shieldig people a ton

but i'm literally not sure he has ever attempted to solve sabi's alignment this game even once - the most he does is say sabi looks bad on night 2 but then day 3 happens and it all gets swept under the ug

and for two people who know each other and are friends that's


really weird???????
And then idk the ending of D4 just feels like scum theater:
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:49 pm
Bonatogether wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:46 pm
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:37 pm

it literally avoids taking any sort of definitive stance, yes

it's fancy words dressing up a non-read that is just summarizing play
it's literally not wrong you dumbass.
yes factual summaries tend to not be wrong

my issue is not that it is false it is that i do not get the sense you are attempting to solve sabi in that post, or have ever attempted to solve sabi
Does this explain better what I find suspicious about you?

You say you're not going to hammer. Then you spend the time to lay out this case for scum!sabi, a case which _largely_ depends on bona flipping scum. After the case is hot and fresh out of the oven then suddenly it's okay to (try to) hammer. Voilá! bona flips scum and you've got sabi in your sights as the next miskill.

Why sabi? Well let's look at your other options on D4:
- bona -> going to die
- bo -> possible, but hard, given he's started trying
- ike -> probably town because of the whole GM would sub a scum theory (forgive me for meta-thoughts or w/e it's called)
- damo -> most people here ruled out a bona/damo scum team, also he keeps doing weirdly scummy things, probably should keep him around
- pyxxy (myself) -> damo and sabi both townread me so you would need a strong counter consensus and would have to openly lead it yourself
- rdr -> basically confirmed town, as you said yourself, which, more about that in a second

sabi is pretty clearly the easiest target, not to mention you already talked about looking into sabi on D3 before demon and rumi died

it's kinda wild actually, you demon and bona are all chatting it up in the thread _immediately_ after darg gets day vigged
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... d=w:315323

you watch him die, drop this post to maybe try and set the tone on sabi, and then dip
wolfu wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:18 pm
Bonatogether wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:16 pm
wolfu wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:11 pm


i dunnoit's...more the timing of it feels like it could be artificial
i don't know who you're referring to here? me or him
demon not you

anyway i'm going to watch tv

sabi is still mafia
and then you come back pretty quickly, just to keep chatting with bona and believing demon's claim
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... t=p105-109
wolfu wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:59 pm
Bonatogether wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:56 pm
wolfu wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 10:54 pm
i'm waiting to make sure no one counter claims commuter although i fairly doubt demon is faking that role
you doubt demon is faking?
i doubt he's faking commuter yes because it puts him in a 1v1 as mafia for very questionable reasons, where he could just claim the scan and probably get away with it every time

possible i'm overthinking it but we will see
I'm not the best person to view this situation neutrally because I knew that demon was lying because of the scan claim since I had actually gotten the scrying stone on N1. But you don't look good, wolfu.
wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:42 pm
pyxxy wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:18 pm
This really is a funky little situation.

wolfu lost his control by thinking he was hammering (he hasn't posted since either)

So bo gets to hammer the day when he feels like it.

Re: opinion from a Bona voter, I'm the wrong person to ask about that part of the day. My suspicions lie in more in how he interacted (or didn't) with demon.

But I will say that wolfu, you kinda branched off my post on Bona. Especially when I went and found and highlighted his list of reads that you quoted a few hours ago. That makes me feel weird. Maybe I'm just narcassistic and wanted credit, though.
pyxxy wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:25 pm
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:19 pm
i think rdrivera is basically always town. just buy that he's legitimately scumhunting here
sorry if I'm having a classic webdip EOD moment rn

wolfu are you just echoing what other people including myself have said about rdr?

context so that it's not completely taken out of context
https://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g ... d=w:316037
no, i'm not really trying to echo what you say ftr (that is something i rarely do as mafia). i'm just...doing my own research largely and coming to the same conclusions as you
I've never seen your anything game, nor has anyone in this game besides sabi? So while it's a nice reassurance to say "I don't do X as mafia"...

...what tickled my brain at the time was it reads more like "ignore that other part where you pyxxy were suspicious about why you wolfu felt so comfortable saying something like that about rdr, a player that I pyxxy don't think you've ever played with before, but a player that you wolfu would have talked to your scummates about"

Sorry if this wallpost isn't cohesive I was trying to engage with wolfu's post and then got deep into peterbot and re-reading and after 45 minutes on this I just need to post it and go to sleep.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2945 Post by pyxxy » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:59 am

if this is town!celaph's level of effort as a substitute then I can see why y'all are able to spot scum!celaph every time :lol:

anyways gn y'all ttyl

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2946 Post by damo666 » Sat Sep 24, 2022 10:40 am

Initial reaction to NK is

Bo frame or Bo double bluff?

Inclined to give him a pass.

So Sabi or Wolfu? Gonna take my time.

Glad to see Celaph posting, my little nagging doubts about that slot have dissipated.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2947 Post by damo666 » Sat Sep 24, 2022 11:49 am

Having relooked at vote history I have to put Bo back on the table.

Wolfu day 1 vote I find hard to fathom as scum.

My thinking is

Bo 40%
Sabi 40%
Wolfu 20%


Celaph I would like to hear your thinking.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2948 Post by celaph » Sat Sep 24, 2022 4:06 pm

bo_sox48 wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:20 pm
My order of preference at this point:

1st. wolfu - I am not likely to change my mind. D4 was scummy as hell. Staying away from RHK on D3 was also scummy, but claims they were working. Still had time to at least offer a take but did not.

Distant 2nd. Besharam - I can see the case, but it needs more substance and needs to go beyond Bona. I can see Besharam potentially trying to lurk as they realize they're the deep threat but they are struggling with it.

3rd. Damo - would require him bussing both of his daykilled teammates pretty hard, and particularly would mean two teammates bussed the tracker on D1. I don't really buy it.

I don't see a way anyone else is mafia at this point.
Can you say why I'm not mafia?

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2949 Post by celaph » Sat Sep 24, 2022 4:11 pm

bo_sox48 wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:17 pm
I wouldn’t have killed rdr, it’s way too fun to constantly beat him and his baseless arguments
You know this is a meaningless argument.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2950 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 4:47 pm

good morning

i will be catching up and getting to replies now

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2951 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:03 pm

BesharamSabi wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:40 am
Anyway hi.

I am still td-ing moot.

My game that sucked up all my energy and wim which was a wolf rand ended today in a win.

This is why I'm exhausted and haven't played myself.

Now that I can talk freely about that game since it's over,

Gira look at that game.

Now look at this game.

If you can't tell the difference idk man.
i was spectating that game the entire time and was aware you were mafia in it

it is why i am giving you no credit for your burst of exaggerated emotional posting

it is why i think you trying to protect bona the way you did is scummy

it is why i have felt a lot of your posts came across as glaringly fake

if you are going to claim there is some actual difference between the games, beyond you being more motivated to win that game against a playerlist it was going to be difficult to fool, you are going to have to spell it out for me

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2952 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:14 pm

bo_sox48 wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:50 pm
Bona: is scum
Scum: does not want Bona to die, but if he’s going to wants to be townread as a result

You: townreads Bona
You, later, as Bona is looking likely to die: starts scumreading Bona
You, when it is basically certain Bona will die: LOOK AT ME, HIS DEATH IS BECAUSE OF ME AND ONLY ME, NOT YOU ALL, JUST ME. I DID THIS. WATCH ME HAMMMMMMMEEEEERRRRR!!!!!

Me: wow wolfu that’s kinda weird doncha think
You: no, and you better spend hours explaining it to me because I will not accept this slander
i think this is a very poor exaggeration

when i started to turn against bona the votes were split 2-2

the day really could have gone either way and no one had so much as stated a lean

if i had...actually wanted to save bona i would have done that

it rather makes no sense that the argument is based around me wanting to save bona when i didn't really try to do that, and instead i LISTENED to the arguments being provided and changed my mind

because that is what you are supposed to do as town

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2953 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:28 pm

again this whole thing is people pre-configuring a narrative they want to be true rather than evaluating what is likely

why can't i just be town who started the day off with an incorrect read and was slowly convinced by the evidence to come to the correct read? is that really such an implausible thing to have happen? there has been basically no explanation why my day 4 is more likely to come from scum that town, which is sort of the crux of things

from where i'm standing it looks like i'm being judged for not instantly being correct, which is pretty ludicrous

because yes, if you look at my play day 4 and ask whether it makes sense as coming from scum, i suppose you could say that. but you can generally look at almost any player in a game and construct an argument for why they COULD be scum.

you need to be able to also look at their actions and whether they can come from town, and decide what is more likely. you can't just construct a narrative and decide that must be the solution.

because my play can come from town, and it did. i'm not really sure what people think i did that doesn't come from town. was i supposed to simply read bona correctly instantly?


you also need to keep...the entire game in mind, and not just recent events

and it should be really glaringly obvious me and demon/bona is basically never a thing. i think most mafia players on most sites i have played on would grasp this because it is really pretty simple that mafia teammates do not treat each other the way bona and demon treated me


the reasoning being used against me will not help you catch scum, it will kill town at rates well above random tbh

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2954 Post by celaph » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:33 pm

Reread Bona's D2. I hesitate to give it too much weight because he's scum, but I don't think it's accurate to say that he was trying to bury Wolfu. After his wall post mid-day he never really comes back to the read. Most notably, he made no comment on other people joining or later leaving the Wolfu wagon. I don't know whether Bona bad at miskills or didn't want to kill scum Wolfu, but I don't think that Wolfu gets many town points for Bona's behavior.

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2955 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:59 pm

celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
Misc thoughts as I'm reading through things (mostly just Wolfu's iso).

1) Was PR worcej around at EoD and didn't claim??? I'm sure y'all have already commented on the play.
he was voted at the very last minute so yes he had no time to claim
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
2)
wolfu wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 2:29 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 11:20 am


I gave you a chance to push your Tom wagon and this is your response?
admittedly i don't like this
Did you dislike Bozo's post or Neon's?
bozo's posts. i think i went into detail as to why i didn't like it but the response felt unnatural
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
3)
wolfu wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:38 pm
kind of like bona coming at me for not being helpful but maybe i'm just a sucker for that sort of thing
Can you say more about what you liked in Bona's comments? Bona wasn't going after you for not being helpful. His critiques were that you were being non-committal in your beliefs and speaking of hypothetical scenarios instead of this game.
i was speaking in generalities, not hypotheticals, but i was applying them to ths game. i think he was just a nitpicky aggressive towny who was really scumhunting but was mostly attuned to trivial things. i was wrong.
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
4)
wolfu wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 6:01 pm
town reads
brainbomb
Rumi Tobari
Princess Neon


lean town (in order of confidence)
Bonatogether
DemonRHK
Tom Bombadil
damo666
worcej
BesharamSabi


true null/no content
Hellenic Riot
CrimsonFox
bo_sox48
Rdrivera2005

idk lol
bozotheclown


lean scum
pyxxy
dargorygel


the rdrivera thing brainbomb pointed out feels like a token scum move, to go back and re-use an opener faking not knowing the game started. not sure i'd want to yeet someone over it on day 1 though

doesn't really feel like day 1 of a 17 player game so far, some of that probably owed to 4/17 having almost no content, some of it probably due to the shortened phase length without added urgency

honestly would wager 1 scum at most in the 0/1 posters (hellenic/CFox/bo_sox/rdrivera) but that's a blind guess.

didn't really like how dargory responded to pressure at all
@Wolfu, Why is Rumi so far up this list? Also, on BB's earlier list, why didn't you argue in favor of Rumi being town if you feel so strongly?
@Everyone, how widely townread was Rumi D1? If someone had a townread on Rumi, would there be a good reason to not elaborate on it because everyone else feels similarly?

Secondly, why do you think that there was at most 0/1 scum out of the non-posters?
i had thought rumi was genuinly newbie town and her efforts at analysis were legitimate and not what i'd expect from newbscum even if they were hesitant in offering real reads. i think i made a post about about this but i'm not sure

i'm really not sure i caught wind of rumi being that low in brainbomb's list, but she wasn't an elimination candidate so i'm not sure i'd have argued about it at all

i do think rumi was generally overall townread - it was the mafia who were most hesitant to townread her iirc

as for 0-1 scum in the non-posters, that's part math and part past experience - people tend to naturally suspect players who are inactive, but being inactive day 1 is USUALLY random and doesn't mean a whole lot, so random chance would say there is most likely 1 scum in the inactive posters. this was possibly even less likely this game, since mafia had a night 0 and pregame chat
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
5)
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:50 pm
anyway now that i'm home my rationale for voting tom is as follows:

1. brainbomb and riot were both repping confident scumreads on tom

2. brain died with a confident townread on riot

3. these are smart capable players and when smart capable players have a strong meta scumread the best thing to do is shut up and sheep
:sick: :sick: :sick: I too like getting free miskills when town was wrong.

The problem here is that you don't highlight where what in BB's and HR's cases were good and use their casework to drive your case. Instead you just use the idea of them being good to drive your case.
i guess, yeah

the problem is the arguments were meta/feels-based and ultimately my move was to just trust their reads because they know the players better, and i did not have confidence in my own. you are free to say it was not good play.

but i think part of this game is recognizing that you, as a person, can only be so accurate and usually someone else will have a piece of the puzzle you do not. i have been pretty decent with my read accuracy over the last month but i'm still not perfect. this game has been the words reads i've had in quite some time. generally if someone is repping a confident meta scumread i will respect that.
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
6)
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:54 pm
i think sabi might be mafia

not really confident but reading their iso that's the vibe i get
We have President Bush over here with the amount of hedges you're hiding behind.

Edit: I think Wolfu makes a decent explanation in a relatively short order on their Sabi read. Retract this as a point against them.
i recognize you retracted this but i just want to say

the stuff about hedging is not really a scumtell but a linguistic choice for me. in general when i look at things i'm going to see a variety of possibilities and will discuss outcomes in terms of probabilities etc. i won't call someone definite scum and start pushing until i am confident
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:49 am
9)
wolfu wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 2:40 pm
the reasons given for townreading bona have mainly been due to him being loud, which i don't think is a good reason to townread someone
um... no...?
wolfu wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 12:00 am
bona keeps coming across as genuine when he posts
wolfu wrote:
Sun Sep 18, 2022 2:03 am
i would still think he's town, in allhonesty, because the very particular attitude toward the game he's shown is not one that scum fakes
Sorta skimmed the rest because reading a lot is hard.
i'm not talking about the reasons from me - i believe at that time i had went back to re-check riot's reads list
1

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2956 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:02 pm

BesharamSabi wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:40 am
This is said game

https://mafiathesyndicate.com/viewtopic.php?t=2417

I play under Sabiplz
also, the "this isn't my scumgame" [drop link with no explanation] argument was literally used against me by sabi in our last game together

they were on a 3rd party scumteam that game

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2957 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:23 pm

celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 1:01 am
tl;dr
I think that Wolfu actually started out the game with some decent D1 analysis, though it has not stayed. I think he has had a fundamentally warped view of the game at a number of points that are indicative of either a scum or a very wrong towny and I think the former. I'm a little off-put by all the talk about Demon/Bona's D2 behavior, but then again I haven't read what they said.

In a vacuum I don't mind his push on Sabi, but I should probably read Sabi's posts next.
i will not hesitate to admit that i was particularly wrong this game. i would disagree that being so exceptionally wrong is a scumtell. the fact is generally people with an informed perspective are able to position themselves better. in my most recent game almost every town player defended the mafia i caught on day 1, for not very good reasons. i had to cycle through suspecting them before realizing the scum was the player i mistakenly cleared for VCA reasons. that player had kept both mafia comfortably in their null reads.

i was wrong on who the mafia were this game but i made basically o meaningful effort to save them, it's not play that comes from a scum motivation

i also got a ton of shit for playing Day 1 the way i did and i think it negatively impacted how i chose to play the following days along with me losing confidence in my own reads due to having been very wrong early on. i also i think became harder and harder to keep track of everyone and what they were doing
celaph wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 1:03 am
wolfu wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:29 pm
i realistically have NO idea how you could get the idea that i am mafia when bona and demon tried to tag team bury me on day 2

that's not a thing that mafia teammates do, ever


was i drastically wrong on them? yes. it's been a while since scum tried to go after me like that and my typical expectation is that people tunneling me wrongly are town. but if you believe our plan was them bussing me why do i respond the way i do?

additionally bona tried to pocket me when it looked like i was willing to push damo and then flipped on me again when i changed my mind (because damo was towntelling). that's...not teammate behavior
From your perspective, what's the towniest thing you've done this game?
i don't know exactly.

i've been out in front trying to produce analysis that has more depth than i can fake as scum


actually, i basically never play day 2 the way i did as scum - sitting back and letting other people take the lead. that is something i exclusively do as town. as scum i want to be vocal, i want to have strong opinions, i want to have thread control. i don't let riot kill tom, i probably push an alternate wagon so riot can keep tunneling him instead

i also don't explode on demon day 2 the way i did if we're teammates - i would know what he was doing was all for theater and would respond accordingly

but i thought he was just legitimately being insulting and demeaning for no reason

and my whole re-evaluation on bona day 4 is something i'm proud of even if people keep trashing me over it

i had a bad read into the start of the day but i considered the arguments of others and re-examined the evidence came to the correct conclusion in the end

that's solving. that's how you play the game as town.

that's not to say i couldn't tactically fake that as scum

but if i was going to bus i would have attempted it well in advance

me initially coming in and calling damo scum with bona is not how scum operate

scum rarely hard align on pushes in such a fashion unless they are trying to close the game out. usually they attempt to have varied perspectives. but i didn't commit to pushing damo. i called him scum but then read his replies and decided to vote bona instead

that's what's towny about my play - i kept an open mind. i am not playing the game with a pre-set agenda

wolfu
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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2958 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:27 pm

pyxxy wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:53 am

I hear you (in the world where you're not scum and really are a frustrated townie) but I feel like you didn't really read my explanation.

It's the combination of turning on bona _and_ spending so much time setting up sabi as the next pick _in_ your interactions with bona.
again, you are viewing my actions through the preconfigured lens of "this could be a scum plot of setting up their next mis-elim"

which, fine, okay


but i am town and you have given 0 reason why me casing sabi as well as bona does not come from town

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2959 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:39 pm

taking a break for lunch so will be absent for a bit, will get to replying to other posts later

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Re: M76 - Dungeons and Dragons - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#2960 Post by wolfu » Sat Sep 24, 2022 8:35 pm

pyxxy wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:53 am
I hear you (in the world where you're not scum and really are a frustrated townie) but I feel like you didn't really read my explanation.

It's the combination of turning on bona _and_ spending so much time setting up sabi as the next pick _in_ your interactions with bona.

D4 ~5 hours left before day was hammered:
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:27 pm
i'm just gonna say it


i still think sabi is mafia

i don't think them having emotional outbursts is town indicative. they're capable of faking that as scum

i think rdr and bo have towntold reasonable amounts and i kind of just don't think the afk is mafia

i think their argument with demon day 2 looks all the world like scum distancing to me


really for me the question is whether damo or bona is their partner...and i kiiind of think bona makes sense? would be highly theatrical but it makes sense if mafia bona decided to jump on my nuts because i was suspecting sabi
wolfu wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:53 pm
bona snipes at sabi for shieldig people a ton

but i'm literally not sure he has ever attempted to solve sabi's alignment this game even once - the most he does is say sabi looks bad on night 2 but then day 3 happens and it all gets swept under the ug

and for two people who know each other and are friends that's


really weird???????
i think you are making an error here - that second bit about bona would be scummy REGARDLESS of sabi's alignment. it does not necessitate sabi being mafia. the lack of attempts to solve a player is an individualized scumtell

in the strictest terms bona not trying to solve sabi does NOT guarantee sabi mafia

but you have to go back and look at what he was doing in these interactions

was he trying to pocket sabi? no

was he trying to push sabi for an elimination? also no

was he starting a bunch of pointless arguments with sabi that went nowhere? yes. are those actions more likely to happen between a scum and a town, or scum and another scum? imo, it is the latter


and again you are faulting me for pointing out a connection i observed before bona had flipped, implying that making this observation can only come as part of a scum agenda rather than being

an actual read i had

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