M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

Let's make Jamie an actual wagon tomorrow pls

Why?

Make a case on me that's based on something more than "I don't trust anyone and Jamie is insufficiently upset that I voted for him" please. I dare you.

Nah I don't feel like making a whole case. You're just constantly ignoring reason enough that I don't think you have genuine reads anymore. Maybe because you bussed too much of your team and now you don't want to give up your last buddy, so you're just floating around willing to kill whomever.

What "reason" am I "ignoring"?

Your actual view appears to be based on your complete certainty on the question of Maniac's innocence, such that anyone who suspects Maniac must be killed. This comes moments after you said you didn't trust anyone. Yet you suddenly seem to trust Maniac a whole lot.

[damo666]

I don't think we can use VCA to eliminate anybody and I have convincing (imo) reasons to think Maniac is town. I do not believe the fake claim comes from scum and I do not think it was an attempt to out the real cop.

I think we can use VCA to eliminate gold.

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

[Chaqa]

I think we can use VCA to eliminate gold.

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

[BobMcBob]

I think we should put Bob back in the PoE.

Sus tier: Bob, Donny, HR
Meh tier: Damo, Rivera
TBD tier: Goldie, Maniac
TFB tier: TFB
Jeff Kuta tier: Chaqa, ghug, kgray, Jamie

I would love to see you try. Although fair warning that we might end up back in D2 flame wars.

[Jamiet99uk]

I think we can use VCA to eliminate gold.

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

The second question is:
"What do you think of HR's theory, that Vecna was resisting a Goldfinger wagon during D4"?

That is, HR suggested that Vecna only joined the Goldfinger wagon after very significant pressure and repeated earlier (implied) refusals to do so.

[BobMcBob]

I think we can use VCA to eliminate gold.

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

It's weak, but I doubt scum!damo calls Vecna a goon.

[kgray]

I think we should put Bob back in the PoE.

Sus tier: Bob, Donny, HR
Meh tier: Damo, Rivera
TBD tier: Goldie, Maniac
TFB tier: TFB
Jeff Kuta tier: Chaqa, ghug, kgray, Jamie

No, I don't think we can put bob back in the POE when two flipped scum tried to get a bob counterwagon to town!Flum near EoD1.

I just looked at Durga and celaph's day 1 ISO w/r/t Bob.

durga, celaph, join me

fine ##vote bob

That doesn't really look like "trying to get a Bob wagon going" so much as being indifferent. Again, I think it's possible there was a summit_fever style bus going on at some point.

Celaph's is kinda interesting.

http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?us ... rt=d1&g=72

He goes from saying he likes several things about Bob, to shading him, in a really weird and unnatural way. I recommend doing a Ctrl+F on Bob in the above ISO and seeing if it makes sense to you. Not sure what to make of it yet.

You (and HR) keep saying summit-style bussing but I don't see any way anything like that could have happened in this game. In that game, me, Flum and HR were all hard digging into summit. Constantly. And a bunch of other townies were voting him. Scum didn't really have a choice but to bus. I don't see anything that could be that situation in this game. HR is either scum ignoring that or actually too obsessed with his own scumread of Donny to see that nobody else was *really* that suspicious of him.

I think Durga's indifference still points to town!bob, but it's also not like she didn't interact with him before that. She was pushing him fairly consistently throughout the day and said she'd vote bob with 25 minutes to go. She didn't bus celaph like that, she gave him little excuses (like that he was rusty).

I don't know what to make of the celaph/bob interactions either. This comment makes me think bob doesn't make sense on a team with celaph and Durga:

elaborate

As a scum who likes game theory and who already has seen support from multiple people for the trust tell being trustworthy, why not make a post full of pretty decent logic supporting a known town? It doesn't really have a downside.

What do you think of Durga for calling blamp town then? It strikes me as odd that your disagreement was ostensibly about her read, but you've couched the discussion in blamp's alignment.

but when we were scum with him and demon the four of us had some weird interactions like this so I really don't know. I think it's entirely possible celaph was just being unnatural in general.

[kgray]

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

[damo666]

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

It's weak, but I doubt scum!damo calls Vecna a goon.

Oh yeah. I suppose I was just thinking not-GF. I suppose this is a tad different. Maybe an RBer might vote GF.

[Jamiet99uk]

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

It's weak, but I doubt scum!damo calls Vecna a goon.

Oh! Good spot, Bob.

Damo, Vecna wasn't a goon.

[Jamiet99uk]

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

[damo666]

Why is that? You keep changing your reads and I can't follow why.

Also, what do you think HR's theory that Vecna was resisting a gold wagon D4?

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

The second question is:
"What do you think of HR's theory, that Vecna was resisting a Goldfinger wagon during D4"?

That is, HR suggested that Vecna only joined the Goldfinger wagon after very significant pressure and repeated earlier (implied) refusals to do so.

See my response to Bob. I guess it's possible but then why wouldn't Vecna just stubbornly stick on HR (unless HR is GF but then gold can't be lol).

[damo666]

Ok gotta go. Monday evening is pub poker.

Hope to be here 2m.

[Chaqa]

We know Vecna is goon.
We know gold is not goon.
Vecna votes gold with 5 minutes to go D4 making it go from H5 V5 g4 to H4 V5 g5. I do not think a goon busses a GF like that. Ergo gold is VT.

I don't understand the second question.

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

What?

[Chaqa]

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

Damo's post had nothing to do with roleblocks. What relevance does it have???

[kgray]

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

It's this kind of thing that makes you so suspicious to me. How do you miss that, after all that energy you spent digging into Flum D1 for his "lie," and then on top of that, how do you just accept Damo and Chaqa missing it?

[kgray]

Good take.

Gold and Maniac could just both be town.

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

What?

Damo said Vecna was a goon, Vecna was in reality the RB, so I feel like Vecna being the RB would be on your mind since you were allegedly RB'd.

[Jamiet99uk]

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

Damo's post had nothing to do with roleblocks. What relevance does it have???

1. Damo called Vecna a "goon".
2. You referred to the post in which Damo said that as a "good take".
3. Vecna was the Roleblocker.
4. You claim you were roleblocked.
5. Yet you didn't notice Damo calling Vecna a Mafia Goon.

[kgray]

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

Damo's post had nothing to do with roleblocks. What relevance does it have???

His post was about whether or not Vecna would bus the GF, and he's assuming that a goon wouldn't and therefore goldie is likely town, but Vecna wasn't a goon so that's sort of irrelevant.

[Jamiet99uk]

Good take...? You forgot it was Vecna who RB'd you?

You have to remember that Chaqa is stoned half the time.

It's this kind of thing that makes you so suspicious to me. How do you miss that, after all that energy you spent digging into Flum D1 for his "lie," and then on top of that, how do you just accept Damo and Chaqa missing it?

You're not good at reading my humour. Never mind.