MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[TheMadMonarch]

Hedging. Clearly scum.

lemme put it this way: there is literally nothing more bona could have possibly done to convince me of (his/her(?)) township.
It is glaringly obvious that either bona has an absurd winrate in every talking/diplomacy game ever for being the greatest manipulator, or bona is town. Llooks like a town smells like a town and acts like a town. Bona is town.

I largely agree with you, but conftown is a stretch, unless we're using different definitions of the term here. I consider bb, demon and kgray all much more confirmed than Bona. Bona comes fourth on the list but there's still a chance he may not be town which I shouldn't be boycotted for pointing out.

The mason thing is brain trolling and should not be taken as fact.

This is what I wanted to know. Thanks!

[TheMadMonarch]

The two men looked at Mulder. If their eyes were flashlights, the six beams would have met halfway between the fork-lift and Mulder.

Neither one spoke.

So Mulder looked at his shoes. He knew what he was looking for, and this fork-lift gang might not be the prize. But they also might know the path.

“Agent Mulder. F.B.I.” he repeated.

Vote Count 2.2

Ghug (5) kgray, Bonatogether, Ezio, Maniac, BobMcBob
Maniac (4) BunnyGo, ghug, Donny Dude, Hamilton Brian
e.m.c^42 (1) Hellenic Riot
rdrivera2005 (1) jasnah
brainbomb (1) damo666
Bonatogether (1) brainbomb

Not Speaking Their Mind Regarding DayKills:
celaph, DemonRHK, e.m.c^42, Macca573, rdrivera2005, Vecna

If you Ghoogle "who is the leading wagon," you will receive, "ghug" as an answer.
Day ends in around 30.5 hours

Searched "who is the leading wagon,". Did not receive "ghug" as an answer.
0/10, would not vote again.

That's because I'm not leading anymore, obviously.

Duh! How could I have been so blind?!

[kgray]

Maniac has been a question mark for a few people; well at least two. There might be some more deserving wagons out there, but I am going to park the ##Vote Maniac for the insubstantial work. Post number 1 all the way through Post 25...just skimming the surface. Asking a question, hypothetical, but just there...not digging in the dirt.

That vote being what it is, I could also get behind a vote on Vecna, EMC, or Ezio.

What is a deserving wagon Hamilton?
I feel like Hamilton is going after lurkers on who to vote for. Just does not seem super solvy, just a lot of questions.

What makes you think that asking a lot of questions isn't solvey?

[kgray]

Can you articulate why you think I'm scum?

Ghug, is your town game more bland than your scum game in general?

Depends what you mean by bland.

I make more of an effort to check all the boxes as scum, which could come across as less bland, but I'm also less likely to do off-the-walls shit, which could come across as more bland.

What off-the-walls shit have you done this game?

[ghug]

3 straight hi posts without anything else.
Also a scum town me is same hypo.
##vote macca

##vote macca

Bunny and Donny probably aren't knowing teammates.

[kgray]

Early game he made a reasonable point about not killing ghug. He makes a good point about not voting for Bozo and engaged in reasonable conversation defending it. It not much compared to others, but it's more than I'm used to seeing.

The scummy part of Maniac is his voting behavior. He voted rdr because 3-way ties are fun and then voted me because he hadn't played with lfischl before.

Why did you find his point about ghug reasonable? You were scumreading ghug D1. What about Maniac's voting behavior is more scummy than when he voted for his top townread in your first game?

At its core Maniac's argument is that daykilling good town players D1 is usually bad because of the value that they bring. He sees ghug as a good town player and thus not a good DK D1. Yes, I know I scumread ghug D1. That doesn't mean I can't find an argument supporting not killing him to be reasonable. Do you disagree?

I'll answer your question regarding Maniac with my own. What actions could Maniac take that would make you seem him as scummy?

What do you think of that fact that ghug has made this exact same argument multiple games in a row, and yet started out this game by voting me (after he said last game that I was on a list of do-not-kill-early players)?

And I'm not going to answer your second question because I don't see how it possibly be relevant or help solve this game. You're definitely deflecting, and I can honestly think of no town motivation for you to ask me that.

[kgray]

##vote macca

Bunny and Donny probably aren't knowing teammates.

Oh, whoops. Ghug is conf!town now.

[Bonatogether]

Bunny and Donny probably aren't knowing teammates.

Oh, whoops. Ghug is conf!town now.

everyone is conf!town at this point

[ghug]

Ghug, is your town game more bland than your scum game in general?

Depends what you mean by bland.

I make more of an effort to check all the boxes as scum, which could come across as less bland, but I'm also less likely to do off-the-walls shit, which could come across as more bland.

What off-the-walls shit have you done this game?

I claiimed scum. I claimed my discard without reading the setup. I opened by voting for people I knew would be easily pissed off.

[kgray]

Last game VT were told if they were roleblocked so I expect that the answer to your question is no.

This is the entirety of your conversation?

Ask me anything!

Come back!

No, I've just been away for a little while and am working through the backlog of messages. Though I'll comply with your request. HR brought up a good point that damo outed himself to save me. Do you think that Damo takes that risk?

I want to hear your opinion on this. What does damo outing to prevent you from being a wagon tell you?

[Donny Dude]

Maniac has been a question mark for a few people; well at least two. There might be some more deserving wagons out there, but I am going to park the ##Vote Maniac for the insubstantial work. Post number 1 all the way through Post 25...just skimming the surface. Asking a question, hypothetical, but just there...not digging in the dirt.

That vote being what it is, I could also get behind a vote on Vecna, EMC, or Ezio.

What is a deserving wagon Hamilton?
I feel like Hamilton is going after lurkers on who to vote for. Just does not seem super solvy, just a lot of questions.

What makes you think that asking a lot of questions isn't solvey?

It can be, but I do this too where there are more questions than conclusions being made, but in this case some of his questions felt like they were answered and he asked them again.
I am voting to see how he responds to some pressure too as scum hamilton last game did not respond very well to pressure at all.

[ghug]

Why did you find his point about ghug reasonable? You were scumreading ghug D1. What about Maniac's voting behavior is more scummy than when he voted for his top townread in your first game?

At its core Maniac's argument is that daykilling good town players D1 is usually bad because of the value that they bring. He sees ghug as a good town player and thus not a good DK D1. Yes, I know I scumread ghug D1. That doesn't mean I can't find an argument supporting not killing him to be reasonable. Do you disagree?

I'll answer your question regarding Maniac with my own. What actions could Maniac take that would make you seem him as scummy?

What do you think of that fact that ghug has made this exact same argument multiple games in a row, and yet started out this game by voting me (after he said last game that I was on a list of do-not-kill-early players)?

And I'm not going to answer your second question because I don't see how it possibly be relevant or help solve this game. You're definitely deflecting, and I can honestly think of no town motivation for you to ask me that.

I, celaph, think that ghug ended up pushing wagons on lfischl and celaph.

[kgray]

Depends what you mean by bland.

I make more of an effort to check all the boxes as scum, which could come across as less bland, but I'm also less likely to do off-the-walls shit, which could come across as more bland.

What off-the-walls shit have you done this game?

I claiimed scum. I claimed my discard without reading the setup. I opened by voting for people I knew would be easily pissed off.

Easily pissed off? Moi??

I'm cool as a cucumber. I have no emotions.

[kgray]

Btw I forgot to say this yesterday, but completely counter-intuitively I have less time for this on weekends, so I will be a bit less active over the next two days and may miss out on some reading. That said, I see the celaph wagon is bigger now, and honestly I don't mind it. The main idea of proving cop scans seems pretty good to me. I will remain on ghug for now though.

Why?

Why what? Why will I be less active? Why do I not mind celaph wagon? Why am I staying on you? Assuming it's the third, you're still my top scumread, and I want to stick here and help keep your wagon a good size.

Why do you scumread ghug? You've been consistently shading him but I can't find a single concrete reason you've given to scumread him.

[ghug]

What off-the-walls shit have you done this game?

I claiimed scum. I claimed my discard without reading the setup. I opened by voting for people I knew would be easily pissed off.

Easily pissed off? Moi??

I'm cool as a cucumber. I have no emotions.

You're still complaining that I voted for you. It rattled you a bit, methinks.

[kgray]

Ghug, is your town game more bland than your scum game in general?

Depends what you mean by bland.

I make more of an effort to check all the boxes as scum, which could come across as less bland, but I'm also less likely to do off-the-walls shit, which could come across as more bland.

Having skimmed the your iso, I have moved you to a null/slight scum. ##vote Hamilton.
I believe the main factors that me scum read Ghug are mainly based on two d1 things. One was the kgray fearkill interaction and the way your votes were at eod. For the eod votes, I don't know if scum you goes hippity hoppity that late. I would expect slightly less movement if main wagons were town and you were scum. Since you were moving around, I think a defense would have come sooner than the vote on ezio if celaph were scum with you. I believe the last part is that I don't see as many jokes or trying to pocket as last game. Finally, I believe there is a factor of paranoia in my brain because of last game where I thought you were town.

It seems like you're assuming celaph is town in this analysis - is that true?

[kgray]

I claiimed scum. I claimed my discard without reading the setup. I opened by voting for people I knew would be easily pissed off.

Easily pissed off? Moi??

I'm cool as a cucumber. I have no emotions.

You're still complaining that I voted for you. It rattled you a bit, methinks.

Well considering that the recent games I've played with you you've consistently placed your D1 votes for people you don't like and have actively shot down wagons of people you respect, yeah. I was annoyed.

[Donny Dude]

Depends what you mean by bland.

I make more of an effort to check all the boxes as scum, which could come across as less bland, but I'm also less likely to do off-the-walls shit, which could come across as more bland.

Having skimmed the your iso, I have moved you to a null/slight scum. ##vote Hamilton.
I believe the main factors that me scum read Ghug are mainly based on two d1 things. One was the kgray fearkill interaction and the way your votes were at eod. For the eod votes, I don't know if scum you goes hippity hoppity that late. I would expect slightly less movement if main wagons were town and you were scum. Since you were moving around, I think a defense would have come sooner than the vote on ezio if celaph were scum with you. I believe the last part is that I don't see as many jokes or trying to pocket as last game. Finally, I believe there is a factor of paranoia in my brain because of last game where I thought you were town.

It seems like you're assuming celaph is town in this analysis - is that true?

Yes, though I was mostly looking at ghug and not celaph.

[ghug]

Easily pissed off? Moi??

I'm cool as a cucumber. I have no emotions.

You're still complaining that I voted for you. It rattled you a bit, methinks.

Well considering that the recent games I've played with you you've consistently placed your D1 votes for people you don't like and have actively shot down wagons of people you respect, yeah. I was annoyed.

There you have it

[kgray]

He is trending downwards D2 for this reason, but not as fast for me as the people voting him. I get the feeling that he is playing weird intentionally at the moment, though the question is obviously why. If I had to guess I think he's fishing for reactions around his roleblocked claim.

I don't understand what trending downwards means. You think he's becoming more scummy now? You were scumreading him D1 and then N1 you said you thought he was town because of his D1 votes. Are you saying you think he doesn't seem solvey still (or again?) and so his votes are less compelling reason to townread him?

What do you dislike about the people voting him? Which people, and is it only because they're voting ghug or for other reasons?

Yes, by trending downwards I meant that he was getting scummier. I should clarify that I don't particularly think that the people voting for ghug are getting scummier in my book, but rathar that their perception of ghug is worse than my perception of ghug (and getting worse at a faster rate, though that is more debatable).

At the start of D2 he wasn't solvey, no. And I was marking him as scummier because of it. His votes were still a reason to townread him, but the value of all non-mechanical information goes down the more of it there is.

I just don't see how the celaph I know admits that ghug isn't trying to solve this game but is somehow still more convinced that ghug is town because ghug didn't care much about whether confirmed town lfischl or town!celaph was the daykill?