Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction - GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[bozotheclown]

xorxes was wrong about me, the biggest question I have now is whether he was wrong about Espresso also.

Consider this sequence from D4:

For real, we got counterclaims? Neat

I’m trying to wrap my head around why there would be a counterclaim in this scenario and I’m not getting very far.

Guys, there is a possibility that Tracker is a fakeclaim role and both Espresso and Darg are scum and one is the Cow, and they have done this purposefully so that one of our town clears will blow themselves up on (likely) Darg.

Guys, there is a possibility that Tracker is a fakeclaim role and both Espresso and Darg are scum and one is the Cow, and they have done this purposefully so that one of our town clears will blow themselves up on (likely) Darg.

This is interesting.

The way I see it we have to lynch both EP and darg now. I don't see why scum ever makes this claim or counterclaim except to push someone deep. I think the most likely scenario is this is scum versus scum.

bo_sox and foodcoats, can you explain why you are not scum conspiring with Chaqa to get Espresso lynched along with dargorygel?

[bozotheclown]

Okay, here it is.

I am the ORACLE. Highly ironic, given my real life handsomeness, that I would have to play as such an ugly creature as the Anglerfish, but such is life.

I crumbed my role on page 50 when I mentioned Ceefax. Ceefax was a British television-based "teletext" information system, almost a precursor to some of the basic functions of the internet, but accessed via a television signal where appropriately equipped television sets could display up to 999 indexed, regularly updated pages of news, weather, sports, entertainment, cookery, listings, etc.

Ceefax was one of two rival UK teletext systems. The other system was called...

**ORACLE**

That was my crumb.

I also softed my role a couple of times, like on page 149 where I listed a bunch of roles in lower case, but I used an initial capital letter for "Oracle".

I am currently set to reveal Xorxes if I am killed.

What a waste of a power when I would be revealed D7.

What do you make of worcej softing Oracle?

@worcej, why did you soft Oracle?

I am currently actually set to reveal Bo_Sox, btw.

I just wanted to see how Xorxes would react.

I find it very hard to believe Jamie was really performing a reaction test with xorxes. What kind of reaction could being the oracle reveal cause when Jamie was at no risk of getting lynched? I think it is more likely he realized xorxes was a suspicious target for the reason xorxes pointed out.

[bozotheclown]

##VOTE Jamie

I found Jamie suspicious day 1 for town reading MoscowFleet as soon as MoscowFleet started posting, after Jamie had started a wagon on him.

On day 2, Jamie was quick to change his vote from Chaqa to emc as soon as Foxcastle started the wagon, despite this:

Here's where I am with my reads:

TOWN (strongest reads at the top)

Jamiet99uk
brainbomb (mechanically clear)
rdrivera2005
bozotheclown
ItsHosuke
Foxcastle
damo666
Percy Williams
worcej


NULL

bo_sox48
EspressoPatronum
Vaporwave
e.m.c^42

SCUM (in no particular order)

Chaqa
dargorygel
flash2015
foodcoats
xorxes

I think Jamie was bussing Chaqa, but ending up saving him D2 by helping to build the emc wagon.

D4, Jamie may have been trying to get the cow target killed with this:

Percy, Xorxes, Bo_Sox, Flash

Please vote for CHAQA

Also, I think it is too much of a coincidence that the post Jamie referenced as his oracle crumb could easily be pointed to as a crumb for other roles we know or suspect were scum roles.

[EspressoPatronum]

Hey bozo, would you go foodcoats or bo_sox instead?

[EspressoPatronum]

Xorxes brought up an interesting point about foodcoats and his unchanging scumread of xorxes. Town's reads are usually more fluid than that.

[Jamiet99uk]

RIP, Xorxes.

I don't know why you were still claiming "Jamie is scumreading me" right to the end, when I revised my read of you and discussed that with you openly in the thread - but I guess that will have to wait til EoG now.

I see I have some stuff from Bozo to respond to. Give me a moment and I shall do so.

I wonder where Bo_Sox disappeared to.

[bozotheclown]

When we combine/intersect vapor's RB, and his suggestion of flash...

Maybe those things point to our first scum.

##vote flash2015

wish it could be that easy, I'm not sure whether they would be so obvious

I mean they knew that I would point to flash instantly, I need more opinions on this

they might have owled my ass just in case I change direction and flash is town

this can be seen from various angles

Vapor may have been right about this, the mafia may have believed he was the tracker, but might target someone other than flash. Or, they thought they could frame flash if Vapor was the tracker, or frame Vapor is he was not the tracker.

[bozotheclown]

Hey bozo, would you go foodcoats or bo_sox instead?

I would like to hear their response to my question to them.

[Jamiet99uk]

Oh look Vecna scumreads me just like he does every single game.

I love old fashioned nostalgic things. Ceefax, Angel Delight, Monster Munch, shell suits, Vecna scumreading me, Watney's Red Barrel, Crackerjack.... ah, the warm fuzzy memories of my youth.

Lover, Oracle, Divine Presence, okapi, Tracker?

An okapi is a bit monstrous, isn't it?

@Jamie: Do you acknowledge that this post could be pointed to as crumbing roles we now know belonged to the mafia?

My only intention was to use Ceefax to crumb my actual role. That's why it's first on the list. The idea that "Shell Suit" and "Monster Munch" could be serious Okapi or Tracker claims is laughable. I don't know how to take that seriously. As for using the word "love" as a crumb, I don't think so either, because if just saying "love" is a crumb, then on D1 apparently Xorxes, Worcej, Brainbomb, and Vapor all crumbed lover as well.

So, no, I don't acknowledge that shit at all.

[Jamiet99uk]

The only reason I wouldn't point to that as an attempt to frame me is that it mostly came from Xorxes and he was just misguided town, as I now know.

[Jamiet99uk]

I find it very hard to believe Jamie was really performing a reaction test with xorxes. What kind of reaction could being the oracle reveal cause when Jamie was at no risk of getting lynched? I think it is more likely he realized xorxes was a suspicious target for the reason xorxes pointed out.

I can only repeat myself; I was telling the truth. I was never set to reveal Xorxes, but I chose to claim I was to see how he responded - partly because at the time I did not believe his IC claim.

[Jamiet99uk]

I found Jamie suspicious day 1 for town reading MoscowFleet as soon as MoscowFleet started posting, after Jamie had started a wagon on him.

I literally said I was voting Moscow as a policy lynch / pressure vote. I literally said if he upped his participation I'd move off him. He did, so I responded as I had said I would. If you find this suspect I don't know what else to tell you.

[foodcoats]

bo_sox and foodcoats, can you explain why you are not scum conspiring with Chaqa to get Espresso lynched along with dargorygel?

I would hope not to be so transparently coordinated with my team if I were scum.

Just to reiterate... the reason I think Espresso is scum is because a TvS tracker claim/counterclaim has no benefit to scum whatsoever. If we had lynched Espresso and they flipped town, we'd have lynched darg. A 1 for 1 trade seems negative value for scum.

That is why I asked earlier if darg and Chaqa are known to be bad players. Call me an asshole, but the only way I can think the tracker thing was TvS is if the scum team is dumb. But, at the time the claim was made, we had mislynched twice in a row, they had a cow, and it is at least possible that EP is the human. I mean, look at the darg/EP wagons, they were 9-3!! darg did a great job of looking scummy AF. Doing that push there could've been their strategy to close the game.

[foodcoats]

##VOTE EspressoPatronum

[foodcoats]

I will say, that I have to re-read the thread both with scum!EP in mind and will do my best to give town!EP the benefit of the doubt. There are some other players that I have to look more deeply at.

What do you think of voting-by-survey?

[bozotheclown]

bo_sox and foodcoats, can you explain why you are not scum conspiring with Chaqa to get Espresso lynched along with dargorygel?

I would hope not to be so transparently coordinated with my team if I were scum.

Just to reiterate... the reason I think Espresso is scum is because a TvS tracker claim/counterclaim has no benefit to scum whatsoever. If we had lynched Espresso and they flipped town, we'd have lynched darg. A 1 for 1 trade seems negative value for scum.

That is why I asked earlier if darg and Chaqa are known to be bad players. Call me an asshole, but the only way I can think the tracker thing was TvS is if the scum team is dumb. But, at the time the claim was made, we had mislynched twice in a row, they had a cow, and it is at least possible that EP is the human. I mean, look at the darg/EP wagons, they were 9-3!! darg did a great job of looking scummy AF. Doing that push there could've been their strategy to close the game.

I agree dargorygel was obviously going to be lynched first, but what if the plan was to get both lynched? Chaqa was the first to bring up the 2 scum theory, why do you think he would bring it up if both were scum?

[bozotheclown]

I will say, that I have to re-read the thread both with scum!EP in mind and will do my best to give town!EP the benefit of the doubt. There are some other players that I have to look more deeply at.

What do you think of voting-by-survey?

I am OK with a survey, but I would not want to commit to basing the lynch on the results.

[foodcoats]

A couple of quotes from D3 that caught my eye...

Things I kinda liked in the overnight:
worcej's opening comment of his drunk tirade.  Mechanics vs. motivation.  Worcej, do you read Agatha Christie? 
Jamie's espresso deduction.  Prime Jamie stuff.
But today's wagons are Vaporwave or bozo.
Both of which are swimming in the scumpool.
Vapor's expression of his inner soul reminds me a lot of MY defenses when I have been scum.  Although I am unsure of what aTe stands for.
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

Darg juxtaposing jamie and espresso... it seems that dargo is suggesting espresso is scum and jamie town. My instinct is that if espresso is scum darg wouldn't pump jamie's analysis. But if jaime is scum I also feel like darg wouldn't so easily pat them on the back. Suggesting they're both town. Or maybe both scum, but that seems... far out.

The vapor vs bozo thing I don't really know what to make of except it was a weak way to vote vapor.

I can believe EspressoPatronum thought all of the mafia roles were in play.

The only reason the mafia would use the RB would be to try to RB the tracker.  However, using the RB doubles the chance of the tracker tracking a scum if the they RB the wrong player.  Did the mafia really believe Vapor is the tracker, and that he was going to track flash, and if so, that flash is the killer?  I think it is more likely the RB claim is fake.

##VOTE Vaporwave

I was wondering who had started this argument that the RB claim was fake. Flash was first to vote for vapor because vapor appeared (to flash) to retract the tracker claim, but bozo advanced the "RB is fake" thing. Why would the RB be fake? Because of slightly higher odds of mafia maybe being tracked? It's incredibly circuitous reasoning to me.

I do scumread Vapor, but the people on his wagon are, besides worcej, not town reads of mine in general, which makes me very hesitant to join that wagon. Either I'm way off, or they're bussing hard, or Vapor isn't scum after all.

I townread worcej, so that wagon is also not one I'm crazy for, but 2/3 of the town clears are voting for him.

I may end up following Tom Brainbombadil and xorxes over to Dargo.

This one's really interesting. Everyone on worcej was town and so was worcej. So were braintom and xorxes, and dargo was scum. Chaqa is obviously bussing people on the vapor wagon. Unfortunately that's like almost the whole player group now.... flash bozo bo espresso jaime.

[foodcoats]

bo_sox and foodcoats, can you explain why you are not scum conspiring with Chaqa to get Espresso lynched along with dargorygel?

I would hope not to be so transparently coordinated with my team if I were scum.

Just to reiterate... the reason I think Espresso is scum is because a TvS tracker claim/counterclaim has no benefit to scum whatsoever. If we had lynched Espresso and they flipped town, we'd have lynched darg. A 1 for 1 trade seems negative value for scum.

That is why I asked earlier if darg and Chaqa are known to be bad players. Call me an asshole, but the only way I can think the tracker thing was TvS is if the scum team is dumb. But, at the time the claim was made, we had mislynched twice in a row, they had a cow, and it is at least possible that EP is the human. I mean, look at the darg/EP wagons, they were 9-3!! darg did a great job of looking scummy AF. Doing that push there could've been their strategy to close the game.

I agree dargorygel was obviously going to be lynched first, but what if the plan was to get both lynched? Chaqa was the first to bring up the 2 scum theory, why do you think he would bring it up if both were scum?

That is a fair point... I'm trying to read more Chaqa and darg to understand how they were playing.

[foodcoats]

There was also a lot of jaime vs espresso on D3. If they're both scum they were bussing the crap out of each other. But I reckon it is not darg chaqa espresso jaime xxxx.