Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction - GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[EspressoPatronum]

I think that the only way this will end will be in lynching both of them, whether they're TvS or SvS.

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

[Jamiet99uk]

What are your thoughts now that it has been pointed out that worcej has been softing Oracle? Do you buy his explanation that he was trying to draw the NK with that soft?

It doesn't strike me as 100% convincing. However, once again, why would scum worcej softclaim a role that wasn't on the scum's fakeclaim list?

Why would town!worcej softclaim Oracle though? You usually hate it when people lie. Why are you so forgiving with him, especially as it involves your own role?

I probably would have been annoyed by it if I had noticed it at the time, but I did not. Can you remind me what page it was on? I need to do a re-read of these events, I think. I'm curious as to why I missed it.

[Jamiet99uk]

I think that the only way this will end will be in lynching both of them, whether they're TvS or SvS.

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

That.... is a fair observation.

[xorxes]

I think that the only way this will end will be in lynching both of them, whether they're TvS or SvS.

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

He can only do it for himself, not conclusively for the rest of town.

But if you want to propose a strategy of delaying the decision of lynching between you two, who should we lynch and why?

[EspressoPatronum]

I get the SvS concerns...
but it's just insulting to see people voting me bcz they think darg is the real tracker.

Why doesn't tracker!darg share his N2 tracks. He literally made no mention of Percy on D3. The Vecna death N1 was out of left field, so it was obvious they were PR hunting. If darg crumbed as much as he claims, he should have been terrified on heading into N3. Dying without sharing your info is terrible for town. Why wouldn't tracker!darg do something to stop that?

He had the smokescreen, he had the opportunity for reads lists. He could have done anything, but instead he did nothing.

Now look at my ISO and tell me I did nothing.

[xorxes]

It doesn't strike me as 100% convincing. However, once again, why would scum worcej softclaim a role that wasn't on the scum's fakeclaim list?

Why would town!worcej softclaim Oracle though? You usually hate it when people lie. Why are you so forgiving with him, especially as it involves your own role?

I probably would have been annoyed by it if I had noticed it at the time, but I did not. Can you remind me what page it was on? I need to do a re-read of these events, I think. I'm curious as to why I missed it.

I don't know where it is, shouldn't you be asking him instead of me? I only noticed when he reported having done it. Search for "oh shit". (If you only search for "shit" you get tons of posts.)

[EspressoPatronum]

I think that the only way this will end will be in lynching both of them, whether they're TvS or SvS.

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

He can only do it for himself, not conclusively for the rest of town.

But if you want to propose a strategy of delaying the decision of lynching between you two, who should we lynch and why?

I don't want to delay. I want you guys to lynch darg then rolecop me. If it works, great; if it doesn't, I'll probably get lynched.

[xorxes]

He had the smokescreen, he had the opportunity for reads lists. He could have done anything, but instead he did nothing.

Now look at my ISO and tell me I did nothing.

You don't need to convince me that dargo is scum. You arguing against him probably won't convince anyone who isn't already convinced. You'd be more convincing as town if you found dargo's remaining team. It should be three out of these eight:

bozo
bo_sox
flash
foodcoats
Jamiet
Percy
worcej
xorxes

Surely you have some ideas. Some townreads you can eliminate, some stronger scumread you can find connections with dargo and/or Chaqa?

[EspressoPatronum]

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

He can only do it for himself, not conclusively for the rest of town.

But if you want to propose a strategy of delaying the decision of lynching between you two, who should we lynch and why?

I don't want to delay. I want you guys to lynch darg then rolecop me. If it works, great; if it doesn't, I'll probably get lynched.

Fwiw, this is a pretty lofty goal. If Percy is town, I see no scenario in which scum leaves him alive.

If Percy survives, scum either has no idea what's going on or he's scum.

But hey, you never know

[xorxes]

Says the apparent rolecop who can absolutely put an end to it if it's TvS.

He can only do it for himself, not conclusively for the rest of town.

But if you want to propose a strategy of delaying the decision of lynching between you two, who should we lynch and why?

I don't want to delay. I want you guys to lynch darg then rolecop me. If it works, great; if it doesn't, I'll probably get lynched.

Rolecopping you does not give us more or less info than rolecopping any other unclear. I don't want to offer rolecop suggestions to Percy until the night though.

[EspressoPatronum]

He had the smokescreen, he had the opportunity for reads lists. He could have done anything, but instead he did nothing.

Now look at my ISO and tell me I did nothing.

You don't need to convince me that dargo is scum. You arguing against him probably won't convince anyone who isn't already convinced. You'd be more convincing as town if you found dargo's remaining team. It should be three out of these eight:

bozo
bo_sox
flash
foodcoats
Jamiet
Percy
worcej
xorxes

Surely you have some ideas. Some townreads you can eliminate, some stronger scumread you can find connections with dargo and/or Chaqa?

On mobile and gotta go soon. Here goes:

The scum team (in order)
Darg, foodcoats, bo_sox, bozo|worcej|Jamiet

Town:
All the clears
Percy/xorxes pending confirmation
Flash by POE

Scum:
Listed above. Mostly bcz DP clues, some because of reads.

The last 3:
Bozo if scum is bussing him
Worcej because he understands math but can't understand that darg is scum
Jamiet because of the weird crumb thing and various other happenings.

I can't decide which one. I'm leaning toward bozo.

[xorxes]

@Espresso, I would be particularly interested in your take on worcej and on Jamiet, but also on the rest of the unclears.

[xorxes]

On mobile and gotta go soon. Here goes:

The scum team (in order)
Darg, foodcoats, bo_sox, bozo|worcej|Jamiet

Town:
All the clears
Percy/xorxes pending confirmation
Flash by POE

Scum:
Listed above. Mostly bcz DP clues, some because of reads.

The last 3:
Bozo if scum is bussing him
Worcej because he understands math but can't understand that darg is scum
Jamiet because of the weird crumb thing and various other happenings.

I can't decide which one. I'm leaning toward bozo.

Only one out of bozo|worcej|Jamiet? Why so certain about foodcoats and bo_sox then? What do you think of worcej softing Oracle?

[Jamiet99uk]

Why would town!worcej softclaim Oracle though? You usually hate it when people lie. Why are you so forgiving with him, especially as it involves your own role?

I probably would have been annoyed by it if I had noticed it at the time, but I did not. Can you remind me what page it was on? I need to do a re-read of these events, I think. I'm curious as to why I missed it.

I don't know where it is, shouldn't you be asking him instead of me? I only noticed when he reported having done it. Search for "oh shit". (If you only search for "shit" you get tons of posts.)

I am asking you because you are the one constantly nagging and hectoring me about it.

[xorxes]

I probably would have been annoyed by it if I had noticed it at the time, but I did not. Can you remind me what page it was on? I need to do a re-read of these events, I think. I'm curious as to why I missed it.

I don't know where it is, shouldn't you be asking him instead of me? I only noticed when he reported having done it. Search for "oh shit". (If you only search for "shit" you get tons of posts.)

I am asking you because you are the one constantly nagging and hectoring me about it.

The fact that you don't seem to care much about it is telling. If you found someone who has crumbed Innocent Child I would be very happy and would want to investigate further.

[EspressoPatronum]

On mobile and gotta go soon. Here goes:

The scum team (in order)
Darg, foodcoats, bo_sox, bozo|worcej|Jamiet

Town:
All the clears
Percy/xorxes pending confirmation
Flash by POE

Scum:
Listed above. Mostly bcz DP clues, some because of reads.

The last 3:
Bozo if scum is bussing him
Worcej because he understands math but can't understand that darg is scum
Jamiet because of the weird crumb thing and various other happenings.

I can't decide which one. I'm leaning toward bozo.

Only one out of bozo|worcej|Jamiet? Why so certain about foodcoats and bo_sox then? What do you think of worcej softing Oracle?

I had worcej as pretty likely town before the Oracle stuff. Maybe I'm just misremembering the day, but I honestly don't think Chaqa was going to die without worcej. And given that Chaqa was going for endgame (i.e. bussing at least one teammate, maybe two) and getting townread by many, I don't see why scum!worcej throws that all away. It's definitely possible, but I don't see why. The Oracle stuff made me scale back the read.

Jamiet is hard to read because he's unpredictable. Going from my memory of the thread, his reads feel all over the place and he's being active. He's in my scum list because of the weird DP thing, his obsession with EP! janitor, and the potential for multiple crumbs. The latter isn't as conclusive for me as it is for the rest of the town bcz I know tracker isn't in the scum pile. Knowing this, and assuming the crumb theory is right, then I have to either assume scum was planning to CC tracker from the beginning (verrrry unlikely) or that Jamiet accidentally crumbed a bunch of roles.

Bozo because Chaqa focused on bozo and so did darg. Either scum decided to coordinate an effort against town!bozo or bozo is scum. Given Chaqa's penchant for bussing (re darg), I think bozo is being bussed.

I get that you can't confirm a lot of that information until I'm confirmed. I'm just putting it all down so you have it when/if you need it.

[EspressoPatronum]

I really need to do a bo_sox and foodcoats iso, but I have them as a team because they seem like they're pushing the same agenda. I'm getting teamy vibes from them + those vibes line up with scum goals.

[bozotheclown]

On mobile and gotta go soon. Here goes:

The scum team (in order)
Darg, foodcoats, bo_sox, bozo|worcej|Jamiet

Town:
All the clears
Percy/xorxes pending confirmation
Flash by POE

Scum:
Listed above. Mostly bcz DP clues, some because of reads.

The last 3:
Bozo if scum is bussing him
Worcej because he understands math but can't understand that darg is scum
Jamiet because of the weird crumb thing and various other happenings.

I can't decide which one. I'm leaning toward bozo.

Only one out of bozo|worcej|Jamiet? Why so certain about foodcoats and bo_sox then? What do you think of worcej softing Oracle?

I had worcej as pretty likely town before the Oracle stuff. Maybe I'm just misremembering the day, but I honestly don't think Chaqa was going to die without worcej. And given that Chaqa was going for endgame (i.e. bussing at least one teammate, maybe two) and getting townread by many, I don't see why scum!worcej throws that all away. It's definitely possible, but I don't see why. The Oracle stuff made me scale back the read.

Jamiet is hard to read because he's unpredictable. Going from my memory of the thread, his reads feel all over the place and he's being active. He's in my scum list because of the weird DP thing, his obsession with EP! janitor, and the potential for multiple crumbs. The latter isn't as conclusive for me as it is for the rest of the town bcz I know tracker isn't in the scum pile. Knowing this, and assuming the crumb theory is right, then I have to either assume scum was planning to CC tracker from the beginning (verrrry unlikely) or that Jamiet accidentally crumbed a bunch of roles.

Bozo because Chaqa focused on bozo and so did darg. Either scum decided to coordinate an effort against town!bozo or bozo is scum. Given Chaqa's penchant for bussing (re darg), I think bozo is being bussed.

I get that you can't confirm a lot of that information until I'm confirmed. I'm just putting it all down so you have it when/if you need it.

When and how did dargorygel focus on me?

[worcej]

You believe one of them is town?

Between EP and Darg? Yes I do think one of them is town.

Because you indicated he fell into your reaction test trap. I was wondering what you took out of that.

What does it matter what I took about that? Why are you distracting from the problem at hand?

Verifying my role is trivial, it's just a matter of waiting. No use spending more than two seconds thinking about that.

Verifying Percy's role might be tricky but it's something that we can do much more effectively tomorrow: either Mafia solves it for us and we don't need to do anything, or else we will have a lot more information to decide (his choice of scan and its result). No use spending much time thinking about that now.

Getting Darg/EP right is important. My thinking is that we will get it right no matter what, but if you think otherwise then examining who they might be partnered with is very important to decide which one is the scum, don't you agree?

Your role verification is important and while yes it is a matter of waiting, we have definitely gotten enough time to ensure we get you right. You should be the lynch candidate for D7 until the mod reveal comes in. Once that is done and we've solved the situation with EP, Darg, Percy, and you - then we are left with Food, flash, Bo_, Jamie, bozo and myself.

To catch scum, I do not just focus on partners or pairs - that usually is a fruitless case because busing is actually commonly done on this site and you cannot really look at 'who makes sense as a team' to catch scum. IMHO, scum teams have gotten smart to have some people distance themselves and other scum engage each other. Just focusing on one pair blinds you to the realities of the situations around you.

Case and point: xorxes and Jamie could easily be a pair based off their banter in the thread. It's noise that is irrelevant and more a distraction than focusing on the problem in front of us.

Is that a valuable read to anyone else right now? Probably not - again, focus should be on darg and EP, not these stupid side conversations xorxes is trying to force.

And honestly xorxes, I am leit starting to scum you based on your noise making with little purpose and conviction behind it. So I am glad at least you're going to be figured out on D7.

[Jamiet99uk]

I don't know where it is, shouldn't you be asking him instead of me? I only noticed when he reported having done it. Search for "oh shit". (If you only search for "shit" you get tons of posts.)

I am asking you because you are the one constantly nagging and hectoring me about it.

The fact that you don't seem to care much about it is telling. If you found someone who has crumbed Innocent Child I would be very happy and would want to investigate further.

The fact you're so interested in it, and apparently know what phrase Worcej used, and yet you apparently still can't find the post, reveals how easy it must have been for us to miss it in the first place.