MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[kgray]

Yeah, I agree with this.

I felt like Maniac was scum until halfway through day 2, but since then he's either been weird (towny) or annoying in a way that makes me want to scumread him (also towny).

Why'd you agree with me that he was being scummy N2 then?

Typo'd

You said "we finally agree on something" but what you really meant was "no I don't agree with you"?

[ghug]

Why'd you agree with me that he was being scummy N2 then?

Typo'd

You said "we finally agree on something" but what you really meant was "no I don't agree with you"?

Oh no I did agree with you, but with some distance, I'm back to thinking that the objectionableness is a towntell.

[kgray]

Typo'd

You said "we finally agree on something" but what you really meant was "no I don't agree with you"?

Oh no I did agree with you, but with some distance, I'm back to thinking that the objectionableness is a towntell.

This sounds like scummy nonsense ghug.

[brainbomb]

I wanna talk to maniac, im not convinced of wrongdoing

[ghug]

You said "we finally agree on something" but what you really meant was "no I don't agree with you"?

Oh no I did agree with you, but with some distance, I'm back to thinking that the objectionableness is a towntell.

This sounds like scummy nonsense ghug.

This is how I have read Maniac correctly in several recent games.

[Hamilton Brian]

SO I will really need some help with a tl;dr around the end of N2 (I've got the gist but looking for any things that I've missed that are important) and D3. The return to work totally effed me up so I am way behind.

[kgray]

Oh no I did agree with you, but with some distance, I'm back to thinking that the objectionableness is a towntell.

This sounds like scummy nonsense ghug.

This is how I have read Maniac correctly in several recent games.

No, YOU sound like scummy nonsense.

[ghug]

This sounds like scummy nonsense ghug.

This is how I have read Maniac correctly in several recent games.

No, YOU sound like scummy nonsense.

I got that. What you're calling scummy nonsense I'm calling a tested method of reading a player.

[celaph]

So basically, you listed what you thought people would do with roles based on your opinions.

No, I considered what the best strategy would be for each faction, and I put out reasons. No one has pointed out anything wrong with it ("scum would do x, but you said y"). Everyone who has gone against it has done nothing more than say "it's dumb and entirely opinion-based."

Then you listed your opinions with no research on what people were doing. Then you didn’t even match impressions to role guesses because that’s all just opinion anyways.

I reread 6 or 7 players to get a better feel for them, and I already stated that the best play for the player is to shift your town meta towards the best play for the faction.

You just put out something to seem like you were solving, but in fact demonstrated you’d done no reading at all?

This is absolute bullshit and you know it. I've been reading the thread, I've been posting, I've been putting out my ideas (compare my posting the last 2 games to this one), so there's absolutely no basis for you to claim that I've done no reading.

Particularly curious about the line "I already stated that the best play for the player is to shift your town meta towards the best play for the faction". For one, why are you assuming that players can shift their play that precisely? I think a lot of reads are based on assumptions that players can't shift their play that well (see basically everyone's read on HB).

Secondly, if you could notice that someone is being more solve-y than they are as town, wouldn't that be a great reason to not act more solve-y and instead just try to imitate your town meta perfectly? Scumreading someone for being townier than usual sounds weird at first, but it's what I was doing with Maniac at the start of D2 and it's what you're trying to do now.

Your approach to finding SK is in itself a great reason for SK to not act like you expect them to.

[kgray]

This is how I have read Maniac correctly in several recent games.

No, YOU sound like scummy nonsense.

I got that. What you're calling scummy nonsense I'm calling a tested method of reading a player.

That's not what I'm talking about. I understand the concept of townreading people for acting scummy.

Why did you say "finally we agree on something" like you could actually support what I was saying for once if you didn't really think that? That was N2, when I specifically said that Maniac's play that phase was bugging me. Now you're saying you thought he was towny since halfway through D2, and that you were agreeing with me with "distance" but that's clearly not what you implied.

[celaph]

Brain, when maniac has been scum ,does he sort of cleans up his act so to speak?

yea pretty much. Ill link you his most famous scum outing where we caught him

Yeah, I agree with this.

I felt like Maniac was scum until halfway through day 2, but since then he's either been weird (towny) or annoying in a way that makes me want to townread him (also towny).

Do you think that Maniac would be self-aware enough of how he is perceived to change behavior mid-D2? He wasn't objectionable early and was scumread for it and so changed his behavior to better suit expectations.

[kgray]

Oh, wait. Did you mean "with distance" as in "now, looking back at it"?

[ghug]

No, YOU sound like scummy nonsense.

I got that. What you're calling scummy nonsense I'm calling a tested method of reading a player.

That's not what I'm talking about. I understand the concept of townreading people for acting scummy.

Why did you say "finally we agree on something" like you could actually support what I was saying for once if you didn't really think that? That was N2, when I specifically said that Maniac's play that phase was bugging me. Now you're saying you thought he was towny since halfway through D2, and that you were agreeing with me with "distance" but that's clearly not what you implied.

I agreed with you. My opinion has since evolved as the emotional reaction has waned and I've thought about it further. What's so weird about that?

What does "that you were agreeing with me with 'distance'" even mean?

[ghug]

Oh, wait. Did you mean "with distance" as in "now, looking back at it"?

Ok yeah that's where we lost each other.

[celaph]

Bob is starting to sound more and more fake.

Yeah, I'm going to agree with you on that. Forced.

Ah yes, my bad. I apologise. WEEEEEEE WEEEEEEE WOOOOOOO we got the aliennnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!! I AM UNRESERVEDLY HAPPY ABOUT THIS RESULT!!!!!!

I like this response. Sounds like town annoyed at getting scumread for something they find stupid.

[brainbomb]

the thing that really just troubles me about maniac is the the last 2 games hes just is so resigned to the idea of being eliminated he would miss end of days, barely even play, say nothing prolific even after multiple attempts to kill him. He just plays mafia in some other dimension called Gorlax where they do british stuff and goto tesco and then get shot stealing buckets of chicken.

Okay my imagination went wild trying to think of maniac as a secret alien actually living among us.

I always saw him as my favorite player. I wanted to be like him and carry that same level of respect and integrity. I always loved his quirky nature and how he just felt very mentally awakened to a deeper understanding of the game and how to interpret motive.

Maniac could look at one post of mine and just like vecna, could insta diagnose my alignment effortlessly

[ghug]

yea pretty much. Ill link you his most famous scum outing where we caught him

Yeah, I agree with this.

I felt like Maniac was scum until halfway through day 2, but since then he's either been weird (towny) or annoying in a way that makes me want to townread him (also towny).

Do you think that Maniac would be self-aware enough of how he is perceived to change behavior mid-D2? He wasn't objectionable early and was scumread for it and so changed his behavior to better suit expectations.

It's definitely possible, but being objectionable to get townread is something very few people try, because it also gets you scumread.

[brainbomb]

whats weird is I can read jasnah and think that she was scum wiith HR being advised

and I can read jasnah and think she was scum who hated being scum with HR especially when he refuses to push ezio when she wanted him too

ive never seen a read where i could buy it as being both ways

[brainbomb]

jasnah rushes to say HR deserves to be townread just for doing some VCA, and im not sure she even understood a word in that drivel

[kgray]

Oh, wait. Did you mean "with distance" as in "now, looking back at it"?

Ok yeah that's where we lost each other.

Yeah. So you think, now, that Maniac lecturing and blaming people is town-indicative for him?