MAFIA XXXVI: ODDJOB'S REVENGE

[rdrivera2005]

Thanks. FWIW, the yavu meta question centers on Xorxes's wall -- does he play similarly as scum and town? Xorxes said yes, RdRivera said no, and TrPrado's question implied a yes but weakly.

I think you should ask others, but Yav answer himself pretty well, he was obviously town in his first game, fake claimed cop as town on second, was obvious cop on third and was so obviously scum on fourth that got lynched on D1. And I was his teammate in this one. But I looked back this game and have to say that I was mistaken and Xorxes didn't play on it, so he could not know. Anyway, I am keeping my vote for now.

[Stressedlines]

This is my first game.so I am.simply trying to.absorb what is going on

[Stressedlines]

This is my first game.so I am.simply trying to.absorb what is going on

[RagingIke297]

This is my first game.so I am.simply trying to.absorb what is going on

What have you seen thus far? Do you have any questions for anyone?

[Jamiet99uk]

Sorry Yavuzovic I didn't realise you'd already played so many games as that. Time flies.

[Tom Bombadil]

Vote Count 1.2

TrPrado (3): Telamor, peterlund, DrCJG
Ezio (3): dargorygel, bozotheclown, teacher2
Ghug (3): Chaqa, yavuzovic, snowy801
Xorxes (2): rdrivera2005, TrPrado
Snowy801 (1): ghug
Bozotheclown (1): thamrick
RagingIke297 (1): Balki Bartokomous
Telamor (1): xorxes
Reedeer1 (1): DemonRHK
Thamrick (1): RagingIke297
Peterlund (1): Jamiet99uk

No-Lynch (1): Ezio

Reedeer1 and Stressedlines have yet to vote. All players must vote before EOD or they will be replaced.

Currently nobody is set to be lynched

There are 9.5 hours left in D1

[yavuzovic]

This is my first game.so I am.simply trying to.absorb what is going on

Early bird catches the worm!

[yavuzovic]

Sorry Yavuzovic I didn't realise you'd already played so many games as that. Time flies.

Don't worry, my first game was M33 and best GM was the GM of M33. Still haven't seen someone better. (Maybe I didn't look at the mirror for a long time.)

[yavuzovic]

I would rather to lynch ghug but I may vote Ezio if that will be needed. Not a scumread but DEATH TO LURKERS!.
Xorxes and Prado are null for me, they're neither scummy nor towny, maybe snowy was a bit weird at starting.

[dargorygel]

I like this D1 list thing. I would encourage everyone to do it. Information is what drives this economy, and even early lists provide information.


Balki Bartokomous. I get nothing but town from Balki. Yes, he tunneled on Ike, but that was just doing what we all wanted to do. He suggested and started the D1 read thing this game, and that gets towncred.

Bozotheclown. Bozo is usually more active. Maybe just something in RL but lately scum has tried to win by hiding at first. (By not giving or really seeking information.) This gives Bozo a boring scum lean.

Chaqa. Come on, Chaqa. Welcome back, but don’t be so absent.

Dargorygel. Far too old to be playing a kid’s game. But so towny that we oughta call him Dargoville.

DemonRHK. This is town Demon. Pointed, specific, and awake.

DrCJG. No bad newbie vibes. We often end up lynching newbies because they talk don’t know how to. But the Dr seems ok. Null.

Ezio. Ezio lurking as scum seems like what Ezio does. Not responding to pressure though confuses me. Ezio is better than that. Or maybe he is not responding to pressure because he thinks that we will realize that he is better than that, and give him a coast through D1. Scum.

Ghug. This seems like distracted ghug. He seems to respond only to what was recently written OR was written a lot about. Strangely, this makes him seem like town to me. Scum ghug is more involved.

Jamiet99uk. A small thing… but Jamie’s brief comment about reads shifting was townie to me. I actually participated in some D1 humor. This also is townie for Jamie, it seems to me.

Peterlund. If someone remembers (or has the time to re-read) previous games please correct me. But I think that Peter applying his rapier wit to individual statements made by others is very SCUM Peter. But here, he is vague and sitting in the corner watching and eating lutefisk. Town.

RagingIke297. Note to self. Check his interactions WITH others (other than Balki and about Thamrick.) I always read Ike scum on D1 and today is no exception. His decision to ‘step into’ the role of Big Talkers seems townie. But what he says doesn’t seem big. Maybe quantity… but not quality? Scum.

Rdrivera2005. 90% chance of scum in his forecast. Rdr always rolls scum. But he hasn’t presented anything that gives a reaction, here. Null.

Reedeer1. No reaction, really. Seems more lurky than usual.

Snowy801. Snowy’s meta depends on what he had for breakfast. If feels like he isn’t reading anything, but jumping in and dropping some comments in this game. Snowy thinks he is VERY clever, and so this reads slightly scummy to me. He is trying to look like scum. I am in danger of WIFOM with snowy. But then I usually am.

Stressedlines. Not here.

Teacher2. Big burst of writing today. I like it. Townlean.

Telamor. One posters at this point usually give me a scumsense. Newbie, though… and I am tired of lynching newbies.

Thamrick. WAY too quiet. But another scum lurking? Would they say in the QT, “most of us lurk? Because lurking has been working SO well in past games?” Maybe… quiet scum.

TrPrado. Ultimately Null. But he balances between two events. I liked his reaction to Jamie’s question about Prado’s wagon. Seemed nicely town. But I did NOT like his feeling of ‘buddying’ by xorxes.
Xorxes wasn’t buddying him. So the paranoia (?) seems scummish.

Xorxes. This seems like erudite xorxes to me. He engages, answers, drives, and doesn’t seem angry about it. Town.

Yavuzovic. I am null on Yavu. His play, to me, is ALWAYS all over the place. His best game (as he states it) WAS the last game when he was scum, but didn’t seem like it. He is conversational. And does NOT avoid other’s glances. Maybe null to town.

Too much meta in my reads.

I won’t be on much today. Wednesday is always one of my two big work days.

[ghug]

##vote Ike

It's time to start thinking about real wagons and I'm not really getting scum vibes from any of our multiple vote haves except for that asshole ghug.

[DrCJG]

RHK, thank you for asking my peter bot question.

Always happy to see what someone is thinking, I look forward to seeing your thoughts D2 when we have a little more "concrete" information to analyze and I really look forward to looking back at these notes to see what you were thinking at this point. But, a couple things struck me (in your list and others at this point) that I would like to dig deeper into and I would love to get your (and anyone else's) follow up on them.

- Ghug: I originally felt it was a little strange that he really just seemed to shrug them off... but I have really liked some recent comments supporting his decision to largely not defend himself as more of a townish. I agree that Xorxes list felt more forced than yours... but, I think you and Ghug may be biased by already having a scumlean towards him...

-Xorxes... while his list is mostly meta/information, I feel like that's most of the information he has ... and he just seemed a little overly friendly with TrPrado it seems a little premature to call it buddying... I don't place him worse than Null

- Yaz has become less and less "solvey" to me... I think I have been a little bias in giving him a townlean because I have felt Ghug has seemed off and not defending himself... but yaz's reasoning for jumping on Ghug was vague, I questioned him on it (p. 7) and he gave a vague response and ever sense he has posted largely pro Ghug posts, but continued to state he wants to vote Ghug... Yaz you ready to provide any more reasoning?

- TrPrado - my feelings of a scumlean for Ghug and TrPrado bred off each other and I feel I may need to reevaluate... I didnt like his reaction to Ike... and as I said I dont agree with the push on Xorxes... I am open to some positive examples to help me move off of TrPrado.

- And fwiw, I don't think I "promised active questions" in fact I believe I stated that I may be slow to start asking questions, but happy to try and answer any... In the closest games I have played (Avalon/BSG) I normally take a very active role in talking through vote results and questioning choices, but those games don't really have as much of a "D1" where there is so little concrete information, so I planned (and likely still will for the rest of the day) to be a little less active in questioning while I learn the meta of mafia.

(Also as I am writing this I just got an assignment dropped on my desk, so 1) sorry for a sloppy post; 2) if you have any shout outs to me, right my name in big letters otherwise I may be lurking for a good part of the day)

[TrPrado]

@anyone, is is too hard to read my name? Everybody is pronouncing it wrong.

Since yesterday ghug contributed to game good, at least he tried, but I will keep my vote on him because he didn't defend himself - even when he was set to be lynched.
I would defend myself. Maybe he is scum and he is trying not to attract much attention. If he defends himself, people start to talk about him - this isn't a good thing for a scum.

I keep my vote for now.

Wait, defend himself against what exactly?

[TrPrado]

So teacher2 comes in dropping lots of to me new and unknown abbreviations in an apparent attempt to impress everyone here with mafia lingo. Please explain the following terms to me:
VCA
NAI
RVS

A guy who devoted hours of his time to developing a piece of software to automate a significant part of the game thinks that using shortened forms of common Mafia phrases is somehow scummy, and lacks the wit to look them up for himself on the various Mafia wikis that exist, and then logs off when I ask him a question...

Nope.

##Vote Peterlund

I've never seen those abbreviations in game either until this game. What's inherently scummy about asking those to be explained?

[yavuzovic]

I see people want more from me and my vote. I voted him, because he even didn't react to people voting him. There was four people on his wagon, and he talked about something different. I would retaliate, attack and even gather people on them. But he even didn't mention this.

Actually I am starting to lose my scumread on ghug. ##unvotee Yes he didn't reacted much to his wagon - I don't count his last message - and this is scummy but I don't think enough to blame someone.

If I can't find anyone else, I'll vote Ezio.
I am open to suggestions.

[teacher2]

Balki Bartokomous. . . . . He suggested and started the D1 read thing this game, and that gets towncred.

not sure what you meant here, since I dont see it. Can you elaborate?

RagingIke297. Note to self. Check his interactions WITH others (other than Balki and about Thamrick.) I always read Ike scum on D1 and today is no exception. His decision to ‘step into’ the role of Big Talkers seems townie. But what he says doesn’t seem big. Maybe quantity… but not quality? Scum.

One of only two major disagreements on reads, so I want to plumb more. The Oxford comma question was unusually detail oriented and got major town cred from me. Can you elaborate on why you dont see that (or the ghug flashmob/Ezio participation) questions as quality?

TrPrado...Xorxes wasn’t buddying him.

The other disagreement (on Xorxes's actions, not your Xorxes read, which is merely a difference). Xorxes attacked two people who voted TrP right out of the gate (me, Telamor) and then his reads list questioned a third PeterLund. I would call this buddying. Why dont you?

In general, my many thanks for the meta information which is helpful for a newb to this environment, and my hope that you can respond before nightfall since it will help my final vote placement. (Im fine on Ezio but also its low-info D1 so can be convinced to move.)

[Balki Bartokomous]

@anyone, is is too hard to read my name? Everybody is pronouncing it wrong.

Since yesterday ghug contributed to game good, at least he tried, but I will keep my vote on him because he didn't defend himself - even when he was set to be lynched.
I would defend myself. Maybe he is scum and he is trying not to attract much attention. If he defends himself, people start to talk about him - this isn't a good thing for a scum.

I keep my vote for now.

@yavuzovic,

I don’t believe you are on the right track here. I would not draw any conclusions from ghug’s lack of a defense for a couple of reasons:

1) There has been no push on ghug. He may have several votes, but there is nobody pushing hard to lynch ghug right now. No impassioned case. No “ghug is scum!” touchstone. No loud voice to create any sense of urgency.
2) The votes developed early and included joke votes and placeholders (I can’t go back and count them now, but that’s my impression). It’s still early. I don’t think we know yet what the main wagons today will be. There just hasn’t been much reason for ghug to feel the need to defend himself.
3) ghug is confident and experienced, and not the type to get defensive this early as either alignment.

These reasons all point to NAI (non-alignment indicative or null). I wouldn’t draw a conclusion one way or the other based on ghug’s current lack of a serious defense.

If you disagree, explain why you think Scum Ghug would not defend himself, but Town Ghug would. In my experience, Scum Ghug is not at all afraid of the spotlight. Quite the opposite.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Well, my last post is stale, I see. Sorry, I’m on my phone, boarding an airplane.

[TrPrado]

This is the precise reason the recent replies feature exists on the forum.

Anyway, thanks Balki for explaining in a lot more detail

[teacher2]

I think you and Ghug may be biased by already having a scumlean towards [Xorxes]...

Confirmation bias is a thing, and one I suffer from. I note your comments, and others along the same lines, and reduce my position. I did like the performance on the random name test, but still want more.

I am open to some positive examples to help me move off of TrPrado.

I see his questions to Xorxes (re: me), Daryg (re weird doc insinuation), me (experience?), Yavu (re: DrC read), ghug (regarding names test), the GM (re stressed), and RdR (defending Xorxes) as all advancing game content. That said, he is more steering conversation than necessarily participating in it.

Youre also right that I misread your first post - Thanks!