Mafia 1016: America's Past-Crime [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

I have no idea if he was around or not but the fact is he was comfortable to park his vote on me and dip totally. Not something you do to your teammates

Vecna says that Bozo has sometimes bussed his team-mates hard, in the past. What is your verdict of this assessment of Bozo's history?

When I was scum with him we all bussed summit_fever because he was disgustingly obv scum and he immediately gave up but I don't recall any other bussing from that game.

Bozo has been scum in other games.

[Durga]

When was bozo my counterwagon? I don't remember him even being on the table.

During D1, from about two hours prior to EoD, until about one hour prior to EoD.

Look at the bot and you'll see a period of around about an hour when Bozo was the second-placed wagon.

Two~one hour prior isn't "vote for the other person or I'm fucked" territory it's still try to get my scum reads dead territory.

[dargorygel]

and by 'top two scumreads' I am suggesting we list OUTSIDE of the Brain list. We WILL daykill from the list, today. But I'd like to hear our thoughts regardless of the list.

So you want us to list our top two scum from a pool that is guaranteed to have between zero and one scum in it?

I didn't write clearly.
I am wondering if it would help us to know who our top two scumreads (connected) are at present. Not OUTSIDE or INSIDE the list. If there were no brain list. Just plain old, 'who is scum."

I expect we WILL argue and discuss our choices.

[dargorygel]

Would it be helpful if we all listed our two top guesses for the scum team right now? I am not desiring to give the scumroom info for their faction kill. But maybe we would find we have more cohesion than we think.
----
TBH, we are all floundering a little.

We have no absolute, confirmed, scumfolk.

So when someone suggests that "BLANK" is my top, the person in question (whether they are scum or not) can always poke holes in the theory. Because it is theory. It is not much more than gut, augmented by a bit of logic.

How would guessing two make it any less theoretical?
Do we have to justify why we think they're paired?

I am wondering, I suppose, if the brain list, while very helpful, is hindering our thinking.

[Durga]

Why didn't you vote for bozo D1 when he was your counterwagon and you'd not read the game?

When was bozo my counterwagon? I don't remember him even being on the table. I remember it being Jamiet and then I was sus of damo so I voted for damo. I don't vote for people I don't find scummy if I can vote for someone I do.

You were sus of damo because of his vote for you, right? Were you not sus of bozo's reasons for his vote for you?

I don't remember his reason, but also everyone was voting for me at some point just because I wasn't around so it's not just bozo's reason I don't recall. Damo felt sus because he joke voted me and stayed there because he quoted math.

Also, why didn't *you* vote for bozo?

[dargorygel]

Hi Celaph
Vote, please

[Durga]

Vecna says that Bozo has sometimes bussed his team-mates hard, in the past. What is your verdict of this assessment of Bozo's history?

When I was scum with him we all bussed summit_fever because he was disgustingly obv scum and he immediately gave up but I don't recall any other bussing from that game.

Bozo has been scum in other games.

Sorry let me just open my secret file on bozo and get back to you :p

[lfischl]

I don't like baseball. It's an extremely dull sport.

Seriously though.

Lots of Americans seem to think football (i.e. proper football, or if you prefer "soccer") is boring, but have this freakish love for baseball, a sport where a bunch of guys hit balls with sticks and run in circles for hours, and basically nothing happens.

true. but "real" football is actually interesting as well.

[Jamiet99uk]

Seriously though.

Lots of Americans seem to think football (i.e. proper football, or if you prefer "soccer") is boring, but have this freakish love for baseball, a sport where a bunch of guys hit balls with sticks and run in circles for hours, and basically nothing happens.

true. but "real" football is actually interesting as well.

American "Grid Iron" Football? It can be interesting, sure. The fact that play stops every 10 seconds is a bit tedious though.

[Jamiet99uk]

Would it be helpful if we all listed our two top guesses for the scum team right now? I am not desiring to give the scumroom info for their faction kill. But maybe we would find we have more cohesion than we think.
----
TBH, we are all floundering a little.

We have no absolute, confirmed, scumfolk.

So when someone suggests that "BLANK" is my top, the person in question (whether they are scum or not) can always poke holes in the theory. Because it is theory. It is not much more than gut, augmented by a bit of logic.

How would guessing two make it any less theoretical?
Do we have to justify why we think they're paired?

I am wondering, I suppose, if the brain list, while very helpful, is hindering our thinking.

Ok then, you start us off.

Who are your top two scumreads, irrespective of the two groups, and why?

[Jamiet99uk]

(It triggers me slightly when someone calls upon everyone to do something, and then doesn't do it themself)

[celaph]

##vote Durga

[celaph]

I don't understand this. Are you saying his "bad" options were both his teammates? What way are you seeing it here?

I was sort of implying that to jamiet to see if he'd respond, ye. not a very relevant post

Okay, well my question still stands though. Were my (or anyone's) reasons to scumread Jamie so bad that scum couldn't justify a vote for town!Jamie over scum!Durga?

If he was looking at my reasons/response to Jamie it may have been a bad time to follow.

[Jamiet99uk]

##vote Durga

Would you like to tell us why you have made this choice?

[dargorygel]

(It triggers me slightly when someone calls upon everyone to do something, and then doesn't do it themself)

I am very ready to do this. I only hesitated because perhaps i was missing some, "THIS WILL TELL SCUM THIS AND SUCH" thing.

But my two scum right now are Durga and Rdr.

Durga because of her reactions to people voting for her. There IS a body of evidence out there, but she has put on her pious hat and responded, "WHAT? only IDIOTS would vote for me!" Which is very scummy Durga. She doesn't even seem all that sincerly putout. It feels to me like she is going through the motions.

I have read other cases, and find they are reasonable.

Rdrivera because of his bumping along the thread. Rdrivera has, as i have noted, changed metas more often than Brain. Effectively. This time, as i read him, he does not come up with any new ideas, or argue passionately or logically. He shoots a few pea-shots at ideas... repeat suspicions... and does not seem like superstar rdr.

No... these are not 'cases.' But they are the rationale behind my present gut-votes.

I also note bozo's lack of communication with these two... but he really didn't have mucho commincationo with anyone that i recall.

[dargorygel]

##vote Durga

C'mon celaph. You've got more than that, I assume.

[celaph]

Hi Kgray,

I assume this is the part you want a response on:


That would imply that his team-mates are in a pool of:

Vecna
Celaph
Ifischl
Rdrivera
Dargorygel

He didn't completely avoid Vecna, I don't think. Celaph of course started a wagon on Bozo and declared him a top scumred, but the problem is, that was after Bozo's very last post, so we can't say he was avoiding that, because possibly he was genuinely not around.

We do know that there's a maximum of 1 scum in Ifischl, Rdrivera, and Dargorygel, and possibly none.

Let me modify my comment to say that scenario 4 is not impossible. It's just the least likely, in my opinion.

Okay, that all makes sense. I did forget about there being max 1 scum in the non-you voters. Except I think scenario 3 should still be less likely from your POV.

Can't we mostly rule out celaph for getting Bozo? If we did that and Durga/kgray were town vecna is the vote here.

As much as I would like to be ruled out it's possible I was bussing Bozo.

I'm confused by the logic in your second line. Yes if we knew that Durga and kgray were town then Vecna is the vote here, but that seems like a rather mute hypothetical as we don't know that they're both town. Why are you bringing it up?

[Durga]

Well, y'all will still have one more shot to get it right.... I suspect it's kgray but it could be Vecna, and outside the group if there's one I think it's Ifischl but maybe darg?? Idk, I'm tired and I can't fight off a third attempted miskill so I might as well reclaim my Friday evening. Gg scum

[Jamiet99uk]

Well, y'all will still have one more shot to get it right.... I suspect it's kgray but it could be Vecna, and outside the group if there's one I think it's Ifischl but maybe darg?? Idk, I'm tired and I can't fight off a third attempted miskill so I might as well reclaim my Friday evening. Gg scum

Sighing "I can't be bothered" defeatism is a bit of a scum Durga tell, isn't it.

[celaph]

##vote Durga

Would you like to tell us why you have made this choice?

A few factors.
The first being a process of elimination as I townread both Vecna and kgray more than her.
Secondly, I think she has done a minimal amount of work towards solving this game. I'm getting far more frustration at being wagon again than the drive to figure out who the counter wagon should be. Her push against Bona yesterday reads more like a self-pres push for their counterwagon than someone looking for scum. It only worked because of Bona's failed gimmicks.