Pairs Diplomacy Game Thread

[sin(2x) = 2sin(x)cos(x)]

Spring, 1909

The war is dying down, and I think we should prevent any further conflicts. Russia is divided and will surely be torn apart in only a few more years. I propose a three-way draw between Austria, Germany, and I to the other leaders.

To my General,

Let's stand down against Austria. Wait a year, and Russia will surely have to disband one of its fleets. Then, we can move in and take the rest of the original Turkish centers.

- Italy

[Jamiet99uk]

Since the game is over, to repeat what I said in the Observer Thread:

I was the Turkish general and I made the following notes in the first few years, before I was defeated:

Spring 1901: I believe I entered the moves requested of me by the Sultan. I would not have had Smyrna hold, but that is what he asked for, so I have done it. The Black Sea bounce was necessary as Russia had not agreed to the Sultan's suggestion to open directly to Rumania.

Autumn, 1901: (early): Given Russia's southern opening stance, and his lack of agreement to the Sultan's proposals, I am provisionally entering a set of anti-Russian orders. Ankara to Black Sea, Bulgaria to Rumania, and Smyrna to Armenia.

The Sultan has yet to speak this phase, so these orders may be subject to change.

Interesting that Italy's Admiral ignored the instruction of his King!

Autumn 1901 ~(build phase):
Things are going acceptably so far. It appears we are treating Russia as an ally.

I have not had any build suggestions from the Sultan, so I'm currently building a Fleet.

Autumn 1902:

The Sultan is not posting very often in the thread, and when he does, he is making clear where his alliances lie, which is helpful, but is delegating all military decisions to me. That's fine as it goes, but it leaves me in the hands of the Russian and Italian generals since I am mute, and the Sultan is not proposing any specific tactics.

The Russian diplomat sucks as much as my own Sultan.

"We leave it up to the generals to do the tactics."

Ok dumbass, FINE, but I cannot SPEAK to the Russian general, can I? So I cannot co-ordinate MOVES with him.

Autumn, 1902: Literally my only instruction is "be allied with Russia". Great.

Spring, 1903:
Finally, some strategic thinking from the Sultan. Let's see if Russia does cut Serbia as asked.

-----------------------------

After that point Russia stabbed HARD and Turkey was doomed. I entered moves for a few more turns and then died.

This was an immensely frustrating experience as a General. Effectively I was playing a Gunboat with one diplomatic instruction "be allied with Russia", who then stabbed me.

I would not play this type of game again. My experience was shit.

[kingofthepirates]

I greatly thank my (the German) diplomat for a very successful diplomatic campaign! I believe I generally stuck to your recommendations and play the role of the loyal ally :]

[Pengwinja]

I, Respectfully, thank the second French General, and curse the First French general. Sorry I was gone for so long.

[DougJoe]

Posted my longer form notes in the observer thread but I'll try to summarize and provide some other notes here.

I, Respectfully, thank the second French General, and curse the First French general. Sorry I was gone for so long.

Thanks.

Peng, I don't know if you've read or seen my notes yet (you should go read them) but I really, really, felt like I had to build that army in 02 in Paris. I know you wanted to try to get Germany onside with the fleet build but from what I'd read I felt that Germany was trying to string you along - and if I *had* built that fleet, I suspect it would have been over even quicker. Other than that, I made one good move and then a lot of wrong guesses. I was really hoping I could hold out until either Russia put a dent in Germany or Turkey put a dent in Italy, but the Russian stab of Turkey didn't help things there at all.

What made this game frustrating is that I couldn't *explain* to my diplomat why I went *against* his suggestion of building F Bre - I didn't do it lightly nor without considerable thought.

The global press format of the messages definitely made it hard to coordinate things between the powers. The one good thing I was able to do this game was to block the attack on Mar because I could react to the G/I diplomat's global planning. The Turkish diplomat even commented that season on trying to do what G/I were doing that season being maybe not the best idea (which is why I'm guessing he was so vague in his messages as Jamie noted) because your opponents could plan defense (like I did).

IMHO, Germany's diplomat did a really nice job of managing to never be the "bad guy". I think I saw that there was a DMZ of Burgundy early on and that France violated it before I joined - Germany did a really good job of working that situation to his advantage.

Otherwise, of the "big three" near the end (IMHO) I think there was a turn where I thought that Italy could have maybe made a run for a solo - I think it was S08, just after I had been wiped out. Italy was the only power across the MSL and it sure would have been interesting if he had moved to MAO and WMS that turn. A/G to me would have been army locked along the MSL... Germany might have been able to get Por/Mar/Spa (there was also a turn where he could have moved in the spring and been able to force Mar in the fall IIRC) but I'm not sure he gets Tunis to get to 18. Austria didn't have the fleets needed to hit Italy.

Would I try this variant again? Maybe, at least to experience it from the beginning instead of coming in when the position was already tenuous... I think it could be tweaked, though, somehow - but not exactly sure how.

[Pengwinja]

I would. I think I haven’t read your notes, I’ll do it rn.

[DreamTrawler]

I greatly thank my (the German) diplomat for a very successful diplomatic campaign! I believe I generally stuck to your recommendations and play the role of the loyal ally :]

Thank you, and thank you for your excellent generalship! Sorry for disappearing in the lategame.

[DougJoe]

I greatly thank my (the German) diplomat for a very successful diplomatic campaign! I believe I generally stuck to your recommendations and play the role of the loyal ally :]

Thank you, and thank you for your excellent generalship! Sorry for disappearing in the lategame.

DT, do you think would you have actually told your general to back off if I'd built that fleet in Brest in W02? Or was my intuition correct that you were thinking "die France die" all along?

[DreamTrawler]

I greatly thank my (the German) diplomat for a very successful diplomatic campaign! I believe I generally stuck to your recommendations and play the role of the loyal ally :]

Thank you, and thank you for your excellent generalship! Sorry for disappearing in the lategame.

DT, do you think would you have actually told your general to back off if I'd built that fleet in Brest in W02? Or was my intuition correct that you were thinking "die France die" all along?

I was being cautious. I honestly did want to jointly invade England with France early on. However since I somehow found myself in a position to attack England and France without having to worry about my eastern border I figured it was fine to keep attacking with Italy's help. Especially since Italy was willing to give me a center (Marseille) right off the bat.

[Theodoric]

The global press format of the messages definitely made it hard to coordinate things between the powers. The one good thing I was able to do this game was to block the attack on Mar because I could react to the G/I diplomat's global planning. The Turkish diplomat even commented that season on trying to do what G/I were doing that season being maybe not the best idea (which is why I'm guessing he was so vague in his messages as Jamie noted) because your opponents could plan defense (like I did).

Exactly. Had I seen a move that couldn't be countered, or even an objective that couldn't be countered with coordination, I would have said so. But I didn't see circumstances where the advantage of coordinating outweighed the disadvantage of Austria knowing the plan. What I might have tried more of is something like proposing two plans and asking each general to flip a coin, but I don't think that would have been helpful either.

One thing that might make future versions of this more fun/interesting would be to let the generals and diplomats talk once before the game starts. It would be helpful to understand each other's styles, and maybe even to develop some code words/phrases to signal that we're bluffing/we're fine with our generals disregarding certain instructions.