How to break a stalemate line

Use this forum to discuss Diplomacy strategy.
Forum rules
This forum is limited to topics relating to the game Diplomacy only. Other posts or topics will be relocated to the correct forum category or deleted. Please be respectful and follow our normal site rules at http://www.webdiplomacy.net/rules.php.
Post Reply
Message
Author
DarthPorg36
Posts: 74
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:15 pm
Karma: 61

How to break a stalemate line

#1 Post by DarthPorg36 » Wed Feb 02, 2022 5:11 pm

I recently got the closest I ever have to winning with England against bots. After 20 moves not going anywhere, I decided to draw, even though I had 16 centers. Is there a way you think I could have played my moves differently? Is there I way I was blind to to breaking the stalemate?

https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?game ... 52#votebar

If I had gotten Iberia I might've done it... but two armies wanted it and neither could overwhelm the other...

Deeply_Dippy
Posts: 83
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 4:19 pm
Location: Britannia's First City
Karma: 63

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#2 Post by Deeply_Dippy » Wed Feb 02, 2022 7:23 pm

Just an observation but - by definition - if it was a true stalmate position then nothing you could have done would have broken it.

However, I have no idea how efficient the bots are at coordinating and maintaining a stalemate line.

DarthPorg36
Posts: 74
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:15 pm
Karma: 61

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#3 Post by DarthPorg36 » Wed Feb 02, 2022 8:28 pm

See, that's the issue I was having. There was progress I could make, but as soon as I took Moscow I'd sacrifice something else, and end up right back where I started before the attack. Same thing with Warsaw.

tr1285
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:25 pm
Location: NJ, USA
Karma: 79

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#4 Post by tr1285 » Wed Feb 02, 2022 9:17 pm

I think you had a chance to solo. If Western Med was supporting Spain, there is nothing you could do to take it, but since Spain only had 1 support, I would have taken it from Mar, giving up Mar temporarily. That would force-disband a French fleet from Spain. Then you could take back Mar from Spain and try to defend Spain. But even if you were able to put a fleet in Spain, as long as MAO and Spain are both under attack, you could never get Portugal.

For your 18th center you would probably have to rely on a lucky guess to hold Moscow and Warsaw. It might not work out for you, but I think there is a chance. This is the best I could see anyway.

DarthPorg36
Posts: 74
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:15 pm
Karma: 61

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#5 Post by DarthPorg36 » Wed Feb 02, 2022 11:47 pm

That's what I thought too, but with NAf constantly tapping MAO, I couldn't go anywhere.

JECE
Posts: 221
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 4:35 pm
Karma: 121
Contact:

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#6 Post by JECE » Thu Feb 03, 2022 1:00 am

Generally, you would have had to see the stalemate line coming and do everything that you can to change the game dynamic before it is too late.

I've never played a bot game, mind you, but the traditional southwest-northeast stalemate line is the first on the list that you want to avoid!

The "Visual Index to Stalemate Positions" is a very helpful resource:
http://uk.diplom.org/pouch/Online/Stale ... visual.htm
See my full Profile:
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/profile.php?userID=17421

Devonian
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2020 2:56 pm

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#7 Post by Devonian » Thu Feb 03, 2022 2:41 am

I never played against bots. But when it's you against 3 opponents, the only way I know to do it is to back off of the stalemate line and let someone else become a threat. Once they re-engage with each other, you can push past the stalemate line and go for a win.

Josef IV
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:04 pm
Karma: 42

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#8 Post by Josef IV » Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:39 am

There are guesses around MOS and WAR, so you could get both if you are lucky - its not a stalemate line there. But that only gets you to 17. You would then have to rely on the bots making a silly mistake with Spain. Just support holding it would prevent your solo with no problem, but the orders they were issuing in the last phase would enable the fall of Spain, as pointed out by tr1285.

DougJoe
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 9:02 pm
Location: Alto, MI, USA
Karma: 59

Re: How to break a stalemate line

#9 Post by DougJoe » Mon Feb 14, 2022 3:52 pm

Looking near the end, in the spring of 1921 there's two things I see that I wonder about: Bur->Mar and Edi->Nor.

The bots had clearly shown in the several turns before that they were intent on tapping Spain, so I think you only need Gas S Mar to hold Mar. For that turn, you could use Mar to support Mun, then move Ber to Pru to backfill Prussia. That at least gives you the option of Pru & Liv S War in the fall, which feels a little better than what you ended up with after that turn.

Also, you could have moved Edi->Den in the spring (not sure you need the army over the top?) which you could convoy to Ber in the fall and then you use that army to support operations in Sil or Mun as needed.

Then, with all that, given Austria's two turns of Tyo->Mun, Boh->Sil, if you were feeling extra spicy, you could have tried Mun->Boh S by Sil, Bur->Mun in the fall as well (I'm not even sure I would have been that aggressive - I myself might have ended up waiting until the spring of 22 but that might have been too late?). I'm not sure that being in Boh really buys you anything, but at least it feels like progress, and it keeps Sil from constantly getting tapped. Then maybe somehow from there there's a way to punch into Gal, and I think that might have opened things up? It's hard to say. I've definitely been in positions with the bots that should by all rights been forced draws that the bots didn't hold for some reason (see https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=396710 which I just finished yesterday and the grind at the end to get into Mos/Liv/Pru, none of which should have ever happened.)

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests