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I am concerned at seeing Michael Jacksons name on the Epstein. I thought Jacko was a decent guy who just enjoyed slumber parties.

Epstein from Welcome Back Kotter?

I conclude that just about every celebrity and popular figure has a deep dark evil secret that will one day be revealed and should be brought to justice when it is revealed, but no bias should be given for political affiliation, popularity, or anything else.

There is an argument for the Detroit Lions being declared national champs by the BCS

What I find most disconcerting is how decision makers could be blackmailed with such info. The public outrage seems to make it worse by assuring decision makers that there will be consequences if their dirty secrets are exposed.

learnedSloth wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 08, 2024 1:48 pm

What I find most disconcerting is how decision makers could be blackmailed with such info. The public outrage seems to make it worse by assuring decision makers that there will be consequences if their dirty secrets are exposed.

What's the alternative to outrage though - turning a blind eye to child sex crimes? If so, wouldn't that let the rich and powerful know that they can indeed get away with *anything*?

I think I'd prefer to have a blackmailed ruling class if it means they're at least a little afraid to take their vacations on child rape island.

learnedSloth wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 08, 2024 1:48 pm

What I find most disconcerting is how decision makers could be blackmailed with such info. The public outrage seems to make it worse by assuring decision makers that there will be consequences if their dirty secrets are exposed.

So... do we just leave the guilty unpunished just because they are in a position of influence? Perhaps I misunderstand your meaning, but what is wrong with assuring decision makers that there are consequences to their actions?

Losing face or career can be more scary than the actual punishment, and the former can result from things that aren't even crimes.

learnedSloth wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 08, 2024 8:49 pm

Losing face or career can be more scary than the actual punishment, and the former can result from things that aren't even crimes.

While true, I reserve my right to feel as though Epstein-enabled pedophiles cannot be shamed and punished thoroughly enough.

We elect decision makers based on our view of their competency and character, so we should have a right to the information regarding these things. If this causes a politician to not get elected again, that is the democratic process at work. If it causes politicians to be more careful that what they do in private matches the character that they portray themselves to have in public, then I see it as a good thing.

It suggests that maybe Athens had it right and that sortition is the best form of democracy

Don't forget exile. But if brought that back, the dems would exile all the republicans, or at least the noisy ones, and then if or when the repubs take power, they would exile the dems or at least the noisy ones.

Actually that might work out pretty well to stop the division in the country. All the extremes on both teams have to move to Cuba or Venezuela.

Johnny Big Horse wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 08, 2024 11:37 pm

Don't forget exile. But if brought that back, the dems would exile all the republicans, or at least the noisy ones, and then if or when the repubs take power, they would exile the dems or at least the noisy ones.

Actually that might work out pretty well to stop the division in the country. All the extremes on both teams have to move to Cuba or Venezuela.

Only trouble is that Cuba and Venezuala are both socialist, and thus the Republican exiles would have to move somewhere else.