Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

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Expand view Topic review: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Vecna » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:30 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:10 am
And if anyone responds to this by posting what I said about Damian on Day 3, you will be immediately unsubscribed from my Youtube channel.
If you had these quality posts during the game you never wouldve been lynched to begin with :razz:

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Squigs44 » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:53 am

I thought you were putting together a spreadsheet or something and needed a color for each of us to help organize it. I had actually forgotten about the color thing until you brought it up later.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by damian » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:45 am

It was actually scum hunting tbf. Or at least an attempt at a genuine facsimile of doing so. I didn’t warn anyone on the scum team about what I was doing or how to answer so it’s amusing that the rest of the scum all ended up in the same category.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:38 am

ghug wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:27 am
Durga wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:22 am
oh and maybe next time try "thanks durga and worcej for running a game that I got to play in although I don't think it's balanced" it might get you less of an angry react
Is that why you're yelling at Ezio right now too?
i'm glad that's the standard you're setting for yourself.

i apologize that i got angry at your insensitive comment and called you shitty. i will go back to ignoring your existence forever now

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Tom Bombadil » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:36 am

I also townread you for the color stuff.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by ghug » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:34 am

damian wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:28 am
I loved Balki’s reaction to my colour shenanigans by the way. Couldn’t say so at the time but I really appreciated it.
That honestly made me scumread you way less.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by damian » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:28 am

I loved Balki’s reaction to my colour shenanigans by the way. Couldn’t say so at the time but I really appreciated it.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by ghug » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:27 am

Durga wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:22 am
oh and maybe next time try "thanks durga and worcej for running a game that I got to play in although I don't think it's balanced" it might get you less of an angry react
Is that why you're yelling at Ezio right now too?

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:22 am

oh and maybe next time try "thanks durga and worcej for running a game that I got to play in although I don't think it's balanced" it might get you less of an angry react

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:18 am

saying my set up was bad was inferring you lost because of the set up. it's a bit annoying to run a game that you've put a lot of thought and time into just to be told it's shitty. i reacted accordingly. you can go back to your open basic set up 27 player games now and shit on the next gm.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by ghug » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:10 am

Durga wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:45 am
i'm happy that you're as good at reading set ups as you are at catching scum :heart:

no one is declaring it perfect, it is definitely swingy. but stop throwing shade at my set up as the reason you lost. the number of scum/town ratio is right, i checked like 20 mafiascum games. i even gave you guys a doc and no factional mafia kill. you had plenty of opportunities to make it more than 3 mislynches - and for such a small game that is NOT unreasonable

also, you weren't even close to catching the scum.

also, you were foolish for town clearing anyone in a closed set up - which whatever, you've never played a closed set up and now you've learned. good for you.

also, day chat and no night is 100% worse for mafia. just look at what happened with balki's kill/lynch there - that would never have happened in a normal set up. plus nights break up town flow. there was no break in that here, so it's better for town. plus scum don't get the benefit of knowing what the lynch was when deciding the kill.

try to think a little before you go off next time, i'd be nice to you but you never give me a reason to do so. you always just throw shade and then get made when i get annoyed and then call me a bad person. maybe... maybe you're the bad person??????!!! just maybe.
I said your setup was bad. You responded with "Hey ghug, fuck you. You're shit at this game." You also appear to have been talking shit about me in the God thread the entire game. Trying to play the victim here is ridiculous.

I never said your setup was the reason we lost. I've actually clarified multiple times that it wasn't. If you could take a quarter of the criticism you dish out, this wouldn't be an issue.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:01 am

Bozotheclown has been LYNCHED. They were OKOME, a VANILLA TOWNIE.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:45 am

i'm happy that you're as good at reading set ups as you are at catching scum :heart:

no one is declaring it perfect, it is definitely swingy. but stop throwing shade at my set up as the reason you lost. the number of scum/town ratio is right, i checked like 20 mafiascum games. i even gave you guys a doc and no factional mafia kill. you had plenty of opportunities to make it more than 3 mislynches - and for such a small game that is NOT unreasonable

also, you weren't even close to catching the scum.

also, you were foolish for town clearing anyone in a closed set up - which whatever, you've never played a closed set up and now you've learned. good for you.

also, day chat and no night is 100% worse for mafia. just look at what happened with balki's kill/lynch there - that would never have happened in a normal set up. plus nights break up town flow. there was no break in that here, so it's better for town. plus scum don't get the benefit of knowing what the lynch was when deciding the kill.

try to think a little before you go off next time, i'd be nice to you but you never give me a reason to do so. you always just throw shade and then get made when i get annoyed and then call me a bad person. maybe... maybe you're the bad person??????!!! just maybe.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by ghug » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:32 am

I think I'd rather have day chat and no night than just night chat as scum. I also think the roles in a vacuum were at least moderately scum-sided. Three days to loss is steep to overcome.

I think there's also a large confounding factor here in that scum can pretty plausibly claim doc even if the assassin does die, which can probably get them at least one extra mislynch, and there's the fact that double vote is seen much more often as a town role. That every town player was ready to at least mostly clear Damian suggests that it wasn't completely ridiculous to do.

In my mind, the purpose of a closed setup is to prevent a mass claim's effectiveness, thus taking mechanics out of scumhunting. It succeeded in that in forcing consideration of Fox's claim. It succeeded in half of it in giving Damian plausible cover, but as players without setup info, we need to act on probabilities, and the probability of Damian's being scum given what we knew was low enough that I think considering him town was the right call.

Now, we got it wrong mostly irrespective of any balance issues, so none of it really matters as far as this game goes. I just think that closed setups are a good idea, and I'd rather we all learn from what worked and what didn't about this one rather than declare it perfect when it wasn't.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Durga » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:15 am

yeah my idea was to create a game where the way people played had a big impact on the outcome, vs something like a cop

anyway, once again - thanks everyone for playing. it was nice to try out something fun

--- thoroughly unpleasant person

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Fluminator » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:45 am

As a member of the well loved and respected mafia council on webdip (I dont think I ever left it) my opinion on this setup is objective fact.

Normally you allow as many mislynches as you have scum. In this setup it's actually over for town at just 3 mislynches so it may seem scum sided at first glance. However, it's only the case if both the doublevoter and assassin live. If the assassin dies, then the town has a huge advantage and the town becomes favored to win. So I would say the setup is a little more swingy than normal but that's not necessarily a bad thing and doesn't make it unbalanced.

Day chat for scum and no night is much worse for scum than night chat.
2 PR for town is fair.

The council has spoken.

-signed Flum HR Captainmeme

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Tom Bombadil » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:22 am

xorxes wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:46 am
I liked the no night part, it makes it so much more dynamic.

I probably shouldn't have assumed 3 scum -> 3 PR, but that's what I expected would be a balanced setup. My first instinct when damian saved Fox was that they were both scum, but then having 3 PRs was just too reasonable. I even thought Mafia had no special powers because the daychat gives them such a huge advantage.

I also had a lot of trouble dealing with bozo and rivera. I wanted to offend them as little as possible in this game so they would not hold it against me in the other one, that's why I practically ignored them until the other game finished.
I could have been a PR NK’d D1, so it was probably a mistake to townclear Damian regardless

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Tom Bombadil » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:20 am

I agree with most. Even though my time was short lived, I liked the setup because it was so different. May have been slightly scum sided, but definitely win-able for town, so no complaints there.

Thanks GMs!

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Balki Bartokomous » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:17 am

Good game scum buckets. A well deserved victory.

Thanks to Durga for trying something different and interesting. So many games around here are so similar -- kudos for being creative. Also, Durga and worcej, the game ran very smoothly considering the innovation. Thanks for putting in the time and effort.

Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

by Squigs44 » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:15 am

Look, if Rdrivera got one more vote D2, he would've been lynched. Vecna saves oracled ghug D3, and now mafia has no NK left. Fox likely gets lynched D3 or D4, and now it is Damian versus what, 5 town? Town cleared ghug makes it to the end, and probably doc Vecna. Then we have a conversation at the end of the game about how townsided this set up was.

The set up was balanced just fine.

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