Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

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Expand view Topic review: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by DougJoe » Fri Oct 25, 2024 9:04 pm

UnknownHero wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:41 pm
 This game is a good example of that kind of strategy. Facing an insurmountable Turkish threat, the Italian fled their home centers to get a foothold in Iberia to be part of the stalemate line. Despite being a small power with no home centers, they couldn't be whittled out of the draw due to being in a key stalemate line position.

https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=869772#gamePanel
Wattsthematter wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:22 pm
 Yeah Italy knew exactly when to abandon ship there. Pretty brilliant!
That game is an excellent example the strategy mentioned. I was Turkey and during the game I wasn't sure at first that that was what Italy was doing but once I was sure there was nothing that I could do about it. If Italy tried to defend his homeland instead of retreating, I might have been able to use the chaos in the West to get Mar or Spa or Por and solo.

Watts, you can read various notes on the game in this Forum post if you're interested:
https://webdiplomacy.net/contrib/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5042&p=397217#p397217

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by Wattsthematter » Fri Oct 11, 2024 3:47 pm

JECE wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 11, 2024 3:32 pm
Wattsthematter wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:32 pm
UnknownHero wrote: ↑
Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:53 pm
 In a DSS game, you still have a chance to get a decent result if you can force your way into a draw, even as a small power. For this to work, you have to be positioned on a key part of the stalemate line against a player approaching a solo win. This may even mean abandoning home centers to make sure you can be in key stalemate territories like Munich or Tunis once the stalemate line locks up. This strategy is less effective with SoS scoring.
This is really great advice. I've seen it play out multiple times where a 1 SC country ends up in a 4 way draw, I hadn't really considered manipulating your own situation to force such a thing though.
This is good advice even if you're not in the late-game and even if you're still aiming to win the game. For your armies and fleets to survive you need supply centers. It's always good to read the board and think a few years down the line. There is no point in dying on your sword at home if you have the option of surviving largely intact elsewhere. See what I did as Russia in 1904 and 1905 here:
https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=93086

That was a public press game, so it's not as extreme as if I had done the same in a no press game, but given the press type I couldn't really negotiate with or warn my German ally about my plans.
Oh wow. What an absurdly lengthy game just to get the same 4 draw outcome haha. That was a very impressive comeback and impressive performance by everyone on the board. Thanks for sharing that

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by JECE » Fri Oct 11, 2024 3:32 pm

Wattsthematter wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:32 pm
UnknownHero wrote: ↑
Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:53 pm
 In a DSS game, you still have a chance to get a decent result if you can force your way into a draw, even as a small power. For this to work, you have to be positioned on a key part of the stalemate line against a player approaching a solo win. This may even mean abandoning home centers to make sure you can be in key stalemate territories like Munich or Tunis once the stalemate line locks up. This strategy is less effective with SoS scoring.
This is really great advice. I've seen it play out multiple times where a 1 SC country ends up in a 4 way draw, I hadn't really considered manipulating your own situation to force such a thing though.
This is good advice even if you're not in the late-game and even if you're still aiming to win the game. For your armies and fleets to survive you need supply centers. It's always good to read the board and think a few years down the line. There is no point in dying on your sword at home if you have the option of surviving largely intact elsewhere. See what I did as Russia in 1904 and 1905 here:
https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=93086

That was a public press game, so it's not as extreme as if I had done the same in a no press game, but given the press type I couldn't really negotiate with or warn my German ally about my plans.

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by Wattsthematter » Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:22 pm

Yeah Italy knew exactly when to abandon ship there. Pretty brilliant!

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by UnknownHero » Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:41 pm

This game is a good example of that kind of strategy. Facing an insurmountable Turkish threat, the Italian fled their home centers to get a foothold in Iberia to be part of the stalemate line. Despite being a small power with no home centers, they couldn't be whittled out of the draw due to being in a key stalemate line position.

https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=869772#gamePanel

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by Wattsthematter » Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:32 pm

UnknownHero wrote: ↑
Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:53 pm
 When I have a rough start, say that two of my neighbours ally against me, I sometimes try to make sure that they can't get an even split of my centers, by defending primarily against one of them. The hope is that the weaker power will get frustrated at their lack of gains and stab their ally. Or, the stronger one doesn't feel the alliance is necessary and stabs the weaker one. Doesn't always work, but you have to try something.

In a DSS game, you still have a chance to get a decent result if you can force your way into a draw, even as a small power. For this to work, you have to be positioned on a key part of the stalemate line against a player approaching a solo win. This may even mean abandoning home centers to make sure you can be in key stalemate territories like Munich or Tunis once the stalemate line locks up. This strategy is less effective with SoS scoring.
This is really great advice. I've seen it play out multiple times where a 1 SC country ends up in a 4 way draw, I hadn't really considered manipulating your own situation to force such a thing though.

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by FlaviusAetius » Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:21 pm

also always remember totally possible for someone to just AFK or forget to enter moves, although small chance, it isnt chalked, ive had that cut in both ways so yea

Re: Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by UnknownHero » Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:53 pm

When I have a rough start, say that two of my neighbours ally against me, I sometimes try to make sure that they can't get an even split of my centers, by defending primarily against one of them. The hope is that the weaker power will get frustrated at their lack of gains and stab their ally. Or, the stronger one doesn't feel the alliance is necessary and stabs the weaker one. Doesn't always work, but you have to try something.

In a DSS game, you still have a chance to get a decent result if you can force your way into a draw, even as a small power. For this to work, you have to be positioned on a key part of the stalemate line against a player approaching a solo win. This may even mean abandoning home centers to make sure you can be in key stalemate territories like Munich or Tunis once the stalemate line locks up. This strategy is less effective with SoS scoring.

Playing out a rough beginning in Gunboat

by Wattsthematter » Thu Oct 10, 2024 5:32 pm

I absolute love playing "no message" games, but find it hard to want to keep playing when everything suddenly gets flipped upside down and I can't academically weasel my way out. Any advice or inspirational stories?

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