M80 Game Thread

[Kakarroto]

This is how I think each night went [I am omitting myself because all it does is give scum info and doesn't help town]

Night 1

Enforcer ghug jails worcej
Agent (Bunny is my guess) drives ??
Spy Role X cops/Tracks ??
Prop Fox shortens day

Nav worcej cps Fox
Capt Haze RBs ghug
QM Eden vote doubles Pyxxy

Pyxxy is Faction killed

Night 2

Enforcer strongmans Eden
Agents jails Kak
Spy RC/Tracks Haze

Nav jails Eden
Capt watches ?? [hasn't reported]

Night 3

Enforcer Ninjas me
Agent holsters

Nav commutes me
Capt kills Bona

I wasn't jailed in N2

also please don't forget that brain claimed being jailed N1

[Kakarroto]

[...]
I have observed Jamie, kak, rdrivera have all conceded games in insurmountable scenarios.
[...]

well, the one game (the first time I was mafia here) I did because the guak incident and then chaqa openly had a breakdown because he was sure the game was lost; with only rd and me we weren't sure if we could still win but didn't want to make people lose time so we kinda ended it then. I think there still would've been a chance, but it was really tiny, so yeah.

the other time was the one game where I was caught D1, I think, though I'm not sure right now, but wasn't it the game I was with rd too? I seem to bring bad luck if I'm mafia partner with rd, somehow. So I didn't concede but probably (partially) caused it.

[Kakarroto]

Could Sweetandcool be mafia here:

A case, by beancomb

Firstly, I thought of this while taking my phone screen to be fixed. it was broken while working on my stair railings saturday and it cracked the whole screen. I find that my case building ability has been much better using a computer lately as well. So this should be pretty cleanly organized.

The three arguments I have for why sweetandcool is mafia have nothing to do with ghug and I will try to refrain from making sweeping team combos here when doing this. I am less interested in who sweet is scum with and more interested in seeing if I have any logical argument here.

1. Sweet and Xcution was scum theatre all along.
In order to prove this, it has to have something that maybe hints there is any reason to think this is possible. Which there is.

Chill, it's D1. Bona does this every game. I got worked up about it last game, but then I realized Bona was just having a laugh.

Is there a reason why you feel the need to play referee so early in the game?

Not much to say about ghug and Jamiet, both seemed normal. Well, actually I don't know what is normal for ghug.

Has Eden even posted anything of note yet? I will consult peterbot in a while.

How many games have you played with ghug and Jamie? Calling slots normal feels like a pretty easy escape goat.

Im getting more of vibe from xcution of an angsty “I gotta show off my hunting and intellectual skills because im a hawk”

as opposed too im gonna come hard at my scum partners to distance. so let me bash on sweetandcool and make it look like we arent a team

Scum chat will be happy to know that I've successfully distanced from Sweet without making us look like partners.

What we already know is that xcution was open wolfing, and was mafia. We also know that if sweet is mafia, this statement become reality.

Looking at the interactions, xcution could be coming into this whole thing trying to unscripted-unrehearsed create this massive distance between the two of them.

Counter arguments: Why would mafia openly talk to their own mafia partners in the thread? especially on day one?

At this point, I’ll take pretty much anything over the shitposting.

Have you played as town? As scum? Did you win? Have you played with anyone here?

My dude, I am a ten year plus vet, I've done and seen it all.

Just played with ghug and Haze in G1 of Champs. Won as town there (the three of us did).

We have already established that xcution has no problem talking to scum mates day 1, as he already did so with fox on four seperate interactions. So the thought here is, if I plan to openly talk to one scum partner, why not also talk to multiple?

this next series of posts is extremely large wall battles between sweet.
viewtopic.php?p=341750&sid=dcc11ad3e90a ... 3f#p341750

At the core of this argument sweet and xcution argue about following a script.

"There hasn't been a list of questions here, Sweet, this isn't a scripted performance. I have commented on what I haven't liked and all you have said in response is that you're tired of people harping on your newness and then voting me.

It's obvious to everybody why you're voting me? Please show me where this universal understanding is because I don't see it at all nor do I understand it; you voted me after I called you out and that's the only reason."

This fight gets very anger driven and lacks substance. It seems to me this argument comes about because myself and eden started a fight in the game thread and these two saw it and decided (or xcution decided) hey thats a good way to get townread. most people thinks fights are town vs town


So this portion establishes the motive for a fake scum theatre fight.
viewtopic.php?p=342002&sid=6b971930f411 ... 6e#p342002

The fight continues with both, elevating the size of the posts with equal effort and once again the arguments themselves are very long and it turns into a jumble that I still have a hard time following.

Argument 2.
Sweet is always of the right answer, at all the right times and looks good in doing so.
Was right about eden vs brainbomb
Was right about xcution being scum before anyone was really thinking it
Was right about voting xcution before damo had even scanned there
Was right potentially about ghug being roleblocked and was first to react when haze claims. Which if scum, sweet would know is coming eventually and sets up sweet to be the first to posit the concept.


Argument 3
Sweet has not actually pushed anyone other than xcution this game, for any real reason. We have not seen any townreads or attempts to post a view of gamestate. Everything has always been the sweet vs xcution show up to this point.

I ... well ... could be ... it looks quite solid too.

when I think back about my first game as mafia, I was of the mindset of wanting to be correct (well it's kinda how I see everygame I play, I want to be correct, but being mafia gave me so much information that I could literally be correct and always voted mafia).

I said I've seen much from me in sweet, so maybe that is true for that too. I don't know though. Something inside tells me he isn't mafia. Maybe I've been pocketed but I don't think so. I give you though with this much, I at least begin to doubt if I'm not just giving sweet too much credit with what I see.

[brainbomb]

Kill: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. The target will be killed unless saved.
Watch: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. You will learn who visited the target.

Mafia uses spy on haze to see who haze uses his power on. and to provide ghug plausible deniability.

if watcher ability mafia knows who they haze watched and can be prepared.

if vig kill they can tell if haze shot or not. and verify he is really PR.

admittedly it is a poor use of power unless the goal is to give ghug plausible deniability.

[sweetandcool]

Okay, I want to get mechs straight so there is one place with all claims in it:

N1
1. Brain jailed N1 (unverified)
2. Propagandist Fox shortened day.
3. Navigator worcej scans Fox.
4. Captain Haze rb ghug.

N2
1. Enforcer Strongman Quartermaster Eden.
2. Priest damo tracks Spy Xcution to Haze.

N3
1. Haze shoots VT Bona.
2. worcej commutes damo.
3. damo Doctor worcej.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, please correct me if I got anything wrong, or forgot anything. Of course there might be a couple things that Town has done that hasn't been reported. Feel free to keep that information to yourself if you think it's better that way.

Damo should not be telling us what he did last night unless he knows he saved someone.

I thought I made it clear that I wasn't asking for any information that they might not want to give

I just wanted all action claims in one place. That being said, I'm realizing the last entry shouldn't be there since it is just worcej speculation. I will wait until I hear from at least one PR before I "edit" the list.

this (and the posts between) made me shiver, it ran down my back coldly (es lief mir kalt then Rücken runter, like goosebumps but much much more intense), this kinda felt like mafia trying to find out if they have to deal with a doc save next night or if they could savely choose their target.

If that would've come from anyone other then sweet, I think I would instantly mafread them for that. As for now, I think that sweet just didn't think it through, but really, really really really, don't do that ever again, this has no value for town, only for mafia.

I mean, I may be a bit hypocritical, since at the start of the day I was curious of a save too, but that's because we might've gained one more townclear. These "get the mech straight" posts however is something else.

I was just collating everything we knew. There is nothing wrong with that. I was having trouble keeping track of all claims, and several times other people have made statements directly contradicted by what we absolutely know as town.

Absolutely nothing wrong with my posts and I even made it clear that they shouldn't reveal info they don't want known.

[sweetandcool]

This is how I think each night went [I am omitting myself because all it does is give scum info and doesn't help town]

Night 1

Enforcer ghug jails worcej
Agent (Bunny is my guess) drives ??
Spy Role X cops/Tracks ??
Prop Fox shortens day

Nav worcej cps Fox
Capt Haze RBs ghug
QM Eden vote doubles Pyxxy

Pyxxy is Faction killed

Night 2

Enforcer strongmans Eden
Agents jails Kak
Spy RC/Tracks Haze

Nav jails Eden
Capt watches ?? [hasn't reported]

Night 3

Enforcer Ninjas me
Agent holsters

Nav commutes me
Capt kills Bona

I wasn't jailed in N2

also please don't forget that brain claimed being jailed N1

Case in point. My posts are helpful organizational tools.

[ghug]

Kill: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. The target will be killed unless saved.
Watch: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. You will learn who visited the target.

Mafia uses spy on haze to see who haze uses his power on. and to provide ghug plausible deniability.

if watcher ability mafia knows who they haze watched and can be prepared.

if vig kill they can tell if haze shot or not. and verify he is really PR.

admittedly it is a poor use of power unless the goal is to give ghug plausible deniability.

I only get plausible deniability if X gets caught doing it, though.

[brainbomb]

Kill: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. The target will be killed unless saved.
Watch: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. You will learn who visited the target.

Mafia uses spy on haze to see who haze uses his power on. and to provide ghug plausible deniability.

if watcher ability mafia knows who they haze watched and can be prepared.

if vig kill they can tell if haze shot or not. and verify he is really PR.

admittedly it is a poor use of power unless the goal is to give ghug plausible deniability.

I only get plausible deniability if X gets caught doing it, though.

this is true. and it pre-supposes alot of variables will all happen at once. maybe mafia just wants to know what haze power was used then on N2 and its also just to verify haze is truly a PR.

[sweetandcool]

Kill: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. The target will be killed unless saved.
Watch: choose a non-self target. You will visit them. You will learn who visited the target.

Mafia uses spy on haze to see who haze uses his power on. and to provide ghug plausible deniability.

if watcher ability mafia knows who they haze watched and can be prepared.

if vig kill they can tell if haze shot or not. and verify he is really PR.

admittedly it is a poor use of power unless the goal is to give ghug plausible deniability.

I only get plausible deniability if X gets caught doing it, though.

Exactly. I'm going to lean away from assuming Mafia has mystical powers of prediction and just knows they can setup deep scum ghug by visiting Haze with X

Believing this is just trying to justify an assumption that has been called into question

You believe ghug is Mafia, so you want to justify it no matter what

But if you let go of your bias, you will see that it is much more likely that ghug is town.

[peterlund]

I just uploaded and installed a patch for the search problem. I hope it fixes at least some of the problems you have had.

Thanks to Darg who notified me about the issue!

/Peter

I have a workaround for anyone having bot issues

if you go to mafia.peterlund.se and goto search among all messages

search by the player and then under pages if you say kakarroto and search pages 203-end it loads some of it. its cumbersome but you can do this for anyone and trial and error it does load some of the broken sections

[brainbomb]

So Haze visits ghug N1 and roleblocks
Damo sees xcution visit Haze
Xcution visits Haze to confirm what haze was talking about with all the softing stuff
Xcution gets caught in the act
ghug never admits to being roleblocked
ghug tries to roleswap with Haze
Haze claims

The part of this that makes little to no sense is that ghug roleswap with Haze would never work, since the people ghug is allegedly trying to fool would already know ghug isnt PR.

So, I fail to see how ghug claiming would do anything other than confuse town

[sweetandcool]

How about this:

If ghug is Mafia, you can all consider us the team you are searching for.


Now back off ghug and find a real suspect. ghug is very unlikely to be Mafia.

[Kakarroto]

Bonatogether
bozotheclown
brainbomb
BunnyGo
damo666
Dousing
Foxcastle
ghug
HaZe
Jamiet99uk
Kakarroto
President Eden
pyxxy
rdrivera2005
sweetandcool
worcej
Xcution


i need like 7 of the red names to become green names

Bonatogether[/
bozotheclown
brainbomb
BunnyGo
damo666
Dousing
Foxcastle
ghug
HaZe
Jamiet99uk
Kakarroto
President Eden
pyxxy
rdrivera2005
sweetandcool
worcej
Xcution


i need like 7 of the red names to become green names

You're welcome now you can play mafia.

just in case you aren't convinced by me AND ghug flips mafia: would mafGhug put his partners more likely into red or green?

Well I think it wont give us info about those who stayed green since he only changed eden (because of a joke) to red, but maybe it says something about his partners so before I forget I'll post it here for later. Then again if you don't believe me and ghug flips town, then this is unnecessary. But yeah, just in case.

[sweetandcool]

So Haze visits ghug N1 and roleblocks
Damo sees xcution visit Haze
Xcution visits Haze to confirm what haze was talking about with all the softing stuff
Xcution gets caught in the act
ghug never admits to being roleblocked
ghug tries to roleswap with Haze
Haze claims

The part of this that makes little to no sense is that ghug roleswap with Haze would never work, since the people ghug is allegedly trying to fool would already know ghug isnt PR.

So, I fail to see how ghug claiming would do anything other than confuse town

ghug screwed up, we can't all play perfect. ghug swiftly retracted their claim, so they did not end up confusing town. If ghug is Mafia, retracting makes less sense than forcing a thunderdome with Haze. And I think town opinion was against Haze to start with so ghug was likely to win that battle.

[Kakarroto]

So Haze visits ghug N1 and roleblocks
Damo sees xcution visit Haze
Xcution visits Haze to confirm what haze was talking about with all the softing stuff
Xcution gets caught in the act
ghug never admits to being roleblocked
ghug tries to roleswap with Haze
Haze claims

The part of this that makes little to no sense is that ghug roleswap with Haze would never work, since the people ghug is allegedly trying to fool would already know ghug isnt PR.

So, I fail to see how ghug claiming would do anything other than confuse town

well x never came to report what he saw, so why would they know that ghug isn't PR? They maybe question it but don't know for sure, right? That's why we endvoted x there, so he didn't give up any information about it, no?

[brainbomb]

We know X visited Haze that night and got seen doing so.

If haze used powers then mafia knew haze was a PR. And ghug should be aware that mafia visited Haze since thats the whole reason X got killed. So again, the fake claim would never confuse mafia in any scenario whatsoever.

[rdrivera2005]

I mind this less with brain because he already scumread me but if you're town you're playing like garbage and you're being so lazy about the whole thing. You hadn't put any real critical thought into why scum had had the weird N1 before this fell into your lap, and you don't even want to try to have a real day?

The point is: could we have a real day? You weren't my top scumread, that's for sure and I still think you have a chance to be town but you will be a wagon every day unless we catch two scum and win. Do you want to be around at end game? I won't on your place. I respect you won't just give up but yo

This said, I have been lazy, that's true and I won't deny, I didn't gave much thought about the mechanics because there is so many combinations of actions that I didn't want to go down this rabbit hole.

Talking about rabbit, I still think Bunny have a good chance to flip scum. More then Kak. I have been scum with Kak not many time ago and I don't see the same scum behavior.

I think ghug just has to go. It may just be an unfortunate coincidence that Haze RBd ghug N1 and Mafia didn't jail worcej but ....

As far as I know it was only ghug who sussed Haze as Capt N2 and X visits Haze N2. Another coincidence?

Too much.

Ghug cannot be Agent as e would have probably taken Haze out so he must be Enforcer. But then why did the Agent not bomb Haze? Because ghug would be sole surviving scum with a link to the dead Captain so they couldn't afford to do it.

##vote ghug

if ghug can only be the enforcer, and we don't know for sure he is, we don't NEED to get him today. As stated I doubt ghug is mafia here, I mean sure, the possibility is here, but from what I've seen I still see ghug as vanilla town that tried to be useful to a PR

but yeah, as said, we should probably not forget this possibility, but try to get the other mafia, the one with a bomb! From the cases made against me, jamie presented mostly the negatives and bunny had, as far as I've seen, tried to twist a thing that he didn't quote; these two things made me suspicious. I could see tunneling townJamie just refering what is in his eyes evidence for me being mafia, but the possibility that bunny intentionally NOT quoted the part where there is a big difference in what I posted and how he presented it is quite there.

@RD if you think bunny is mafia, you should change it because even if ghug is mafia, he is only enforcer and we can't do much in the next phases. If he is town, you'd also vote for a read of yours that you are confident instead of someone that just had bad luck.

@damo I think you should vote, instead of ghug, also for your highest maf-read, because the bomber is more important than the enforcer now, right? Or do I have something overlooked that makes me wrong in my logic?

Your argument makes no sense. If Ghug is Enforcer there is zero chance the Bomber will use his power as iy will be game over for scum as Ghug will be flipped at some point. Last time we did this we just gave Eden another day to screw with town.

The best argument to not vote Ghug out today is having a regular day and get info through votes and reads.

But let's give it a try. ##vote Bunny

[brainbomb]

wait, what do you mean X never came to report what he saw? he couldnt report anything anyway. Theres no daychat and unless using a code he isnt gonna come out and the thread and be like I saw Haze kissing sandy claws

[ghug]

So Haze visits ghug N1 and roleblocks
Damo sees xcution visit Haze
Xcution visits Haze to confirm what haze was talking about with all the softing stuff
Xcution gets caught in the act
ghug never admits to being roleblocked
ghug tries to roleswap with Haze
Haze claims

The part of this that makes little to no sense is that ghug roleswap with Haze would never work, since the people ghug is allegedly trying to fool would already know ghug isnt PR.

So, I fail to see how ghug claiming would do anything other than confuse town

I thought there was a chance X had failed to communicate back, or that he'd tracked and not gotten info. It was also just poorly thought through, but I got excited when it looked like Haze shot bona after I'd said I'd shoot bona.

[sweetandcool]

So Haze visits ghug N1 and roleblocks
Damo sees xcution visit Haze
Xcution visits Haze to confirm what haze was talking about with all the softing stuff
Xcution gets caught in the act
ghug never admits to being roleblocked
ghug tries to roleswap with Haze
Haze claims

The part of this that makes little to no sense is that ghug roleswap with Haze would never work, since the people ghug is allegedly trying to fool would already know ghug isnt PR.

So, I fail to see how ghug claiming would do anything other than confuse town

well x never came to report what he saw, so why would they know that ghug isn't PR? They maybe question it but don't know for sure, right? That's why we endvoted x there, so he didn't give up any information about it, no?

Hmmm, that is true, X never got a chance to report to Mafia chat. And ending took away an opportunity for them to decide to blurt out their result. ghug is savvy enough to have thought of this. Or ghug simply messed up. Either way, I don't think ghug's temporary Captain claim makes me think of them better or worse.