Finished: 05 PM Tue 08 Dec 20 UTC
Mid-tier gunboat at an affordable price-19
1 day /phase
Pot: 84 D - Autumn, 1909, Finished
Classic, No messaging, Anonymous players, Draw-Size Scoring, Hidden draw votes
1 excused missed turn
Game won by Balki Bartokomous (5561 D (G))
08 Dec 20 UTC GG All. I thought we still had a chance to stop the solo at the end there, but we couldn’t all get on the same page. Well played Germany.
08 Dec 20 UTC Thanks guys. Good game.
08 Dec 20 UTC Tough to stop a solo with so many people who can’t communicate.
08 Dec 20 UTC GGs. Some thoughts.

I took a risk that did not pay off by attacking Austria. I hoped that I could (with Turkey's help) eliminate them, or at least get enough builds from them to reinforce France before Germany's fleets swung around the isle. On top of this, I did not trust Austria, based on their lack of ambition (mostly just support holding in place) during the game, to be able to hold a stalemate line.

This failed because 1. England stopped playing the game, 2. Russia's move to the Black Sea forced Turkey to retreat and defend their home, slowing their attack on Serbia, and 3. I should not have moved to ION in A06, as I was then too late to help blockage MAO. I also could have guessed better in a few army battles in Austria.

@Germany, well played. Good move to GAL at the end there.

@England, if you don't have the stamina to play an entire game of diplomacy, either don't join public games or email the mods asking to be replaced. You ruin the fun when you just throw because you're not interested any more.

@Austria, speaking of throwing, if you don't attack me on the last turn, we don't all lose. I think it's perfectly reasonable if you were mad at me for attacking you, but it was obvious in the spring of this year 1909 that I was committed (as we all needed to be) to stopping the solo.

I've just checked your profile and you've only played 7 gunboats, are you new to gunboats? I noticed from your moves that you were hesitant to do anything most of the game, and that's why I tried to kill you off, because I figured that I couldn't trust you to defend the stalemate line (once it was obvious that Germany was heading towards a solo). Unfortunately it turns out that I was correct not to trust you, but I'm happy to teach you/give you resources to learn more about the strategy of gunboat?

@Turkey, I knew you were a good player after you moved to ALB in S04. It was good working with you.

@Russia, building another fleet after Austria tries to steal Rumania from you was....interesting. Kinda screwed your whole game up, not much you could do tbh. Perhaps it was a mis-click?

@France, you did what you could. I disagree with the army Marseilles build in W04, but I get the general gist of why you did it. But seeing that England double afk'd at that point, you got stuck with the icky job of defending against all of Germany's fleets. Might have been better to ignore defending Paris in the long term, since it's your only land-locked center, and focus on delaying the naval advance for as long as possible. This is really a minor complaint though, realistically other people let you down this game by not preventing the solo.
08 Dec 20 UTC @Germany, good game and great finishing.

@Italy, I didn't really expect England to fall apart that soon, really painful just struggling to fight back my building SC. Must say you are right about that army build in Marseilles in W04 is the critical step for not able to defend German fleet in mid-late game.
08 Dec 20 UTC Shut up Italy. If you hadn't spent the previous 5 turns attacking me instead of Germany then we all wouldn't have lost is just as valid an argument.
08 Dec 20 UTC Come on now. Let’s not sour the fun. While I understand the initial reaction to criticism (it’s human nature), there’s no need to get hostile. While the feedback Italy has given was critical of Austrian play, it was not disrespectful. Feedback is how we learn and grow. I remember getting hit really hard with criticism in a game a few months back. My initially reaction was to get defensive. But I came back to the message a day or so later, and guess what... my opponent was right. I embraced the criticism, opened up further dialogue, and learned a ton. Negative feedback sucks, but it really is the best kind if you’re resilient enough to absorb it. Also, even if you don’t agree, you need to understand how other players see the board, especially in Gunboat.
08 Dec 20 UTC Ty Turkey.

@Austria, like I said, you're allowed to be mad. But you don't have an argument unless you present evidence, you just have an opinion. Do you disagree with any of the points that I listed?

"instead of Germany", well, Russia was doomed by A06, Germany held Munich and had 3 armies around it and was going to build another in there in the winter, and the unresolved part of the stalemate line was in the west where fleets mattered the most. So continuing to attack Germany was just a waste of those armies when I need fleets (from your centers).

Also, let's not forget you sent your fleet to VEN in S01. Kinda destroyed my trust in you at the beginning of the game, combined with all the support holding you did...that's why I asked if you were new at gunboat. Nothing wrong with being new, and my style of AAR is probably not helpful if you're new, and I'll adjust to be more helpful if that's the case. If you want help. You're also allowed to opt out of my rambling nonsense.

Anyway. My point about how I needed your centers to build fleets to hold the line against the German fleets...Turkey did an excellent job coordinating to attempt to hold the line, but in gunboat, it's much riskier to rely on two people coordinating than just using my own fleets to hold the line. I thought it was worth the risk and I listed why it backfired.

And I will reiterate. Regardless of those 5 turns, you saw what I was doing in this last spring, and you still actively decided to throw the game for everyone by attacking me. Turkey clearly wasn't trying to eliminate you any more. I left TRI wide open, so it was obvious that I was trying to defend at this point and that I knew you were more valuable alive than dead.

You *still* decided to attack me, and if you look at the moves that were entered, if you don't cut BUD, we don't lose. If you literally just hold in place, we don't all lose.

I'm not even saying you have to make the clever play of realizing that I must move VEN to TRI and supporting me there with Albania. That takes a certain level of recognition. I'm literally saying if you do what you did all game and just support hold your own units, we probably would have gotten the draw. Sorry that this sounds harsh, I am not trying to be disrespectful, but I understand that I'm writing all this without asking first if you wanted constructive criticism. I'll stop if you don't want any more, and I apologize for not asking in the first place, and for giving in to my tendency to ramble.
08 Dec 20 UTC Just want to say that I appreciate the discussion here. After a game of no communication, I think there is a lot of value in talking through what we were all thinking, in order to better understand each other next time.

I'll say, for my part, I was a little surprised and happy to see Italy attack Austria in Spring '06, and I'm not surprised that lead to the final breakthrough to 18. At that time, you guys really needed all hands on deck. And, Italy, you didn't just attack Austria, you moved your fleets towards Austria and away from me. There is a bit of signaling required to rally a group to stop a solo. And I think you were sending a dangerous signal, with Germany on 12 an encircling France.

I also want to say -- too bad about the English NMRs. That obviously played a role in this outcome, and I wish it didn't come down to that.
08 Dec 20 UTC "sending a dangerous signal"
That's true. My hope was to signal to Turkey that we still have time to remove Austria, which would also give Turkey more units to secure SEV.
08 Dec 20 UTC I'm not mad dude. It's a game. It's why I enjoy gunboat so I don't have to listen to peeps like you :)

But you seriously F*ed up by devoting 3 years trying to wipe me out rather than deal with Germany who had 2/3's of the required solo SC's. That you're pompous and self righteous enough to then blame me for you screwing up is laughable and pathetic. GG dude. Way to throw it.
08 Dec 20 UTC XD

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Germany
Won. Bet: 12 D, won: 84 D
18 supply-centers, 13 units
Italy
pyxxy (1013 D (G))
Survived. Bet: 12 D
5 supply-centers, 6 units
Turkey
Bam47 (909 D)
Survived. Bet: 12 D
5 supply-centers, 5 units
Austria
FreedomPanda (100 D)
Survived. Bet: 12 D
4 supply-centers, 3 units
France
wansiuhay (1401 D)
Survived. Bet: 12 D
2 supply-centers, 3 units
England
danikine74 (167 D)
Defeated. Bet: 12 D
Russia
FxFocus (8 D)
Defeated. Bet: 12 D
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