Sign up for the 2019 WebDiplomacy Mentor Project as a mentor or a mentee here.

Forum
A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
Page 318 of 412
FirstPreviousNextLast
MKECharlie (1926 D (G))
14 Jun 16 UTC
Fencing: What is your favorite weapon, and why?
Also, if you're American, did you vote in the recent USFA election? Do you think it'll have any affect on the tournament selection process in the New Jersey division?
6 replies
Open
JEccles (425 D)
14 Jun 16 UTC
New Classic Game
Just started this up. 50 point buy in, anon, 1 day phases.

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=180213
0 replies
Open
c0dyz (100 D)
14 Jun 16 UTC
Farewell
Farewell kind folk. Summer approaches and my school friends and I will depart from the merry making until next year.
3 replies
Open
principians (881 D)
07 Jun 16 UTC
There are muslim creationists too
An I found very funny that they deny the big bang too https://www.scienceislam.com/pdf/Big_Bang.pdf
65 replies
Open
Jamiet99uk (35 D)
11 Jun 16 UTC
Sanders voters disenfranchied in California
Anyone in the US know how accurate this report is?

http://www.gregpalast.com/california-stolen-sanders-right-nowspecial-bulletin-greg-palast/
18 replies
Open
rm63 (100 D)
06 Jun 16 UTC
New World War I team game - played as 2 teams. Starting soon!
I've been wanting to do this for a long time. I'm not sure if it's been done before. Apologies if it's already been done. I've created a game called "WWI team game" and the idea is that we will recreate world war one by playing the game as 2 teams; the triple alliance consisting of Austria, Germany and turkey and the triple entente consisting of England, France and Russia.
31 replies
Open
brainbomb (474 D)
12 Jun 16 UTC
College World Series
Starts June 18th. Definetely as far as atmosphere it is among the finest sports events in the country every year. And its right here in Omaha.
3 replies
Open
ssorenn (3227 D (G))
09 Jun 16 UTC
3 game gunboat tourney
post here or PM me if interested
22 replies
Open
SLOTerp (100 D)
11 Jun 16 UTC
NWO: Mushroom clouds forecasted in coming year.
The NWO game at Redscape is about to get a bit radioactive. If you haven't seen or played this massive variant, take a look. The GM and a few players put out some high quality press as well.
http://www.redscape.com/viewforum.php?f=141
0 replies
Open
Musoeun (133 D)
10 Jun 16 UTC
(Poll) How Many Draws Equal a Solo
I'm working on a project (may submit it to a zine, may just be for my own amusement) and I'm trying to find out what various Diplomacy communities view as the relationship in accomplishment between draws and solo victories.
20 replies
Open
Hamilton Brian (732 D (B))
09 Jun 16 UTC
Revisiting the Key Lepanto that works
I want to see a game where it actually worked.
17 replies
Open
brainbomb (474 D)
07 Jun 16 UTC
Stanford Rapist
Ok can someone who understands law explain to me how this guy got off so easy?
Page 2 of 2
FirstPreviousNextLast
 
Octavious (1717 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
I know exactly what I'd want to happen. What you'd want to happen is something more of a mystery as you seem to have condemned everything the judge could feasibly do as utterly unacceptable.

The US prison system needs reform, certainly, but that is no more the judge's responsibility as it is yours. I have seen nothing credible that points to classism or misogyny from the judge, and nothing whatsoever that so much as hints at racism.
steephie22 (182 D (S))
08 Jun 16 UTC
The point I believe ora is trying to make is that the judge reasons that putting this guy in prison for too long would destroy a bright future he still has. He still has that bright future because he is white and privileged, so he believes the judge would've been harder if it was a poor black guy who probably ends up in jail anyway because how else he's going to survive with his shit future.

It's a fair amount of assumptions if I got that reasoning correct.
Octavious (1717 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
A fair amount of assumptions? To sum it up ora reasons that the judge is racist based on the assumption that the judge is racist.
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
He had a bright future because he was a star athlete at one of the top academic universities in the world. No doubt that he got there at least in part because of privilege, but the simple fact that he was an athlete at Stanford in itself had nothing to do with privilege.

I say "had" so much because none of these things are going to be true anymore, which, for whatever reason, the judge didn't seem to understand. He's still going to prison, as he should, and he's still being registered as a sex offender for life, as he should. He's got just as much a shot in life as the next lifelong sex offender, which is to say very, very little.
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
Realistically, his case should have gone down the same road as Corey Batey's. Of all the different types of bias one can point to, though, Judge Persky having been a pampered athlete at Stanford has a lot more to do with his judgment than race or Turner's privilege. The judge saw his own college life and ruled as if it was just a childish mistake, as if rape is a mistake that everyone in college has made.
Octavious (1717 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
You all have remarkable insights into the judge's decision making process, I have to say. Damned impressive stuff. I struggle with trying to work out even the most basic decision making processes of a diplomacy player when playing diplomacy, and that's despite the advantage of being a diplomacy player myself. You must all be super geniuses or something!
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
The judge said he believed an extended prison stay would be "too severe" for Turner. It's not that hard to figure out what that means. Maybe it's not that we're all super geniuses but that you're ... no, I'll stop myself. I'll stop myself.
Octavious (1717 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
Simple question, bo, do you believe that a long prison sentence would have provided an overall positive impact to this situation?
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
Yes, rapists deserve long prison sentences.
Octavious (1717 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
Golly. Never had you down as a "prison works" kinda guy
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
Prison doesn't work for non-violent offenders like drug dealers. It works quite well for rapists. That whole "drop the soap" joke had to come from somewhere.
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
Meant to say drug users, not dealers, but you get the idea.
orathaic (1009 D (B))
09 Jun 16 UTC
I do not need to know anything about judge to claim that sustematic racism and classism exists. I am not claiming this judge consciously made a decision to be softer on this rapist than any other rapist. I am claiming that in general black / poor rapists will serve longer prison sentences.

That is likely rooted in racism.


As for the charge of misogyny, there is a horrible counter example, when the colonge sexual assault appeared around new year's there was a huge media outrage. It is arguable that this should always be the case. That it was great to see women being protected for once, except the target migrants were clearly being unfairly discriminated against based on their race.

The idea that white men are entitled to sex with women, and only they may have sex with white women - that is misogynistic. And if the media holds this view, either consciously or unconsciously, you would expect great outrage when non-white people start groping white women. And no media outrage when a white boy rapes someone - except outrage at the white boy 'having his life ruined' when he was doing something he was entitled to do.

Regardless of stated intent, if that is the behaviour you see, then that is misogynistic.

Again, I am merely describing what i see, not telling you what should be.
Octavious (1717 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
I see. So, to summarize, there's nothing this judge could have actually done that wouldn't look like racism and misogyny to you. He is guilty of it by virtue of being a judge.
thorfi (1023 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
FYI here's the Stanford Law Professor leading the "recall that judge" campaign, on the subject of that particularly crappy sentence, with an extra side serve of "yeah, I'm *from* that university, we don't handle these situations well" to boot.

http://www.democracynow.org/2016/6/8/meet_the_law_professor_leading_a

"MICHELE LANDIS DAUBER: Well, Turner was found guilty, beyond a reasonable doubt, by a jury for three felony sex crimes—two counts of sexual penetration of an intoxicated or incapacitated person, and one count of assault with intent to commit rape. And that’s a very serious charge that has a minimum, as you said, two-year sentence, and is presumptively not eligible for probation or a jail, you know, stay less than that two years; however, the judge really bent over backwards in order to give this defendant a very light sentence."
thorfi (1023 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
And we can argue about sentencing in general, sure, I'm personally fond of a more restorative justice model, but am I so not going to bother arguing about that here.

Nor is it particularly relevant to whether the sentence in this particular case was lighter than it should have been given the existing nature of how sentencing is supposed to go for these types of cases.
orathaic (1009 D (B))
09 Jun 16 UTC
^


Also, Octavious, well done, you deserve an award for not getting it.
Octavious (1717 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+3)
What is there to get? You have developed a belief system in which every possible scenario is twisted to support that belief. It's like talking to a born again Christian. Wife gets cancer, proof of God. Wife's cured of cancer, proof of God. Sun rises in the morning, proof of God.

steephie22 (182 D (S))
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
@ora: The problem is you're getting everything from the comfort of your home. That's bullshit. You make assumptions. And not just one or two either.

If you're against racism so much, perhaps look at this case without considering skin colour for a few seconds? Maybe consider some other facts, as well?
steephie22 (182 D (S))
09 Jun 16 UTC
I guess what I'm saying is the same as what Octavious is saying in different words: there are lots of blanks to fill and you fill them in the most racist way because nothing else could possibly make sense.

We got your point. Perpetrator is white and perpetrator got a light sentence. Noted. If you want to 'prove' racism, the next step would be for you to figure out any other factors that might play a role and try your best to find out they did. If you fail every time and are unable to find any other possibility, then congratulations. You've proved racism.
Until then, you're just imposing your world view on us.

Keep in mind that this victim does not remember. It's really hard to figure out what actually happened beyond a reasonable doubt and what could genuinely be argued as looking much worse than it is.
You can't charge someone based on appearances. It's the very same assumptive behaviour that you love to use which must not ever be used by a judge.

All I know is that I would not want to be the judge of this.
orathaic (1009 D (B))
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
"If you want to 'prove' racism" - i don't need to prove racism.

It exists, it permeates society. Do you deny this?

It is pretty simple, there are many truths or narratives. Many lenses/angles which you can examine the situation from.

The question Brainbomb asked was 'why did he get off so easy' - well you can look at the judges explanation - and take it as face value. Prison is a shit system for reforming people.

That is true. But you wouldn't ask the Russian Federation why it deployed troops to the Ukrainian border and then take it at face value. You would also analyse the circumstances of the geopolitics.

I can never know the reasoning behind the Judges decision, or the Russian Federation's actions in Ukraine. I can only know their justification. Their propaganda. And that is useful - it provides a picture of what they want people to think. One narrative. One angle. The lense of Russian Propaganda. Or the lense of a white, male, educated, privileged Judge.

You can look at it in terms of class, race, gender, or generally social status. And each will tell a different story. Each an incomplete truth.

I've done enough to tell these stories. No matter what you add, there will be people who don't believe a narrative because it threatens their position in the social dominance hierarchy. It makes them feel uncomfortable with their own privilege. And they jump to attacking that narrative.

It is a rather clear psychological fact. People will defend a position regardless of evidence. it is very hard to change a conservative or liberal's mind about any given topic once it is set. So i'm not going to jump through hops to prove that these narratives illuminate any truth.

If you don't want to examine your own beliefs, i can't make you.

If you deny racism/class-ism/misogyny exists and are problems, then you're blind or lacking in empathy. I will not try to prove that while your psychology protects your ego.
thorfi (1023 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+3)
@steephie22: You might want to note that a jury of twelve people had no trouble determining beyond reasonable doubt exactly what occurred, based on the rather solid evidence provided. Nobody was charged based on appearances, other than the appearances of *what actually happened*. What happened is not at all in reasonable doubt.

The *sentencing* is what is at question here. And for that, you can go look at the words of someone with actually relevant professional opinion, i.e. the Stanford Law Professor in question I linked above. And she is a *long* way from the only person with relevant professional opinion who says that the sentence was stupidly light on because the judge chose to weight the fact that, essentially, the rapist went to Stanford and was good at sports as unusual mitigating circumstances to the normal minimum sentence. And that's just the reasons he specifically put in his judgement statement.
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
09 Jun 16 UTC
While it's more than fair to criticize the judge, this is also an opportunity to point out that Turner is going to get more jail time than over 95% of rapists. That's not to say that it could be worse, which, while true, is just stupid to point out, but rather to say that there are a hell of a lot more rapists that need jail time than currently get. It's refreshing to see that someone like Turner's father is on the losing end of this battle.
Lethologica (203 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
@Oct: What grounds would ora and co. have to talk about how identity politics influenced the sentencing if the judge hasn't gone out of his way to minimize the sentence? I don't buy this "you guys would have called it racist no matter what" narrative when the answer to "what *wouldn't* be racist to you guys?" is so obvious.
KingCyrus (512 D)
10 Jun 16 UTC
@ ora,

Perhaps I'm misreading you, but it sounds like you are seeing a large amount of people defending Turner's light sentencing. Personally, I've seen absolutely otherwise. No one that I personally know or hear on the street has in any way defended this light sentencing.

As to the racism element, while that certainly *may* be the answer, and seems more likely than most, it is certainly not the only answer. My gut reaction to what may have been the cause was the athlete-worship that seems to permeate our (the US's) colleges and high schools. Would a similar light charge been given if this was a star, black swimmer/football/baseball/etc. player? I don't know, but something tells me it would have. Which is just as wrong as it being a matter of race.
KingCyrus (512 D)
10 Jun 16 UTC
Also, an interesting opinion piece I read, any thoughts?

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2016/06/the_stanford_rape_case_and_liberal_hypocrisy.html

I thought it was interesting not because of the right/left differentiation or calling out so much as the concept of emotional appeals in court.
orathaic (1009 D (B))
10 Jun 16 UTC
@KC, thanks for adding that perspective, the pro-sportsman angle is one i hadn't really seen. And i don't think it is totally one thing or another, life is complicated, so adding another dimension is interesting.
orathaic (1009 D (B))
10 Jun 16 UTC
The concept of emotional appeals in court does seem odd to me.

I would have assumed that the logical/rational decision making was done when the jury finished their deliberations, and that emotional appeal would be important when it came to sentencing.

So if the victim said they were not majorly inpacted the judge could happily hand down a light sentence without fear of public outcry. But this is not something i've read much on up until now.
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
10 Jun 16 UTC
Sentencing hearings are all emotional. The trial is done and the facts have been laid. It's a last ditch effort on both sides to try to tug at the heart strings (judges have feelings, surprisingly).
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
10 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
Soooooo the judge gave him a light sentence in part to help his swimming career, and he has now officially been banned for life by USA Swimming. Why does an Olympic swimming team have more sense of moral and legal rationality than a trained and fully certified judge?


60 replies
VirtualBob (242 D)
09 Jun 16 UTC
Ghost Forecast?
Just wondering.
5 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
10 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
Pet Peeves
It's pouring, the parking lot is flooding, and they just turned on the sprinklers for irrigation.
7 replies
Open
Bob the Lord (292 D)
08 Jun 16 UTC
Looking through some old games...
and I noticed that there was some feature called "All survivors win" from a game in 2010, why doesn't that exist anymore, why are there no units, and what are the rules?
3 replies
Open
CommanderByron (869 D (S))
09 Jun 16 UTC
quality game
gameID=179917

PM for PW
7 replies
Open
Gen. Lee (7688 D (B))
27 May 16 UTC
Gen. Lee to host 2016 Confederate Grand Ball
Invitation inside.
22 replies
Open
Bob the Lord (292 D)
07 Jun 16 UTC
I know I did this before...
and that this is a forum on a webdiplomacy site that is meant for people to talk about random non-diplomacy based things, but what's everyone's favourite country?
21 replies
Open
bo_sox48 (4844 D Mod (G))
08 Jun 16 UTC
Mel Carnahan 2016
They did it once, we can do it again!

#StillWithMel #RatherVoteForTheDeadGuy
0 replies
Open
pauldocument (0 D X)
08 Jun 16 UTC
Buy real and fake Passport ,Visa,Driving License,ID
Guaranteed 24 hour passport,citizenship,Id cards,driver´s
license,diplomas,degrees,certificates service available. Tourist and
business visa services available to residents of all 50 states and all
nationalities Worldwide.Contact .pauldocument508@gmail.com.
1 reply
Open
peterlund (1310 D (G))
05 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
Likes and Liked question
On my profile it says "Likes: 1 / Liked: 29" but I do not know what that means. I did not find anything about it in the help/FAQ pages either. How does it work? How do I like another account?
4 replies
Open
Bertson95 (119 D)
03 Jun 16 UTC
Any suggests for a new player?
I've plaied something like 10 games and i'm not sure my way of playing is good.

Any suggests for improving?
8 replies
Open
Jamiet99uk (35 D)
07 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
Daily Bible Verses
Look, buddy - this is the word of the Lord.

http://the-toast.net/2016/06/06/bible-verses-where-behold-has-been-replaced-with-look-buddy/
0 replies
Open
SantaClausowitz (360 D)
07 Jun 16 UTC
(+1)
Remember that story about the Ukranian pilot that downed MH-17?
Refresher
https://www.rt.com/news/217295-mh17-ukraine-military-plane/
https://www.rt.com/news/216871-ukraine-military-mh17-report/
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/25/mh17-russia-claims-to-have-airfield-witness-who-blames-ukrainian-pilot
3 replies
Open
peterlund (1310 D (G))
04 Jun 16 UTC
(+3)
Gordon Brown "Lead not leave"
An excellent and important statement for civilisation:
https://youtu.be/gPX9MLALjAE
9 replies
Open
Al Swearengen (0 D X)
30 May 16 UTC
(+1)
The Truth about Matthew Shepard
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/26/the-truth-behind-americas-most-famous-gay-hate-murder-matthew-shepard
11 replies
Open
Valis2501 (2057 D (G))
11 Mar 16 UTC
(+2)
The 2016 Local Tournament - Round 2
The full ruleset is available here: https://tinyurl.com/webDip2016local-rules
111 replies
Open
Smokey Gem (184 D)
03 Jun 16 UTC
Dumb Questions
How do you get the game ID number ??
21 replies
Open
Tolstoy (1958 D)
04 Jun 16 UTC
(+2)
The Death of a Real Legend
Muhammad Ali, Greatest Heavyweight Boxer Ever, Civil Rights Activist, Draft Resistor, and America's Most Famous Muslim, dead at 74.
14 replies
Open
lucas100 (0 D X)
05 Jun 16 UTC
Buy fake and real passport,drivers license,id card
Buy Passport(documenthome1980@gmail.com)Drivers License,Id Card,Visa,Diploma,SSN,BC. Buy IELTS, IDP TOEFL, GMAT, ESOL, DEGREE, DIPLOMAS, BIRTH CERTIFICATE. Contact Email: (nicolasdranny@gmail.com)General Support (documenthome1980@gmail.com)
0 replies
Open
Page 318 of 412
FirstPreviousNextLast
Back to top