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It doesnt matter what power you are, France always needs to die, and is always best served to die first.
Thoughts?

In Classic?

But It is not true. If I am france, not France is the one who have to die first. So it is absolutely depends on which power am I.

FlaviusAetius wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:15 am

It doesnt matter what power you are, France always needs to die, and is always best served to die first.
Thoughts?

Biggest load of crap I've read for a while, which is quite an achievement in just the one sentence

haha, I meant every other power silly :p
I will explain my theory deeper;
(GUIDING PRINCIPAL; IF YOU DO NOT ATTACK FRANCE, FRANCE GOES INTO BIG BLUE BLOB)
Italy Germany and England all border France.


Italy
Going east can get messy...reallll messy. You get involved in a much larger game of England, Germany and Russia, a much smaller game of Austria, Russia and Turkey.
Russia Austria and Turkey, these free, destined to deadlock each other, yet three powers can unlock this deadlock. You are one of them, why unlock it, one that will last for years? You are clearly going to be the next person to be attacked, even if you do unlock it, and is that an easy empire to defend?
If you attack Austria to unlock it, Russia and Turkey are ready to destroy you.
If you attack Turkey to unlock it, Austria and Russia are ready to destroy you.
And do remember France is always in the background!

Oh and remember, you become friends with Austria, Russia and Turkey all during this, so after you take out France, you get to play kingmaker on the East and West!!

Attack France, he cant defend against you, if you time it right, he's simply hopeless...unless you are a lone(hint; never be a lone)

Germany
France will always be your enemy, no matter what you do, you both need each other to get that solo, to be in that draw, you need to kill each other. There is no ands ifs or buts about it.
You two are natural enemies anyways,you both want Belgium, so go Burgundy, distract France, put pressure on the man, you have an ally to the south
Whats better than early cooperation?
If you hold off against France, an enemy from the South or the East will appear, maybe even the North, you are in a ticking time bomb situation, and you need to act and act fast, lest you lose it all real quick, real fast.
The gains are great, the risks are minimal, push forward and reap the rewards, you must be the leader of the alliance to kill France!

Besides, if you don't take him down now...he will take you down later, while you are stalled out figuring out whats your left and whats your right!

England
Ah France, the frenemy throughout history
But this is Diplomacy! You have no colonies to go too!!
You have two options to expand, south or north.
North you get blockaded by Russia, unless you have German help, if you have Germany help, and if Turkey can do some things in the South, by then you have barely any supply centers, with barely anywheres to expand too
France? Expanded across the continent, destroyed Germany, and you? Nothing.
Or is it Germany who steamrolled France, possibly with Italy on his side, and you? Nothing.
Maybe you negotiated with France though, you got some northern Germany provinces... now you are desperately trying to convince a man with all his armies right up on your border, with all those juicy juicy sweet SC's, to attack the killer of all solos; Italy.
Good luck with that one!

Russia
England will always be your enemy, so why not direct them somewheres else? Let them go after France, you enjoy your easy pickings down south, break that deadlock play fun with Turkey, or with Austria, whoever it does not matter,
France needs to die, if he lives, England gets uneasy, England wants those SC's
England will always come for you.
If France dies, you stall, and you have a friend to the West; ol' Germany
You even have Italy to the South!
Russia needs time, and time can be granted when France dies, kill France
Oh and must I say, the person who stops the Russian solo? Always France my friend, always France.

Turkey
Oh the Turks, interesting people to say the least(give us our land back-from a greek)
Anyways!
Don't you hate it when Italy attacks you! So annoying amiright? It catches you off guard, breaks your literally only quality; the turtle
Encourage those plebs to take out France, you cant afford another medditerenean power, on the far West. You can afford though, a friendly Italy, maybe after France dies, he stabs Austria in the back? Who else would he attack?
Sure an English attack to Russia helps you a ton! But it also helps Austria a ton!
Why roll the dice? Team up with Russia, steamroll Austria, team up with Austria, steamroll with Russia.
Encourage those plebs to kill France!!

Last but not least, our glass cannon;
Austria
Personally my favourite power to play, so dynamic!
If Italy attacks France...
He doesnt attack you! Nice!
If England attacks France...
Russia focuses south...He focuses on Turkey, Nice!
You can play kingermaker between the two
Besides if you have any chance of winning, you need to not get backstabbed by the only power who can backstab you; Italy.
With a friendly Italy, you can even ask for the use of his fleets, while he has a spare(he will)
Also Italy probably won't want to go East! He already has all his troops in the West, why not continue the stampede? Oh no! He's close to a solo!
Do not fear my friend, you are right by him with plenty of troops to take him down, gogogoogo!!
A living France, means an Italy forced East, not good for you!
A living France, forces an England French clash, meaning Russia free now and always, not good for you!
Kill France

France
You can be picked apart so quickly, why we even try anymores?
If you dont get fools on your side, you simply die!
Defend you might, at night you try to fight, but in the end, there will only be fright!

So in essence!
If you kill France, its basically a positive for everyone, including France, since they get the added benefit of not wasting time fighting for a position that in theory at least should ultimately fail!

Then...

It doesnt matter what power you are (except if you are Russia , Russia always needs to die, and is always best served to die first.
Thoughts?

False, if Russia dies some powers benefit some powers do not for example;
Austria gets into a big fight with Turkey and in a really weak posistion
For example;
France needs Russia (not in reverse btw) to keep England distracted, if he doesnt then France dies(he needs at least one border nation to be his buddy)
For example;
Italy wants a breathing Russia so he can do his thing and then Russia gets zero SC's and he reaps all the rewards
For example;
Germany wants Russia a live to do the distraction with England thing, so he and Italy can kill France

AS A NOTE;
It is best for Germany and Italy to kill France, WITHOUT English involvement in support or against France.
It is best for ENGLAND though to kill France WITH Germany and Italy
and ALTHOUGH it is not AS good to kill France with England, Germany and Italy, for Germany and Italy, its still more beneficial, than NOT doing it

If France dies some powers benefit some powers do not for example;
Austria gets into a big fight with Germany and or Italy and in a really weak posistion
For example;

A Germany+France
versus a
England+Italy
as stated above is not a good idea in long or short term

qrzy wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:05 pm

If France dies some powers benefit some powers do not for example;
Austria gets into a big fight with Germany and or Italy and in a really weak posistion
For example;

Germany will be distracted with Italy killing or English killing
Austria by the time France is taken out, gets probably already owns a bunch of stuff, if not they were going to die anyways
Italy will have all his troops in the West, why convoy them all over to deal with a dude who is probably in a deadlock? Just keep pushing, dont waste time

Anything you write down, maybe will be true from a viewpoint, but I just have to replace the country name, and will be true from an other viewpoint.

yea im trying to say no matter what viewpoint your looking at, killing france is positive for you

"im trying to say no matter what viewpoint your looking at, killing ".$country name." is positive for you"

yep, I just explained thats actually not true

Yes it is.

I think it's in the best interests of England and Germany to kill France, and in Italy's best interest to join in if one of those two tries - Italy will usually benefit tremendously (Mar, Spain, Por) usually for just committing two units.

If Italy takes POR-SPA-MAR, though, it may or may not be to England's benefit to take out France, depending on the situation in Scandinavia and with Russia. RIght?

Doug7878 wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:50 pm

If Italy takes POR-SPA-MAR, though, it may or may not be to England's benefit to take out France, depending on the situation in Scandinavia and with Russia. RIght?

The theory is that if you dont focus on Russia, Russia wont focus on you, and by not focusing on Russia Austria and Turkey are focused with Russia on that area, and so he's incentivized to actually not focus on you